For people who complain about NOED or DS.
Can you please give me a good rework idea for it then? Since they both counter 'toxic' (although most effective in my eyes) playstyles. DS counters Tunnelling, and NOED counters Genrushing.
I see way too many people complaining about them, but instead of complaining, try to offer up a good rework idea. This isn't a rant, I genuinely want to see what people have in mind for a nerf/rework.
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NOED is about to become a lot more common >:3
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DS: Deactivates when you've been fully healed, started working on a gen or unhook someone else.
Noed: Could apply the exposed status effect only to the survivors who start opening an exit gate.
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We have already had many suggestions here.Ā How often do developers bring good ideas into the game?Ā I have often read wonderful things here, but has even one suggestion made it into the game? I think not.Ā
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DS is easy to rework. It currently does not counter tunneling. It counters momentum and it makes you a god during end game. Just make it deactivate when another survivor is hooked. Problem solved. Still counters tunneling but makes it so it is no longer the best perk in the game.
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There's nothing wrong with NOED imo. Just a mediocre perk that does nothing when you're winning hard and does very little when you're losing hard vs good survivors. Maybe add totem counter but the devs are allergic to that so w/e
DS honestly should just disable when you're grabbed. The locker interaction is what makes it dumb, as there's nothing skillful or interactive about hopping in a locker and becoming invincible. Other than that it's annoying but has counterplay.
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I think DS deactivating after being healed or touching a gen would be interesting. Survivors play so reckless with it now, they lose their fear.
As for NOED, just give solo survivors some indication of when a dull totem is cleansed. If not a counter then at least an on screen sound effect so we can count them. I hate cleansing 4 totems and then going down to NOED anyway. Also the 4% speed boost should go. Many people who aren't very good on Huntress take it on Huntress so that they never need to get good with Huntress due to the movement speed buff. It makes no sense, they'll never get better that way.
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Alright I normally lurk here but I do love these changes. DS's I have seen around and would prefer. NOED's sounds awesome, it's like how Rancor pops up at the end. Now would the totem spawn as the last gen powers up or would it spawn when they touch the gate?
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I would make NOED basekit, even though i hate the perk version. Its atmospheric and oneshot phases are the most fun and thrilling times in the game. I only dislike the surprise factor, not knowing wether he has noed or not until someone gets downed. As basekit, everyone knows not to mess with the killer in endgame.
DS though, i would bury it and not look back. Second chance perks are the bane of balance in dbd. Delete them all imo
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NOED would be fine if survivors were simply notified that they are Exposed as soon as the perk becomes active, rather than after the first hit. I understand the benefit of maintaining the element of surprise, but the current version of NOED goes against the game's design principles. Status effects are there for a reason.
DS should deactivate as soon as somebody else is hooked, but should be usable more than once. This would severely punish tunnelling killers whilst not hurting those who play "fair".
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Decisive Strike deactivates when the survivor is healed to full, works on a generator, gets into a locker, saves another survivor, heals another survivor, interacts with a door, and a variety of other actions.
No One Escapes Death now has a time limit based on how quickly the game went. If you had a long time to kill the survivors and failed, then you deserve the loss. If the gens went in seconds and you had no chance, then it gives you a second chance with an advantage. Since they clearly know what they're doing.
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There's only 5 totems to cleanse, so NOED is easily countered and all totems are super easy to find and don't take long to destroy.
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DS isnāt just to counter tunneling when itās tier 3, lasts a little too long. I just think the speed boost with NOED is unnecessary
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I think it should spawn when someone touched the gate. Everyone else could get notified there's a hex but not suffer the exposed status effect; so they could either choose to look for the totem or risk it and try to open the exit gates.
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Noed should only insta down people who are on death hook that way you at least had to somewhat work for the kill. I can't think of anything for ds.
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DS only needs to be changed to 45-55 seconds after being unhooked to still serve it's intended purpose and not punish a killer from being too good at downing survivors if they down and hook someone else before running into the DS user again.
NoED is fine since the counter is the fact that it's a hex perk.
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So wait, 2and chance for survivors = horrible and should go. But isn't noed a 2nd chance perk for the killer???
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DS - Pause the DS timer while in the Dying state; deactivate DS if someone else is hooked after the DS timer has progressed five seconds. Seems simple enough.
NOED - This is kind of a weird one, but I'll try. Instead of it being a Hex perk, make it a token based system where you get tokens for 1st/2nd hooking people before the Exit Gates are powered, lose tokens whenever someone dies/is sacrificed, and get the NOED ability after the last gen is finished as long as you have a certain number of tokens. This way, you only get the benefit at the end of the game if you actively made a lot of hooks throughout the game instead of tunneling people to death.
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NOED is perfectly fine.
DS needs only minor tweaks so the timer is slower (like the EGC) when being chased or when slugged. Tunneling killers abuse the very short timer.
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Yes it is and i dont like the comeback factor of it. And that you have to equip a perk for it, i just like the idea of this phase "No One Escapes Death". You powered up the gates, the killer is mad you're winning, now its time to gtfo, cause Death will follow. Thats the only time you have to respect and evade the killer. It feels scary.
But i dont want to put a perk slot into it, expecting to lose and make a comeback. Like... EGC is cool, but i wouldn't use a perk to get EGC. Now that EGC is basekit, its cool. But if it was a perk you had to equip, it would be a crutch perk, because you "bet on losing".
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I don't know. I rather it be a perk the. Base mainly cause it's one not a good idea now they can use a additional perk to add to the EGC. Base kit would be too much. They already have builds for EGC now they could build bigger builds because the crutch perk is now forever for them.
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Who would complain about the DS? The Nintendo DS was a huge pioneer of portable gaming and is an important part of gaming history
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I think DS is meant that perks that activates when you are unhooked and deactivates exactly the second before the killer picks you up.
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I doubt it, see how they nerfed survivor stuff first over killer stuff.
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Ok, so someone heals you on the hook with their medkit/we'll make it and the killer is free to chsse you again. Really effective
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Don't worry, only a few really bad players complain about these two perks.
Because they're really bad players, their solutions are often terrible or some other persons (usually one of the streamers) ideas that they just repeat to sound like they have some solution.
It's kind of easy really, do whatever you have to do to not be affected by 2 extremely situational perks. It's that easy
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Ds doesnt counter just tunneling. It gives the survivor a whole minute of immunity that killers may or may not know about. I've had games where I didnt "tunnel" found the person within 60 seconds and got d struck. I got so out played. Not to mention all 4 of them can run it. A conscious killer would have to waste 4 minutes of the game just respecting ds. That's not even mentioning, no mind game loops, barrowed time, adrenaline, dead hard. There simply isn't enough time in the game for ds to exist and still have it be fun for both sides. At least noed waits till the end of the match after everyones had their chance to have fun and get their points. Ds just robs killers of their hook objectives because survivors think it's okay to hook bomb.
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DS should be disabled if the unhooked Survivor does anything other than healing. Vaults, etc etc should not count of course, but if they start repairing a gen, cleansing a totem, or any action that isn't part of being chased or healed, it should be disabled. Otherwise, I think it's just fine as it stands. No need for any other adjustment imo.
NOED... why do people still complain about this Perk? CLEANSE THE TOTEMS. Hell, they even buffed the BP you get from doing dull totems.
I don't normally get into the whole Survivor too strong/Killer too strong stuff, but as a Survivor you can wipe an entire Perk off of a Killer with a few seconds of animation. Why are you not doing this? 1 Perk slot completely wasted, and you can't spend the time taking down a totem? You have now EARNED that NOED proc, and the resultant downs, hooks and sacrifices. I have no sympathy.
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That's a fair nerf.
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NOED is fine... Cleanse totems and you'll never see it.
DS should have the following changes:
- It deactivates once another survivor is hooked
- It can't be used within the exit gate (More than likely if you still have DS at this point in the game, the killer wasn't tunneling you)
- It should not tick down well slugged, this also means it shouldn't deactivate if you are down while another survivor is hooked.
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I don't think DS should be changed. I don't mind it so much, it's a punishment for tunnelling/being greedy. Sometimes your options as Killer are limited but if you are the Survivor getting tunnelled it's not fun. You can eat DS early enough in a game too. I tend to do that so it's out of the way later.
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Bad, since if they down you and then hook the another dude they got before hooking you, it'll get deactivated and not counter tunnelling. I've heard it, but sorry, it wouldn't work.
That's something I've thought myself. DS should deactivate when grabbed, and NOED should be left alone, but I want to see what they got to say anyways.
Definitely what I'd like, I mean the totem counter. I sometimes get caught when cleansing, forget I got 4, and go back to find the killer and then I think I've cleansed all the totems, and get the FAT NOED hit.
NOED is also a second chance perk, so delete that according to your logic, not throwing some shade, just my opinion. I think some second chance perks work, but not all.
My responses are my opinion, so please don't take offense if I said something you don't agree with, it's just my opinion on it.
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NOED is a bad perk. No need to rework it.
I'll take Devour Hope anytime. Proxy camping the totem at a 3 gen is wayyy more deadly than NOED that works only after the gates are powered...
The problem with Decisive Strike is not that it counters tunneling, it's that it punishes killer for downing multiple people in a quick succesion, gives survivior 60 second invicibility no matter the circumstances and, in tandem with Unbreakable, is a free "get out of jail card" that can't be countered by anything besides toxic camping.
The simplest solution is:
- -100% of the timer for all active DS timers when killer hooks a person
- -50% of the timer for all active DS timers when killer downs a person.
- Can work multiple times, (no problem for me as long as it works as its supposed to be)
This way Decisive Strike will deactivate immediately as soon as another person is hooked or multiple people are downed. DS remains "anti tunneling" perk, but it doesn't lead to absurd situations like killer "tunneling" 4 people at once.
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