Why do you all think breakable walls are buff to killers?
We don't even know where this walls located yet.
What if they are put in some god loops where you can't get survivors at all without breaking these walls? Sure, one or two of these are fine, but what if all loops are like this?
What if they decide to close the pre-existing doors with these walls, where survivors can quickly get around it while killers don't?
And i think it is highly unlikely that these walls are put on current existing loops like jungle gym, shack, etc. It may be put on god loops, but isn't it better for killer if they just put a door to these loops?
Seriously, don't make your judgement before you even get to see and experience them yet. PTB is only few hours away, so please be patient.
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Survivors got the developers by the balls. How bout nerfing SWF to 1 less perk for each in a group?
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Ironic you say that, all survivors got this update was an small buff to sabo while killers got a massive amount of buffs.
Now I can see all the killer whining in the forums served a purpose
Post edited by Todgeweiht on5 -
Don't forget, they will only be on the new map to start. 100% bet it is a prison. But, the announcement already said the breakable walls will only be on the new map to start. Don't expect The Game map to suddenly have walls you can break. This is a new mechanic that has barely been tested. There will be a process of progression before every map has them.
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Are you sure sabo is only a small buff? Think about it.
And where does that "massive killer buffs" come from? So far trapper and doc got QoL change, and only plague got a good buff. How is it massive where it only involves 1 of all existing killers?
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Correct. That's one of the reason why i don't understand why so many people say it's a massive buff to killers.
I like killers to be able to break through walls, but in terms of balance, i can't say much.
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Complete mechanics change, yes, but pales in comparison with sabo before, a sabo SWF was lethal. At least now it will be interesting and you wont have to play with your friends to get value out of it
- Nerf to toolboxes
- Breakable walls (albeit only on 1 map, soon more will be added)
- 3 killers getting buffed
When was the last time killers in general got buffed like this?
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They could put breakable walls next to that one window at the very corner of the map that is nigh useless for survivors.
You know the one. Make it even MORE useless! Just a window, one good wall and one broken wall.
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The new map having breakable walls cannot be a buff.
The new map never didn't have breakable walls. So whatever effect those walls have will just be the baseline. Buff implies that it's better than some prior version, but this is going to be the first version of the map for us.
As for other maps, we don't have enough information to evaluate.
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Ok let's see what you said.
1. A nerf to survivors is not equivalent to buff to killers. Actually, it's more like a change like DS. Sure, your repair speed is reduced in long run, but it also makes 3 gen situation weaker.
2. I already mentioned this in my post. Please read it.
3. I also already said this. But i'll say it again.
Doc does not get buffed. After rework, increase madness is already very easy. This change will likely not change much about that.
Trapper got QoL change only. Normally you don't sabo his trap, so it's only slight buff. Reset trap is a buff, i can't argue with that.
Plague got a nice buff. Can't argue with that.
None of these changes affect all killers aboard, so it's not a massive buff to killers
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It's only a buff if certain loops have breakable walls. The ones that immediately come to mind are:
Fractured Cowshed god loop
Ironworks of Misery god loop
Torment Creek god loop
Any corn map cow god loop
The Game double pallet loop before bathroom gen is completed (good survivors don't do that gen first, even if they spawn there)
Long walls on Haddonfield
The broken walls are only a buff is these loops, AT MINIMUM, are a part of the gameplay. Obviously the new map will be the only ones with broken walls to start with, but if these loops aren't dealt with somehow, they will be a neutral integration at best.
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Then, how are you gonna bully the killer? And tell him baby killer huh
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I wouldn't be surprised if in some cases, breaking a wall will just make the loop worse for the killer. However, we can't tell for sure how good or bad breakable walls are untill we test them.
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Breakable Walls sound to me like reverse pallets... but still seem useless in a way, unless BHVR make them different to how I’m expecting.
They also sound like they’re gonna have a strategic element to them - busting down one wall could permit a super powerful loop or put two generators really close together or something. So you have to be smart about when and where to bust down a wall.
I hope they make them an ‘instant destroy’ for the jump scare factor, instead of two kicks break down and stand like an idiot for half a second before moving like pallets are.
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I laugh if they make a room with two windows and two breakable walls. Sound like a fun show right.
I mean look at this secret footage the devs are trying to hide
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uRwqc3QnoiE&t=38s
seriously i think the walls won't be bad but i don't think we shouldn't overrate them.
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If badly implemented, it will be strong loops until you break the wall.
"Just break the
palletwall"Could backfire horribly and should really be tested a lot on the new map.
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I imagine it's there way to rework certain maps like haddonfield without having to do as much work.
Why rework it when you can just break the walls in the house that break the impossible loops?
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I really think the survivors are trying to paint it as some OP new killer power when reality is it is questionable how effective it will be and its only going to be one map to start.
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Because they’re a nerf to loops.
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Because people are stu... I mean unintel..... they jump to conclusions, lets keep it at that.
Not to be rude but case in point:
^ this person assumes blindly that loops stay the way they are but killers get the option to shorten them, based on nothing at all.
They dont think of the option that maybe new loops are by default made too long/infinite with the option for the killer to then make sure it isnt infinite but balanced...
Honestly people, this is exactly the reason I hate Add Ons for killers.
The devs tested the killers, they found that X should take Y Seconds and A should take B seconds etc etc, then they made add ons that decrease that timing to skew the balance first decided on.
That is hte problem, its inherently unbalanced, either the killers were made purposely too weak only for add ons to be mandatory and fix it OR they made killers balanced only for add ons to skew the fight in their favor.
Both scenarios are undesirable.
You can apply the same thing to this breakable walls idea.
Personally I think its ill adviced to introduce this now, and even if it wasnt bad timing its still not a great idea, I think very quickly it will simply be decided what walls need to be broken and which ones should not and then it just becomes boring recognision and busy work.
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Loops aren't infinites. Infinites don't exist anymore. But thanks for calling me (and others) out like that. That's a good way to get a warning if you hadn't already.
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You didn't read his post very well... yes he shouldn't have called you stupid. But he had a point. They might make the loops on the new map longer/more like infinites with the option to break a wall and make them more balanced.
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I’m pretty sure if they went as far as to allow killers to break through walls, it must be because of how strong certain structures are. Not the opposite.
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"They dont think of the option that maybe >>>>>NEW<<<< loops are by default made too long/infinite with the option for the killer to then make sure it isnt infinite but balanced..."
Don't prove my claims even more by not reading properly.
I have adjusted my text to....be more kind (even though honestly I dont see a reason to not call it as it is).
You can be happy...or should be sad, in the knowledge you are not the only one who portrays this behavior, which is maybe why im reacting a tad harshly but yeah, I get a bit sick of it.
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I'm so glad people are still jumping to conclusions about mechanics and features that they have literally not had the chance to even see in action yet...
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Uhhh yeah. That's what happens when the devs announce a game changing mechanic.
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Breakable walls will change nothing with the game's double pallet, you can't break the middle square it's based around. Maybe break the sliding metal doors around the map, but those already open with gens getting done. The way the game is designed, there aren't many spots to have breakable walls. However, as the devs have been rewoking maps, you can actually see parts in Lerys where there is a door leading to nothing, or a piece of wall covered in sheets, or windows and walls randomly made out of discolored bricks. I think they've been working on this for a while, and it's going to be a while for them to rework the maps in such a way that wall breaking is usefull without being required.
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Hmm. How do I think about about this idea? Pretty sure I can sum it up into two words.
OH YEAH
But seriously, Imma wait till I see it in action and have also played around with it on console before I give my opinion. This isn't like ruin changes where you can clearly see what'll happen. I'm excited though, so there's that. ^-^
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That 2.5 sabo time is pretty small, huh
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These buffs don't fix gen speed or the ridiculous survivor perks.
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Ironic to call the sabotage changes a small buff, it bridges the gap between solos and swf in terms of breaking hooks.
Additionally 3 killer buffs? I only saw a trapper qol buff and add on buffs for doctor in the patch notes, no plague in sight. Furthermore there's no indication at the moment to show a killer what is and what isn't a breakable wall, and even then there's at most 2 wall breaks that are gonna be useful
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