gameplay balance in terms of people abusing discord
in the last several if not all my previous games in the past 2 days every game i played had 4 people together in a party that is easy to tell they are in discord which ruins the fun and difficulty of the game as a killer i cant catch anyone and as a survivor who is abusing discord they make the game less fun and less difficult on their end where as harder for the killer
killers get blamed for tunneling and camping which at this point all a killer can do cause as soon as the game starts 1-2 people try to bait the killer into running circles and the rest of them either break hooks or gen rush so by the time u catch ur 1st victim 2+ gens are already fixed cause they abuse several things a survivor can do and while i know its mostly based on skill and i know try hard survivers will just say get good its not about getting good
since everyone is in a discord call together everyone can make it known where the killer is as well as bring counter mesures alot of the games i played recently is 2 medkits 2 toolboxes or 2 medkits a toolbox and a flightlight
the guy who baits has a medkit and the guy with the flashlight comes in and flashes u when ur trying to pick the player up or when they throw down a pallet and thats already hard enough even when they arent in discord
not to mention the fact that while ur holding someone people will litterally run in ur way to make sure u cant move abusing physics mechanics cause when they crouch they are no different then a wall and even after i hit them they keep trying to stall long enough for the player im holding to finish his struggle bar
i know it would be hard to balance it cause not everyone uses discord or has friends to be in discord with but at the ranks below 15 it becomes far more commonplace that they are discord users not to mention the matchmaking is weird since im rank 14 getting placed against rank 4-9 players and very few in double digets
my final point i want to make is im not asking for over the top balancing but something that makes it harder for people using discord and abusing game mechanics
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I mean cant really do anything about discord calls unless they prevent discord links in game chat. But mainly they should just make swf have a icon letting the killer know what he is against and add a feature where for every swf you get a specific debuff for speeds for every survivor with the swf icon. I mean you are most likely in discord or party chat system. Constant communication from any distance without recourse in a 4v1 is bot fair to killer.
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I've been accused of using discord when I was in solo queue. Don't use SWF as a crutch for your mistakes.
If 1-2 people are baiting you to run into circles, that's 1-2 people not doing generators. Ignore them if you got into the 0.00001% chance that you have the best 2 players in DbD in your match and catch them out of position later.
If you're dealing with flashlights, look at walls when making a pick-up or look opposite of where the flashlight wielder is.
Good luck out there.
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I agree with what you said. But swf in a call can make just end the game in 5-6 minutes. So many games I done this and either all 4 of us escaped or 3 in less then 6 minutes. Which is why I stated my suggestion on swf to nerf it without the need of nerfing survivors all around like most killers think the devs should do.
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I tend to take the "sic pacis parabellum" approach.
I tend to leave twitch open and I check names before a game lobby finishes. If I see a streamer in clear SWF voice comms or I get the sense the group is going to be an SWF or is looking to bully, I give them all they can handle. Whip out Freddy, put on his most oppressive addons and go to town. No Mori's on principal but everything else is fair game? Paint Brush, Swing Chains, Jump Rope, any of it is permitted at that point.
Once the game starts I'll gauge if I really need to go full ham or not, if they are clearly not great loopers, and the game is in my favor tremendously such as one dead and three on death hook inside of 2 generators then I will back off, let them get some more points with pallets, generators, etc. And then mow them all down at the end. They get some points, everyone's happy, gg wp.
If they are in fact an SWF I will just go full force since I'll probably need too. Thankfully at that point I'm prepared so it's not an insurmountable task.
Sometimes they just DC or die on first hook since they realize they're not going to be able to bully as they would a normal killer so game's end quickly and we move onto the next.
TL:DR: There's nothing wrong with whipping out a strong killer if you think you're going to be up against it.
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I have been accused of being in SWF loads of times when I have been playing solo.
Survivors only have so many items they can bring in and you are currently moaning about Toolboxes, Medkits and Torches. That's 3 of their items. If they brought a key you would moan about that too. So that's 4. What should survivors do? Come in with nothing all the time?
Bringing items in doesn't mean you are with a SWF group.
A torch save doesn't mean you are with a SWF group.
Someone healing with a medkit doesn't mean you are with a SWF group.
Bodyblocking a hook doesn't mean you are with a SWF group.
Pallet saves doesn't mean you are with a SWF group.
I have done all of these things when playing solo. In fact, bodyblocking in particular I am more likely to do in solo queue because I may have seen them do a decent run whereas 1 or 2 of my SWF players are bad runners, so me taking a hit to get them out wouldn't buy them much time anyway and costs me a health state.
As someone said above, stop obsessing over SWF and blaming it for everything. I'm a red rank killer and I never dodge a lobby based on suspected SWF. Just play the game and move on. It isn't like it takes long to find a killer game anyway.
The majority of SWF groups are just people playing for fun with their friends and often have a wide range of skill. The pro groups are few and far between.
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i dont know what swf is but this post wasnt about wether ur in a solo or a group, the point i made is for when its obvious to even the point that at the end of the game they admit to it, i dont like ruining the game with camping and stuff but when its clear they are ruining the game for me i start whipping out the dick moves like camping tunneling and stuff and i can tell when a team is in a discord call or if they are solo there are a few tell tales signs and while they arent garunteed to be accurate if u add up all the behaviors u can tell who is and who is not in a group together
when i join a lobby if there is already 4 people its a good sign they are in a group more so when they are holding a similar meta loadout while thats not proof they are in a call together its a high probability and the only real way to confirm is by playing in the match key factors of it in game is when u cant find anyone and when u get close to them someone conviently shows up baits u away and its like 3 people on a single gen again not garunteed but adds towards high probability and when probability gets really high its usually means they are
as a solo player i never bring anything into the game cause i find my own things on map to build up my arsenal so when i do bring stuff its with friends, that being said i can usually tell by their starting loadup normally being 1-2 dwights 1 laurie and 1 claudet, while in other cases its a combo of that sometimes replaces 1 dwight and laurie to be switched for other characters with good abilities like meg or the old guy with the barret(whose name currently escapes me), reguardless of what characters it is, its conviently that they run the same tools and they all run those tools, theres many key factors in determining wether they are or are not in a group, more so that those in a group tend to behave different then in others, when in games where i know they arent in a call its cause they arent as coordinated or try to make it obvious they are baiting me through a training spot which i know where it is on each map
anyway i didnt start this thread for any form of unfair debated or discussions i just didnt know where to post my suggestion to see if there was a way to deter this new form of destructive gameplay, if the surviors know where the killer is at all times it makes it harder and more unfair its already 4v1 and while the killer has quite powerful techniques at their disposal the fact they are alone is hard as is.
my final note again stands im not asking for a buff or nerf of a given mechanic, im only asking for a way to deter 3rd party products from ruining such a good game.
additional edit: i dont main killer i just happen to be it more often just cause its better to farm blood points when im solo cause i dont have friends ;-;, being a survivor is more fun cause its a good adrenaline rush when its a clutch moment. my post is an unbias suggestion cause i too wont deny if i play with friends i use discord to communicate which sounds hypocritical to my post its the fact im not the only person who does and i feel its unfair to both sides killers and survivors alike.
and to the person who said look at a wall when dealing with flashlight users its kinda hard when u down them in the middle of a field or when ur forced to look in a direction when breaking pallets
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Ahh, the age old "What is abuse/exploits" complaint
Like Camping, Tunneling and Slugging, there's no rules against using Discord to gain an advantage.
It can be annoying as #########,sure, but as you'll hear most DBD players say when it comes to what they Main: "It's a viable strategy."
Plus I think you overestimate how much of an advantage it brings. Most of the time the players are just veterans and know exactly what they are doing. In my experience Discord is mostly used to 'Shoot the Breeze' and joke around. It helps a bit with situational awareness, but it can't make a player better at 'taking you for a ride.'
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Ok. So what about the Xbox "Party" feature? Or the Playstation equivelant?
What about those groups who are just friends and have a conversation throughout the game? How about those who are teaming up to finish of Archives missions, or attempting to deal with the rise in campers and tunnellers?
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Same for consoles. Party chat all round. The chat is what makes some of the best videos great.
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Player 1 "Hey Its Myers and hes chasing me.
Player 2/3/4 "Great we are doing gens!"
Now you instantly have 3 people on gens. That's the real power of SWF, not the bully/troll but the simple fact that you know whats happening everywhere all the time. Even chill SWF can just toss a "oh hes chasing me" and that's a big green light to do gens.
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When 4 Solos are playing and 3 of them are not being chased, why should they not stick on Gens? If I am not getting chased, I will do a Gen. Simple as that.
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Aye but many times if you are unsure you will keep a look out for the killer (no TR etc) and many people DO NOT instantly hop on gens.
I too instantly hop on a gen because I enjoy getting chased so I agree it whats some players do but I still won't have information of where/who it is.
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You joining a lobby and 4 people being there means nothing. It could be 4 solo people who had a killer leave the lobby.
The characters they pick being certain combinations again, nothing to do with SWF. In fact, SWF behaviour would more likely be survivors all dressed the same in store purchased cosmetics.
I commented on items in the previous post. Items are there to be used it doesn't mean they are playing SWF. It just means they are using their items they paid bloodpoints for the same way you use your add-ons as the killer.
I find it really disheartening that a rank 14 killer is already making excuses about SWF and complaining about how it is ruining his game. They're more than likely just better than you, that's all. You will improve as time goes by.
If torches and pallet saves are such a worry for you, use infectious fright and if there is a scream nearby go and hit them, if there isn't, feel free to pick them up or use lightborn.
You're making excuses as to why you don't win and that is based on because people want to play with their friends. What monsters they must be!!!
The person who claimed that being able to say "The killer is chasing me" means everyone gets on a gen is also making weird excuses. If you're not being chased you're only going to be doing gens or totems. You're not just going to endlessly run around the map thinking you're in a chase with the killer when you're not. Also the obsession tentacles wiggle when the killer is with them, everyone can see that, not just SWF. Does that need removing too?
People like to play with their friends. They aren't doing it to upset you, using it as an excuse to camp and tunnel is pretty sad too. You're basically saying "I'm bad at the game, so I'll make it miserable for anyone I do manage to catch because I can". Employing thse behaviours will actively hold you back from improving so you will rely on them for as long as you play the game and get increasingly frustrated when people outplay you when you try to use these "tactics". This will result in you becoming a standard whiny killer on these forums, something you are well on your way to achieving already.
Post edited by MPUK on0 -
I laughed when you said using voice chat and crouching are abusing game mechanics. (abusing physic mechanics what?)
Didn't read these in the Eula
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"as a survivor who is abusing discord they make the game less fun and less difficult on their end where as harder for the killer"
Those who use Discord are not abusing the game. It is not cheating. This statement has been confirmed and reinforced by the Devs and the Mods several times over. It doesn't matter if you dislike it or disagree with it, that does not make it abuse. Neither is being in an SWF itself, the option to play in an SWF is there for a reason and Devs are not going to punish or penalize players by adding debuffs or taking away perks, just for having the audacity to use a function they implemented themselves. It would be a stupid business move, and as much as the Devs have a passion for the game and want it to continue, it is still their livelyhood. They are not going to hobble people for daring to play with their friends.
Could something be done to address the balance. Probably yes. And i sincerely hope they do because I'm tired of the continuous threads of both sides accusing Devs of favouritism, or accusing the other side for being noobs or sweaty for using perks, items, addons and tactics that are part of the game.
" cause they abuse several things a survivor can do "
No. Using in game mechanics is not abuse. It is called playing the game. I might not like tunnelling or camping. But they are part of the game and I accept them. Even when it's me hanging from the hook.
"my final point i want to make is im not asking for over the top balancing but something that makes it harder for people using discord and abusing game mechanics"
Say it with me again folks; Unless you are hacking or exploiting a bug, Using Perks, Items, addons and in game tactics, is not abuse!
If a killer tunnels me off a hook and Mori's me..it's not abuse. If a killer keeps slugging me because they decided that today I must spend the entire game bleeding out on the floor, Its not abuse of the game mechanics. If a killer brings double pink addons and a mori to a game, still not abuse. This fad of calling everything that doesn't work specifically for us as 'abuse' is ridiculous and has rendered the word meaningless. If you are playing the game with the ways and means provided to you, you are simply playing the game, not bullying someone because you happen to be succeeding.
There are problems with this game, but they are mostly buried under cries of "It's not fair!" or "This perk/addon/item/tactic is bullying me!". I have to imagine that the mods must look at some of these threads and sigh with resignation.
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"Abusing Discord" LOL. I didn't know discord wasn't allowed for gaming with my friends? Were in each others discord all the time for every single game we play. I didn't know for DBD that was forbidden??
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Laughs in Xbox party chat
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abuse;
verb
/əˈbyo͞oz/
- use (something) to bad effect or for a bad purpose; misuse.
Discord is for people to talk in, mostly while playing games. its being used as it was designed
get over yourself
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They're not going to penalize SWF groups and they've been clear on that. Based on their stats (and with recent events these are going to be skewed) most of the players you face are going to be solo.
A solution that I thought of would really only work if cross-play existed and that's just due to the volume of people. If there were a casual mode where you didn't rank up and only earned exp and BPs and made that mode cross-play you'd see a lot of SWF groups go there. As an incentive to playing on casual modes where killers would deal with SWFs, players could get a base of 10k bps and whatever BPs they earn at the end of the match.
Ranked should be a separate queue, only on a single platform (not sure if they could have two queues like this but :shrugs:) and only have duos/solos. No three man, no four man squads in ranked.
Right now a nice change would be letting people know that players are in a group. Even as a solo survivor, I'd like to know if I join a 3 man squad.
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This is an online multiplayer game. There is no such thing as abusing comms. If you think so youre naive as hell. Also I highly doubt that you play all games vs 4 man SWF, cause this completely impossible as long as those are the only players in your region. Also you cannot balance a game in favor of some edge cases. And tryhard 4man SWF is a edge case.
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everyone who has responded more or less have been trying to rag on my ideology cause of how i feel about the game my rank dont matter my skills do while not polished does not matter i dont care what others say i made this post for the sake of taking comms into consideration not to have a petty argument or people trying to defend surviors rights to come cause ur a survivor main i dont care who what where when why the fact is its a 3rd party device be it console comms or discord or other forms of communication im not asking for a rewrite of the game i dont care if ur solo or u think ur rank matters
I ONLY ASKED FOR 3RD PARTY COMMS TO BE CONSIDERED IN GAME BALANCING
do not respond to this post do not think ur entitled to defend ur opinion if u already posted i made this post as a suggestion and i do not care about ur butt hurt feelings of entitlement
AGAIN DO NOT RESPOND I WONT BE VIEWING THIS POST ANYMORE... that means for self centered entitled plebs ur opinions will be ignored
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Soooo you're throwing a huff because people are pointing out the truth? At the end of the day perhaps voice coms should be taken under consideration, but not by means of punishing players for using a function that is allowed and not considered cheating. Unfortunatly you buried your point in untrue accusations of players abusing the game by simply playing it the way it has been handed to them. Survivors don't make the perks or the rules. So it makes it difficult for anyone to take the topic seriously because all they see is another killer accusing them of abusing mechanics by simply playing the game.
Pointing out the truth of your ideology is not 'ragging' on you. It's simply refusing to be told that using in game mechanics not abuse.
If there is anything petty or butthurt about this thread....then I'm sad to say it is this post.
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