Pig is the most unfun trash I've experienced
Seems a lot of people here have major issues with literacy. Here is a TLDR: The reverse bear trap (Pig's featured ability) an uninteractive and unfun mechanic which limits skill based interaction between the killer & the survivor. The only counter play is running around the map to 4 traps to "cleanse" the RBT which often require you to use all 4 unlike similar abilities that only require you to use one or to get help from a team mate. The trap will instakill if you leave it on, & constantly reveals your location which further reduces the choices you have available to play around this mechanic.
What kind of smoothbrain designed this and thought this would be a good idea to leave it as is?
You should be encouraging skill based interaction between players, not having 4/5 people running around the map the entire trial trying to remove an instakill debuff that constantly reveals their location. You're effectively removing a player from the game the entire time and it lasts way too long.
There is no decision making process, here is no mind gaming, there is no interaction, there is no risk & reward. You don't outplay it and it doesn't outplay you. It's uninteractive and unfun.
If you're going to have such a broken mechanic, there needs to be some amount of counter play & not have to spend the entire game running in a circle waiting to die. Similar mechanics all have appropriate counter play and interactivity.
You need to ask yourself a very simple question when designing this kind of content: "will this be fun for the people playing the game?"
I'm to the point where I just do a gen until the trap pops and then I go back to lobby. It's not fun running around on auto-pilot making no decisions and not interacting with the killer or the game in any interesting way.
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"If you're going to have such a broken mechanic, there needs to be some amount of counter play & not have to spend the entire game running in a circle waiting to die."
Did you try out those highlighted Boxes? Because when I read this sentence, I would assume, you did not.
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You know you can remove the traps, right? You really shouldn't be dying to an RBT unless under extraordinary circumstances.
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Lmao. You only get killer headtraps if the pig is running two rare add-ons. And even then, it's a 1/5 chance they actually do anything. There is a 1/5 chance her power literally does nothing.
She is one of the worst killers in the game, hands down.
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I've played a lot of Pig in the last year and I can count on one hand the number of times I've actually killed a survivor with a trap. Pig is a slow killer and knows that tunneling someone with a trap is useless because they're out of the game until they remove that trap. Leaving everyone else to do gens is how bad pigs end up with a 1k at most. Pig needs some type of rework that still gives her that really fun SAW appeal, but without feeling so underpowered.
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I don't think I'd ever see the day when Pig is considered 'brain dead' and 'broken.' Next, somebody will come along and say Clown is OP.
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It doesn't reveal you. Unless she's running some EXTREMELY BAD addons that give her a noise notification or something when you get it off. But those are some of her worst addons.
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While she is a strong killer, I wouldn't go as far to say she's op. I have quite a lot of fun playing as and against her.
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Try rereading the entire sentence and think it over.
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Yea you should read what I wrote in the comment and not just the thread title to see why I call it an unfun mechanic
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NERF PIG 🐽🐽🐽
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No she's not....people like the OP are why I'm as deadly as I am. Just pit the survivors against each other and have them do a task outside of the typical generator and they lose their minds and die/kill themselves. It really is brilliantly beautiful.
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The trap makes a loud beeping sound which gets louder and louder as time passes. You also make a ton of noise while using the boxes.
I didn't say or even imply that. Are you replying to a wrong thread by mistake?
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You dont seem to know how Pig works my friend.
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Exactly. Pig might be bottom tier, but people hate her the same way they hated old Doc.
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Yeah, I read the whole thing. It still sounds like you're just resigning yourself to death the second you get a trap on your head, which is not at all the way you're supposed to play against Pig. And I'm not the only one who got that impression, so maybe it's not my reading comprehension ability that's the problem.
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Pig is terrible. She is an M1 killer, who can maybe do something with the lunge at some short loops which are unsafe anyways. The traps are pure RNG. They are only set-and-forget mori's if you run two very specific add-ons. And even then, it's a 1/5 chance it works.
Unless you are following someone with an active head trap while crouch, which is a borderline abuse of the game.
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Well, you did not mention with any word that you tried to get the Trap off your head.
But usually a Trap is not a Death, I faced a lot of Pigs and I died to the Trap only a handful of times, even when the Pig Player was running strong Add Ons. The Trap is only a guaranteed Death if she is blocking the Box with the Key.
Pig is not terrible at all, she is a solid mid-tier Killer. Nothing compared to other M1-Killers like Billy or Freddy, but far away from being terrible. Sure it sucks if Survivors get the Trap off on their first attempt, but usually they provide good Slowdown. Pig is one of those Killers who just needs an Add On Rework (given the fact that her best Add Ons are yellow (extra Trap) and brown (crouching time)).
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I actually like it cause it relate to the saw franchise.
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That still requires her to be close, and boxes aren't often near generators. The beeping itself is quieter than repairs, whereas box usage is roughly the same (still limiting proximity to notice). If she's patrolling boxes, she's devaluing the traps, since she's not pressuring generators over survivors already prevented from repairing them and progressing the game.
I see a lot of Pigs tunnel their trap targets, which is only useful if catching them is easy and you rush them to their last hook with a trap and slug them. Otherwise, it's never worth it.
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The fact you think her best add-ons are the extra trap or crouching time is hilarious. It is clearly the tampered timer + extra box. That is literally a set and forget mori. There is a 1/5 chance the survivor doesn't live from it, there is no time to check all 5 boxes in 2 minutes. You tunnel them for a little bit while crouched? Now its a 2/5 chance they just die outright from it.
There's plenty of maps you can bodyblock survivors at the boxes. Lery's is especially horrible for that. You can just sit in front of a box until someone searches it and then block them in for a free head trap kill. The fact you don't know all this means you don't play alot of pig.
Pig is the only killer in the game I am happy to see gens pop on. But she is still trash.
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How is that pitting the survivors against each other? You're not interacting with the other survivors at all, nor are you interacting with the killer. The RBT is actually forcing non-interaction. Maybe you have an easy time because people don't enjoy playing a walking simulator and want to interact with the killer/game in a meaningful way.
Seems like maybe you have a bit of buyer's remorse and need to project that on other people. To each their own.
Ah, OK. Go ahead and explain then since it's so complicated.
Whether or not she's good is irrelevant, the mechanic is unfun. Interaction should be maximized because we're not playing a single player walking simulator.
No, I'm resigning myself to having fun which involves interacting with the killer and not playing a walking simulator.
And it is literally reading comprehension issues as most of the replies have been something along the lines of "pig isn't OP" or "that's now how RBT works" when I've said neither that pig is OP or inaccurately described the mechanic.
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Those are her best Add Ons, sorry to break it for you. Tampered Timer and the Extra Box dont do that much, if the Survivor can still get rid of the Trap on their first Box. And even with both Add Ons it is usually possible (on every Map) to remove the Trap, even tho it is more stressful.
Bodyblocking only makes sense if the Pig keeps Track of the number of Boxes or of the Beeping of the Survivor. If a Pig is doing that, it can force a Death, this is correct.
And I main PIg. But yeah, nice to see no arguments.
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Then you are a smoothbrain. Combining two add-ons to create a mori is almost as good as a tombstone. No wonder you are here arguing she is a good killer.
"I don't know how to block a survivor in at a box that has only one entrance". There's so many boxes like this. Too bad you have not taken the time to find them. Good luck on your future matches.
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Literally takes 20 seconds out of your 5 minute game. Also, RBTs arent even that strong. If youre constantly dying to them, then you should maybe be getting them off? Its not very complicated.
And no, they dont constantly reveal your location. That beep is a lot louder on the survivors end. Supposed to get you tense about getting it off. As killer, if I run into someone with an activated RBT, its never because of the beeping, its because I checked a Jigsaw box.
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Words like "broken" and "no counterplay" in combination give the strong impression that you think a mechanic is too strong, so I don't blame people for thinking that. That's also what leads people to conclude that you don't understand how the traps work (either that or you're misunderstanding what counterplay is) because they have very clear counterplay - just remove the trap and you're golden. It's really quite unjust to claim that other people have "problems with literacy" when you're the one who's misusing words in confusing ways.
If what you mean to say is that the Pig's power doesn't revolve around killer/survivor interaction and you find that boring, that's fine, but that's a personal preference. It doesn't mean the character is broken or that the people who came up with the mechanic are idiots. For me, Pig is actually the most fun to play against because I enjoy having a second objective, I enjoy the time pressure and the roulette-like aspects and find it quite exciting.
You can just say, "I would like it if Pig were changed because I think she and her power are boring and uninteresting to play against" because that's your opinion and you're allowed to voice it. You don't need to insult everyone in sight to do so.
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I've gotten around 20 trap kills... my first kill ever in this game was a RBT kill... I'd say that you are the type of player whom waits till the last moment to get the trap off only to fail... so you're going to blame RNG for the mistake you made...
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I would just like to say. That walking around to the jigglesaw boxes is the same as walking from gen to gen. Hold a button, do skill checks. Only with more rng. Since you can get the bear trap off by going to the very first box you see or it could take longer, by having to go to two or three boxes. Maybe all of them if you are really unlucky. If dealing with pigs traps are a walking simulator, wouldn't that make doing gens also a walking simulator?
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I agree! Pig's traps need to be stronger. Make Rule Set 2 base kit, and make traps more interactive so survivors have to do more to get them off than just test one of four boxes. Something that makes it a real slowdown mechanic, rather than a slowdown unless RNG decides to screw you mechanic.
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You know you can disarm the trap BEFORE it activates, right? It is a stall mechanic.
Unless you're facing off against Tunnel-Pigs or terrible teammates who do pop generators while you're being hooked against a Crate of Gears/Tampered Timer Pig, then an RBT is a temporary inconvenience.
It also has more interraction than half thr killer's powers in the game. Not only do I have to decide to use my LIMITED RESOURCE power that is based on (generally speaking) the stupidity of others to become lethal, but you have a lot of time to remove it, and try to work out how you will do it through map traversal. The bit people hate is the fact that it is a guessing game to find the right box.
You wanna know what's REALLY unfun/uninterractive? Hillbilly chainsawing you with zero sprint, Ghostface stabbing you literally half a second after they've marked you or Hag bashing you into the ground after placing 3 traps at your feet and someone unhooking you.
Special shout-out for the lovely Infinite Tier-III or Kill In Tier-III. Bonus points if they're combined.
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I didn't say they were too strong, I said they were unfun. No other killer ability in the game encourages people to forgo interaction as much as the RBT. I play a multiplayer game because of player to player interactions. Running in a circle around the map on autopilot toward 4 glowing boxes isn't fun or interactive.
Well I guess I can't help if people choose to interpret someone else's writing incorrectly. That is why I took the time to explain the problem so that people could have a straight forward understanding of what I meant. I repeatedly used the words "fun" and "interactive" with appropriate performatives so it's blatantly dishonest for people to go out of their way to manipulate syntax to misrepresent what I wrote.
You're even attempted to rewrite my argument instead of just accepting it even though it says the same thing effectively. As if writing it differently would hurt peoples' feelings less. No, I think they'll choose to be offended anyway because that kind of manipulative and dishonest behavior seems to be patterned in the DBD community.
Not sure why I thought I'd be greeted by anything but an abundance of forum trolls. That was my mistake.
I'm not sure how you come to these conclusions since I didn't mention doing any of that, but sorry that I've confused you. I hope it doesn't hurt too much.
👍️
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♡ Boop ♡
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Survivor mains who are rank 20 killers really don't seem to understand how killers work at all. I don't own Pig, but I know for a fact that Pig players have quite a hard time because Pig is kind of on the weaker side. BUT she is FUN. Stealth killers can be very rewarding if played right. The fact that you're moaning and groaning over an easy to work around mechanic (that's RNG btw, I have gotten trap off at first box many times) is very telling and reveals a lot of information about you. I don't want to assume normally, but please don't propagate the stereotypical toxic survivor mentality. No one likes that kind of player.
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Thats not what makes traps strong against competent players. Pig is one of the few killers in the game besides doc and plague, who can set and forget and throw survivors into a secondary mini game besides doing gens. Doc, plague, and pig are all semi decent built in "Ruins" if you think about it that way. You throw a trap on someone, hook them, now you don't have to tunnel them or if you do see them and attack them you can leave them on the ground and throw them off of their flow in which boxes they were going to check. 1 Person running around trying to get a trap off is 1 less person doing a gen....which = more time for you to put pressure on survivors. It also allows you time to set up your stealthy approaches and throw people of when you're sitting right next to them about to grab them off a gen.
Also you extremely underestimate unsafe loops that can be lunged, with the right add ons she can capitalize on it. Also its not a 1/5 chance your trap explodes it explodes every time as long as they don't take it off. And running tampered timer is stupid. It doesn't matter if they get the damn thing off....thats not the point of the traps. The point is they're doing something else, so her best add ons are the ones that add jigsaw boxes and the ones that extend the time it takes to search boxes. More time searching boxes and getting rejected from boxes=more time you have to kill their team mates, and less time they have to get the trap off....And as long as you can track where survivors are you can time the first person with a headtrap on, plan an approach for the next person, knock them, trap them, memorize where the other survivor with the trap was in their search loop, double back, and throw them off that loop if they don't get it off in the first box, knock them down, leave them, move on to the survivor near them then knock+trap+hook, then move back after that last trapped person or the person you just slugged for another knock/hook. Meanwhile while all this ######### is going on, nobody has done a single generator because they're too busy being flustered by traps.
Stack dying light, stack thano, end chases effectively and before you know it its 3 gens left and 2 survivors alive.
Could she use a buff or a tune up? Sure....but she's not even close to trash tier. Save that trash tier talk for Wraith or someone like that whos powers don't help him in a chase nor do they create secondary objectives....
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Alright now you're just trolling or disingenuously new to the game. She's the only killer I play, with plague being a close second, followed by spirit. For when I want some....Variety. Its pressure.....I don't think you really understand what that is, maybe you don't play survivor enough and realize how easy it is to gen rush with nothing else in your way. But if you've played against pig enough you'd know that it the traps cause survivors to get selfish. They have a trap on, and run right past injured survivors, they have a trap on and run past hooks, <----I've seen it happen countless times, and it either tilts the person injured or tilts the person hooked. Which is a mental play. If they're tilted their interaction with that guy who left them changes. Survivors become less trusting of themselves, and you can capitalize on the lack of altruism by having tons of targets who aren't healed. I could write a book on how to play her, but, ain't nobody got time for that go look at old posts and if you don't like my style go watch some of Scorpionz gameplay which is more in your face and focused on the chase. If anything I think you're projecting how bad you do with a killer onto other people....which....is pretty sad tbh.
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If you want to argue that pig needs a buff that's fine, but it's not relevant to what I wrote. If you're going to go off on a tangent, at least finish the argument or tie it in to the OP in some way. RNG also isn't really relevant as I didn't bring that up nor is it a problem in other areas of the game. What's telling is how you people constantly need to resort to misrepresenting my argument because you can't figure out how to refute my point about the ability lacking interactivity and being unfun to deal with. Whatever helps you cope with enjoying low skill gameplay.
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All that time you spent trolling a box with your body....survivors are gonna go do gens....thats actually worse than tunneling the person trapped...
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Well yes, if your argument isn't clear and you blame the people who don't understand you, can't clarify what you mean without insulting their intelligence at the same time, and accuse them of being trolls for misinterpreting what you're saying, you're likely to run into "trolls" everywhere you go.
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"Interactive gameplay" is what chases, looping, pallets and vaults?
If that it right then the fact you have a trap on your head means you lost
Plus you then need to interact with the boxes to get it off... cause you have time the Pig doesn't
It's "unfun" to have 2 gens pop before I find a survivor (because they chose to play stealthy)
Can I ask your playstyle as a survivor? I believe having that information is useful (since I am "confused")
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Unironically calling me a disingenuous troll while completely ignoring the point I made in the OP so you can use this as an opportunity to throw out buzzwords you don't understand and talk about your roster of killers. Your entire argument was irrelevant until you resorted to adhomming at the end because you can't seem to address the fact that it's unfun and uninteractive. Projecting buyer's remorse maybe? Or is it the classic insecurities of an OTP who has to justify their inability to be good with multiple killers?
Other killers have abilities that provide opportunities for mind games in a variety of ways without being unfun. Even a simple abilities such as Trapper's provides a ton of decision making opportunities for both the survivors and the killer, without dumbing down how they interact with each other & the ability during the match. In other words, other killers exist and don't have the same issues.
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So the cliffnotes are, this entire thread is a troll post? I mean I even gave a play by play of how to work effectively with traps, and countless people in this thread gave you info, but I'll admit, you got me to respond. Good troll thread.
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Other killers DO have powers that give opportunities for mind games, but most people don't use them that way. They so don't have powers that require you to win a chase. See my original post in here you've seemingly ignored. People will use killer powers in the most unoriginal ways because it gets results.
Just because somebody MAINS a killer, does not mean they can't play others competently.
You've really kicked an angry hornet's nest by picking on a weakened and loved killer. No other way to put it.
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I agree that this mechanic is annoying. I understand the frustration that it takes you away from all of your objectives in the game (gens/chase/heals/off-hooking) and often takes 3-4 boxes which are spread out in the furthest corners of each map, which wastes precious time. And when pigs go after injured helmet wearing survivors at a box, it is maddening, as not only are you barred from doing your objectives, now you're an insta down and if you manage to get off-hooked you still have to deal with your helmet. The pig is one of my least favorite killers.
But, I do understand needing to have unique abilities to slow down the game for killers to be able to meet their objectives too. If every mechanic still enabled you to do your direct objectives, killers wouldn't have the time they need to have an opportunity to kill people before all the gens were done.
So, I hear ya. But this isn't really so much broken as it is working as intended.
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An experienced Pig player knows better then to chase a survivor who has a RBT on... at least I do
She relies on chaos, when the survivors are trying to do everything while not knowing who's doing what where, or even where she is
Sometimes it takes "unskillful interactions" to get through mid game (where she is the strongest <IMO>)
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While I agree that the traps aren't really a fun mechanic, they're far from broken or overpowered. You almost never need to use all the boxes unless you get really unlucky and it sucks when it happens, but that's just the way it goes and I don't think the devs have any plans to change Pig anytime soon. It does suck that whenever an interesting slowdown mechanic is introduced to the game, it's plagued by randomness. Her bear traps are either next to useless or the best slowdown mechanic in the game and it's purely luck which way it goes. I would definitely be in favour of reworking her traps so they're more consistent.
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Another b8 post, not shocked.
Guess the only thing shocking around here these days is good ol' Herman Carter.
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You should be encouraging skill based interaction between players, not having 4/5 people running around the map the entire trial trying to remove an instakill debuff that constantly reveals their location. You're effectively removing a player from the game the entire time and it lasts way too long.
It is really not that hard to get those traps off your head and it is part of her power, that she can remove a player for a certaint ammount of time. Other then that, she does not have a lot going for her.
I personally like that there is a killer that can do stuff like that. It is a unique concept and a bit variety in gameplay compared to the rest of the killer roster and it is good for the game overall.
There is no decision making process, here is no mind gaming, there is no interaction, there is no risk & reward. You don't outplay it and it doesn't outplay you. It's uninteractive and unfun.
It does not have to be interactive all the time, and i dont see why this is unfun at all. Versing the pig is in my opinion not a bad experience at all, same with playing the pig.
If you're going to have such a broken mechanic, there needs to be some amount of counter play & not have to spend the entire game running in a circle waiting to die. Similar mechanics all have appropriate counter play and interactivity.
I died to a beartrap 1-2 times in my DBD life span. It is not that hard to get those traps off your head.. All it does is that it costs you and the team some time.
You need to ask yourself a very simple question when designing this kind of content: "will this be fun for the people playing the game?"
For me as a player, the Pig is fun both ways versing and playing. They succeeded, at least for me.
I think you overract a bit, it might be that there is no big brain gameplay involved when having a bear trap on your head, but thats fine in my opinion.
Some ❤️ for the Pig :)
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Lets look at this objectively.
What is the point of the RBT's?
The point is to slow survivors down, if you run around and do the boxes, one after another, unopposed then you will reach the last box about 3/4th of the way of the timer.
If you die by the box you either kinda got screwed because the killer happened to be trying to get someone around the box where you needed to be or you spend too much time doing other stuff at your own risk, but that is the key here, risk, a risk you take.
No different from not cleansing totems and then complaining about NoeD.
Anywho, again, it is meant to slow survivors/you down, a variation on this same principle is Legion's Frenzy attack that you have to spend time on mending.
Is it fun to be slowed down? maybe not.... but I mean is it fun to be shot in Counter Strike and then having to wait till the next round? or is it fun to walk in a Trapper beartrap and trying to get out? is it fun...idk being slugged by a killer? everything there slows you down, holds you back, that is what the opponent inflicts upon you so they stand a chance.
Some killers are fast, Oni, Billy, Nurse, Spirit, and others rely on slowing you down, Legion, Pig, Doctor, Clown, those are just their mechanics.
Lastly lets reverse this, is it fun for a killer to walk to a hook only to have it sabotaged in their face? because that is the survivors holding the killer back, same for being flashlighted or pallet slammed when carrying someone.
But that is just the game really, what I would like to know rather then all this complaining, what would you like to see changed that is still inline with the lore?
Maybe another survivor can look for a box for you and get a key to get your beartrap off but at the cost of a healthstate? them giving (part of) their life for you? that could be fun and I doubt the killer cares because now 2 survivors are busy doing something other then gens.
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The OP didn't say that Pig is strong or broken as in overpowered. They said that her secondary power is poorly designed from an enjoyability standpoint, which I agree with, both from a killer and survivor standpoints.
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