Remove/Rework SWF already
I get it, the game is impossible to balance due to the disparity of the skill of the players, that is why they dont buff killers or nerf survs or gens. In high ranks(20-10) the game is easier for killers because there are killers that have deranked to farm new players and also some of them just went back to the game. There are some good survs that just came back to the game in these ranks too but since u play with other 3 survs that are usually new to the game the matches are in killer favour most of the time but if u are good surv u can obviously rank up very easily.
The point is that, due to the previously said, the devs can´t buff killers anymore or any new player would have a terrible time playing and probably would stop playing so they lose a potential skin/DLC customer. But keep in mind that this is exactly what happens to red rank killers playing againts a coordinated SWF which happens a lot of the times.
So the only reason to fix this is to remove SWF in red ranks or give some kind of adventage when playing againts SWF as killer: maybe having a mori by default, depending how big is the SWF could be green or iridiscent, for example.
At this moment the game is completly broken in red ranks vs coordinated SWF: there are a lot of pallets, a lot of OP perks in survivor side, a lot of windows and a gen is done in 80 secs by a single survivor. So its impossible to get more than 1 kill if the SWF is good at the game and are tryharding, doesnt matter how good u are as killer.
I dont understand why there isnt even an icon showing the ppl that are in premade on the lobby. We dont want to be checking profiles all the time to avoid getting SWFd.
I never DC like many survs do and did in the past (actually insane how many DCs after getting caught). Keep in mind that killers cant suicide into the hook if they are not having fun like survs can do. They have to deal with the ocasional SWF bullies and waste their time until they decided to stop pressing CTRL in the gate and leave.
If u are not gona remove the SWF abuse, then make it visible and clear what we are exposing ourselves to.
Comments
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Ohh look another remove/nerf swf I wonder how many times this was made already. Like every one been saying you cant punish people for playing with friends.
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another post made by someone that is salty because he got rolled over by swf xd
1 of 10 games hurts his butt so hard he has to cry over it on forum
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Dude, c'mon. Swf is not going anywhere. It is the backbone of the player base and probably the biggest draw the game has currently, playing with friends.
Not to mention there are not as many seal team swf as people like to suggest, and many skilled killers still mop the floor with them.
The devs are shrinking the maps a bit, making more dead zones which should shorten the chase. Which is really all a good killer needs. Quicker chases won. Then they start to put pressure on the survivors, and get that snowball going.
4 randoms is almost a guaranteed 4k. Watch some streamers and perfect your craft and accept the occasional loss. It happens to us all.
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I mean... the most definitly can.....im not saying they should but they can easily.
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Bhvr can but people like to play with their friends. it's more enjoyable to play with with friends then solo. Im usually solo myself but the times that I do play with friends they are more enjoyable. Swf was always intended to be in the game and bhvr seems to have no intrest in removing or nerfing it so all I'm going to say is that if you think bhvr should remove or nerf swf then git gud. Like clevite said not all swf are sweaty tryhards some of them like to mess around.
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Yeah, I agree with the sentiments of the others. Is the game best optimized to accommodate playing against a team of survivor friends? No, perhaps not. That being said, this call for removing it completely is unrealistic for many reasons (some of which are listed above). I do think some simple things can be done to appease killers when they get matched with swf. Both pre-trial and new post trial mechanics could add new life to the game and help the difficulty when playing these groups--I believe Scott Jund's (I think it was?) presented a pre-trial suggestion that seemed well received, though nothing came of it. Perks like DS, which people see as being exploited by red rank swf groups can be reworked (and often seem to have straightforward and viably suggested reworks). What's more, individuals have suggested small de-buffs for swf teams or, at the very least, letting killers know in on the post game screen they were matched with a swf team (and maybe reward killers that go up against these teams more bloodpoints in these instances).
Honestly, I tend to feel BHVR's handling off swf groups is more problematic than swf's in themselves.
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So we should be punished for playing against groups that were never even intended to be in the game?
I don't want to punish people for playing with their friends I'd just like to play the game and not have SWF toxic squads ruin it.
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There's a live stream for it that said it was always intended also punished how?
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yes sir. jk. no.
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Yes they totally aren't saying that to cover their asses after not dealing with it for Y E A R S.
If it was intended that's why there are so many perks that are completely worthless in a SWF group, or the fact that there's no in-game mic system, or how we have had years of continual nerfs to survivors because SWF can abuse mechanics.
You're right, it was always intentional and not just hastily thrown together.
Not saying I want SWF gone, I just want it to be equal to that of regular, isolated survivors. That's what the game was always intended to be and what is/was balanced around.
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the stream was years ago, so it wasn't covering their asses for years.
they had the choice between KYF or SWF to begin with, they decided KYF was to go in first https://youtu.be/gTpZSllfMmw?t=533
You'd have to be pretty insane to actually think in 2016 they'd make a game with teams and not intend to include a group up function, like you have to realise how that kills the appeal of a game for 95% of people.
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It was intentional,it arrived around a month after launch. Loads of people moan about how slow the devs are to do anything,so do you really believe they threw SWF together in a few weeks?
What do the perks have to do with whether SWF was intended or not? Should they only have perks that cater to SWF??? That makes zero sense. There are solo players out there. A lot more than lost killers seem to think as I have been in a lot of lobbies where the killer moans about SWF but actually all of us respond saying weare solo players. Stop fixating on who is in your lobby and who they might be in contact with. You're probably wrong 80% of the time anyway.
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Since there is such a strong sentiment toward maintaining the social aspect of the game, let's make it MORE social! Add a 6th player who helps the killer. A weak little creature that annoys survivors, but cannot kill them. Most importantly, give this new player optional game-supported comms with the killer.
Killers can choose to have a helper or not. SWF teams will always be prioritized to verse killers with a helper in matchmaking. Solo killers, then, will far more often verse solo survivors.
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Ok something u might don't know about.
In the forums every once in a while there are people complain about swf. BUT, even tho I'm playing lots of killer, I believe it shouldn't be reworked at all. Why you may ask? Well, if they remove the ability of playing with friends people will probably be mad about that, cuz I personally want to play 4 man dbd sef without comms. Now, people always forget the people who play this game as a job.
YouTubers and streamers, many of streamers play with their audience and that's how the make a living. Both YouTubers and streamers make a living out of content which could be on a form of swf. If you remove that ability or contain it significantly then u make their jobs harder.
In conclusion, I personally believe that it shouldn't change at all.
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a rework, maybe but how?
removal hell no talk about killing a game
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But you can punish killers playing on comms
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So youtubers are more important than my fun
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The only bit here I can really agree with you here is showing who's playing together in the lobbies. This could really go a long way for killers and it wouldn't be some game breaking issue. Simple little friends icon that's all. "Then killers will dodge games of 3 or 4 SWF!" Is it better to play the match, stomp the killer, and they just give up mid game?
You missed the part about low ranks being actual new players. It's not all returning players and the like. My brothers got the game and I've been showing them how to play killer and what not. The matches you get into, on a brand new account, are terrible. I can't see how anyone ACTUALLY new to the role would have fun or the willingness to learn. For example the highest rank this account has been at was 16. Rank reset happened, turned 17. Play a match, the first match after rank reset, there's a rank 5 Feng in my lobby... I play those ranks I know what to do but what if one of my actual noob brothers played this match? One of them doesn't even notice a survivor he looked right at sometimes just to give you an idea...
You can't nerf SWF, as soon as you attack party play in general you're game will start dying. There is no issue with buffing killers if they ACTUALLY need a buff. No killer wants to hear "well just play Spirit... play Billy... etc." they wanna play who they find the most fun but also have good games. It's not like survivor where besides being nitpicky like their cries or Blendette for maximum immersion, they're just skins. You know why people played Nurse for example? You can't loop her O.O the most dominate killer and she got nerfed. Everyone would run Ruin because being gen rushed in a coordinated game is very easy, that got nerfed. Now you're seeing a lot of killers run Pop.
You simply can't and they won't nerf party play. The most they could do is nerf the perks that are being used too much or other fixes to the general game (the most recent patch of gen times and loops is a FIX not a blatant buff for killers). Buffing killers is also something they could actually do. I mentioned Nurse, a lot of the killers should have been brought UP to her level not nerf her. Freddy is the only killer I've seen some people say is actually OP although that's not too often and idk why. He's never mentioned like I stated above with Billy and Spirit (arguably the best you can play currently). Ghostface is strong, Huntress as well if you can get into her play style, Oni is strong as well although Billy does essentially the same and is easier to play. I would argue Myers, Doc, and Wraith are also in a good spot but some people would tell you otherwise. Idk where Nurse sits anymore so... The rest are either considered average or bad, there's your real problem.
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"that is why they dont buff killers or nerf survs or gens"... You do realize Survivors have been getting nerfed every single patch for over 6+ months and literally the entire next patch is solely based on nerfing the crap out of survivors and buffing killers even more right?
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It amazes me that people think voice comms belong in a game like DbD.
What's even more amazing is that people think SWF teams do not need any balance changes to offset the increased coordination.
Survivors had no problem complaining about Nurse and Spirit being too strong.
But when killers ask for something to be done about SWF we get called entitled.
I wonder if the devs will eventually recognize this bias in the community?
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There's an established expectation of being able to play with and talk to people without anything that even feels like mechanical "punishment" or disincentivization in modern multiplayer games involving any form of team play. An expectation as established as that isn't something many devs would want to mess with, for a very good and understandable reason.
There's a reason it's very rare to see any approach to balancing party play that doesn't come down to one or a combination of:
- Seperate queues (usually solo queue and "mixed" queue)
- Party size restrictions between ranked/casual modes or even specific rank (brackets)
- Just putting voice chat in the game to begin with so everyone has the option
- Acknowledging an advantage by trying to match parties vs parties whenever possible even in the "mixed" queues
And that's because most other approaches go against that expectation. Just because a game is an assymetrical one doesn't allow it to escape that expectation.
Doesn't mean nothing can be done, but it yeets many things straight off the table and into the nearest trashcan. Things like removing the option of party play or trying to interfere with VOIP.
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No, people whose jobs are dependent on swf are more important than your fun.
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@CLAUDETTEINABUSH You're concerned about making the "jobs" of streamers harder? Yes, an income from playing video games must be such a tough "job."
@yobuddd I actually really like your idea!
Killers can choose to have a helper or not. SWF teams will always be prioritized to verse killers with a helper in matchmaking. Solo killers, then, will far more often verse solo survivors.
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This "killers need to 4k at all times"-bias?
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It's almost like normalizing two outliers is a lot more realistic than butchering the game for half of your playerbase.
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They picked the wrong field of work tske their comms or remove swf their bad decision isn't my problem
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A Player base that wants an unfair advantage that will still cry for more nerfs
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Ah yes, lets remove the way people can play with their friends in a survival game
Brilliant idea
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Yes if its giving an unfair advantage you don't have to cheat to play with friends unless you are a scrub that needs that crutch
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Talking to friends to communicate = cheating?
Someone tell those running CSGO, Siege, Overwatch, DOTA, League, Valorant, and every other game ever made
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People don't take the game that ######### seriously and neither should you.
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Remove = Backlash
Rework = Impossible to edit SWF itself, and editing something else in-game could be risky.
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This is probably bait, but Ill bite
Remove SWF and DBD immediately dies. Like really. It will.
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Happy?
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Say they gave you what you want. They remove SWF. What would have to happen next would not be something you want to experience.
- Killers destroy solo teams. That would become the norm and developers would either have to nerf the tar out of killers, or buff the tar out of survivors. This would put you right back where you are now.
- Survivors want to play with their friends in a way that matters. Custom game (KYF) is not the answer. They will lobby hop until they get in a game with each other. Wait times for killers would be a nightmare! You would see people in and out of your lobby until they got the one they wanted. You would still be facing SWF, but the game likely had to rebalance as mentioned above.
- The number of survivors who would quit playing the game all together would likely cause a disaster of the que times. I don't feel like sitting in que for 30 plus minutes to play a game just to destroy a solo que group. No thanks.
SWF is not going anywhere. They need to buff killers and solo players and balance around comms/SWF play. That is the only way to fix the situation. It was completely idiotic to try and balance the game around solo play to begin with. A 9 year old could foresee that players would find a way to play with friends using comms.
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Yes Those games were built around it did wasn't your communication completely cancels killer powers perkd add-ons and strategies there's a reason the devs fought to keep swf out of the game its cheating
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Then why talk about the game on comms cheating is cheating and thats cheating but your ok with cheating as long as it screws killers over
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Killers: if you’re having problems with the game just play swf
Also killers: Devs remove swf plz
This kind of underhanded bs needs to stop
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If you're a good killer, you don't have to worry about swf because you can.. kill them? Seriously..
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I know what the devs have said about SWF lol.
And if you noticed, he only provided an explanation as to why SWF is staying. He didn't explain why SWF doesn't need a nerf.
If you read my comment, my personal opinion is that SWF shouldn't be in the game. But since the devs want it to stay, they have to nerf SWF in some way.
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Oh, so it's okay to leave SWF the way it is because there are a lot of players that use the feature?
That's basically like saying "SWF is a balance issue, but we're going leave it be because any nerfs would inconvenience a large number of players"
I mean, who cares about the killers who have to put up with it, am i right?
Also, I thought most survivors played solo. Wouldn't that mean it hurts less people than you think?
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Where did you even get that idea from lol?
Because I criticized SWF as a legitimate balance issue?
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Playing from both killer (R14) and survivor (R10) point of view. Yes SWF does give an advantage. It's easier to know who's being chased, when gens are gonna be done, if someone has spine chill and the killer is coming the group's way. Often times as killer this is actually quite infuriating but at the end of the day it's essential to the game. Many people including myself group with friends for SWF sometimes to teach our other friends to play or to just obsess over the game and play a few matches together and have a laugh when someone gets smacked. We don't win every game but maybe we're just not coordinated. It does sucks as a killer when you're met with stingy premades who constantly follow each other around doing flashlight saves and pallet drops and hook pushes and with DS, DH and BT being really popular amongst survivors recently it's hard to even get a 2k but removing SWF wouldn't end well. Sure there's ways around it such as icon indication of parties or killer buffs or survivor debuffs for SWF but what's that actually going to fix? The killer will probably immediately DC when they see a premade and if they don't and actually play that match they'll just be mad after that they were matched with premades. With the gen repair changes happening soon it should help slow the game down a bit and grant killers a better chance but in the end this will probably still be an issue for killer mains as SWF does grant an advantage but besides nerfing perks or add-ons the Devs can't do much because either way one side is going to feel it's not fair.
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Another "let's kill the game" post. Truly epic
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How would imposing a repair and healing speed penalty on SWF teams kill the game?
Voice communication in a game like DbD is a huge advantage. It takes away much uncertainty and allows survivors to be even more efficient. Is it so unreasonable to ask these players to accept a penalty considering they get to use the power of voice communication?
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It's unreasonable to assume everyone on SWF is even using voice communication.
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Then do we let people who use voice communication get a free pass?
Most people who don't use comms are teaming with other skilled players anyway. I doubt the penalty would affect them that much.
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I'm not for punishing players who are doing nothing that warrants it. That's a flawed system.
Also, a majority of SWF that play this game are probably just talking to their friends about their day while playing DbD, not being ultra strategists. There's probably less than 1% that need this change, so we'd be affecting the other 99% of SWF. I'll pass.
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You can nerf a specific character without screwing over the entire playerbase of that role. You cannot nerf SWF without touching solo survivor, at all ranks mind you. Considering that for new players the game already is killer sided (the more you learn about the game, the more survivors have an edge, but no one knows how to run anything killers are stronger) it's very delicate, very hard and if you come in here asking for SWF to be nerfed you better come with a plan ready to do that without screwing over the majority of the survivor playerbase.
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You actually had a good argument when you said the penalty would hurt the SWF teams that don't use voice communication.
But then you ruined it by saying SWF teams are mostly just chatting anyway. You know that isn't the case. Those teams are talking about the killer.
In a game like DbD, survivors having voice comms is a balance issue. It leads to very unpleasant matches for killers. It's up to the devs to figure out a compromise.
But let me stress, you made a good point. Killers might just have to settle with the devs nerfing survivors as a whole.
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