The placebo effect.
Ok let’s talk about the coming gen speed changes. Am I the only one who sees this change as useless?
so why is it when survivor nerfs happen they have an opportunity to completely bypass it as if it never happened?
maybe if all 4 survivors are solo ques it might work, but once you get a 2,3 or 4 man swf 9 times out of ten one of them is running prove thy self . And this is going to make that 5% useless and we will have the same gen speeds as we do now. If you really want to make it a big difference to actually change the way the game is played for real the speed reduction will need to be 50% that way it takes 3 people to make a difference on one gen and 4 for a 200% repair speed. I don’t think a 5% reduction and then giving them an option to completely negate the reduction is a good change. We see too much of this smoke and mirrors style patches just to make it seem like things are being balanced when it’s really not.
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The change is ONLY meant to stop gens from being done before a killer can even get there. It's not a huge difference with multiple people on gens, just adds 8 seconds of repair to 4 people repairing a gen together.
But they've also reduced the great skillcheck bonus too.
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And they added an increase to the skillcheck bonus to another perk, they really haven’t done much it won’t make a difference.
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Thing is the chances of it becoming a "meta" perk you always have is low. There are more useful perks to take.
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Sorry, was away for a while. Would you happen to have a link to the changes?
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Here is the thing though, anything that requires survivors to run other perks then the meta is a good thing for killers.
But you are correct that this wont help much, it will just mean survivors aware of this will do separate gens which is the most efficient way of gen-rushing anyway.
But as was mentioned, this is not to stop gen-rushing perse, its just to make it so that the killer has a chance to reach the otherside of hte map before a gen is done and honestly there is a big difference between going to gen, being about 20 meters out, having it pop with the survivors running everywhere, and walking up to survivors committing to finishing the gen, as that can give you a hit or two in which can make all the difference.
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at least its something,I still think the genrush nerf is almost nothing considering they buffed other perks probably no one gonna use cuz ds,dead hard and crutch perks exist
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You, sir, are smoking something. 😂 50% 😂 LUL
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Wish I was but for it to make any kind of difference with people 4 manning a gen it really does need to be that drastic.
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What do you mean no ones gonna use? prove thy self is commonly run by at least 1 person in a 4 man.
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I just want to take a second to clarify something here because a 50% penalty would be impossible.
With the way the efficiency penalty works, the amount of charges people put into a generator are reduced by 10% (now going to be 15%) for each additional survivor working on the generator. That means that with four people on a generator, you'll all be putting in 0.55 charges per second rather than 1 for a total of 2.2 charges per second. That's just about the 200% repair speed you're talking about.
A 50% penalty would mean that with two other survivors on the generator, you wouldn't be making any progress at all. With a third, you would actually be regressing the generator at half speed.
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Using Stake Out to get this added bonus means one less Meta Perk for this Survivor, which can make a difference.
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Prove thyself won't negate the change completely. It removes only one penalty, so it will still be slower with multiple survivors and prove thyself on a gen than it is at the moment with multiple survivors and prove thyself.
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Let them bring prove thyself
- It's a wasted perk slot aside from the bloodpoint gain - I'd rather them have that instead of bond, dead hard, reselience, spine chill which will actually help them extend chases and lead me away from their mates allowing them to sit on generators
- people who run prove thyself (unless they are potatoes who think it's a good gen perk) use it to max out their objective points early, so they don't have to sit on gens and instead focus on getting chased, pulling off flashlight plays, etc. I love playing against these players because they actually want to focus on the fun part of the match and are not too fussed about rushing through the objective.
- It might sound counter-intuitive to bring a gen perk, so you don't have to do gens, but at least in my experience, more often than not it is actually the case
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I second this when I play survivor I use prove they self to max out my objective points. Then I go for saves and get Agro on the killer.
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Are you serious it doesn’t just negate 1 it negates it for whoever else is on the gen with them negates 3 at best if only 1 of 4 is running it. Read the description it’s whoever’s in the radius.
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Thanks for clarifying that, but it still stands maybe this is just a console thing but in most swfs prove thyself is usually run by 1 of the 4 so it still negates it if one person is running it while the other 3 run the meta it’s still a useless change tbh. So one “wasted”perk slot out of 16 isn’t as bad as people are making it out to be and I’m feeling this is a we don’t want someone to make sense, because they may increase the % reduced issue.
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Sounds good to me! jk
What I think would be more fair than the proposed changes, is to make it so that survivors start their repair speed at .55 c/s, and then build momentum as they 'settle in' to repairing. Say, a 20% increase in charges used every second, with a lower speed ceiling for each survivor on the gen.
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Stake Out only gets tokens if you are in the Killer's TR though, and fairly slowly at that. That means that not only will the survivor not be on a generator, but they also have a far higher chance of getting found.
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I think you are underestimating Stakeout. I run it every match and it's pretty darn reliable and always adds value. It essentially makes up for times spent into stealth by converting it into action speed with garenteed greats. Probably my favorite perk on survivor. Also helps making plays like intentionally failing a skill check to lure a killer away from your teammates doing gens on the other side of the map. Then you use the tokens to get repairs back quick when the killer leaves. Has come in clutch quite a few times with both heals and gens. Greats give 3x points as well so hitting caps is a lot quicker for both altruism and objective.
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The game completely favors survivors. A 5% debuff to gen stacking is as far as they'll go to ever hurt survivors ever again now.
But don't worry, incase anyone gets mad, they'll double the bloodpoints from every great skill check, whilst also slowing down moris so animations don't play until we lock it in, buying survivors even more time.
Also don't fear, they will never touch infinite object of obsession, they'll never stop Decisive Strike being able to stack and be used by multiple survivors, they'll never dare do anything to actually rebalance the game. This patch is the weakest thing they could have done to help killers and even then they had to give survivors a massive buff to bloodpoint gain to do that.
But Nurse being the only killer left with enough mobility to challenge SWF? nerfed. Most killer are low-mobility and need hex ruin to pace the game? nerfed. Sabotage that takes 10s and breaks hooks for 30-60s? nah too difficult, 2.5s and 20s break and if you have a toolbox killer can't properly interrupt you so you guarantee the sabotage.
There's a reason no one is playing killer anymore without moris. There is no fun left for killers.
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Nah fam. You are on some serious #########. Or just completely delusional.
Devs don't need to make a BIG difference. What you're suggesting would absolutely break the game. The majority of teams in this game are random. They are not SWF. So the gen speed change, combined with the map changes, loop changes, palette changes, etc. will make a significant difference in bridging the gap between SWF/Killer and only further cuck random teams - which, again, is most teams.
Seriously.
WTF.
😂
Take the win bro.
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LUL @ the game completely favors survivors. 🤣 Maybe there was a time. But that time has been over for a while.
This patch will bring some of the biggest changes, in favor of killers, that DBD has ever made. Way to be ungrateful.
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Bro the majority of all games are SWF now. Pretty sure you can hunt down the time where it was finally admitted. SWF is the status-quo, not randoms. The game does not even attempt to reflect this but that is the case now.
The whole time SWF was the minority nothing was done, and now it's the majority even less will be done because it's a cash-cow.
People using comms so you can't mind-game because someone uses object of obsession, people calling for help so 2 people come bodyblock or follow with a flashlight to ensure you can never pick someone up, people stacking DS intentionally with unsafe unhooking to prevent anyone dying during EGC, this is the norm and it's why the wait times just keep going up and less people want to play killer. Every single time Killers developed a core meta, it has been nerfed and obliterated from the game. We had one killer left who had the mobility to cover gens on non-coldwind-farm maps, the nurse, and she got nerfed to oblivion for being the last effective killer too.
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Survivors get free points just for dying as obsession now, you get points just for vaulting in a chase iirc. You're absolutely coddled.
Killers aren't even allowed to score if they hit you at the gates, it just doesn't count. You can stack DS on us, borrowed time can be activated by the same person on 3 unhooks in the span of 10 seconds, SWF is the majority of all games now and the final killer with high mobility got nerfed and hex ruin's nerf crippled all low-mobility killers who have no means to keep up with the game's pace anymore.
Every core meta of killers has been nerfed. Survivor meta of stacking DS and borrowed time? Nope, it's never going to get touched, because it'll impact their bottom line.
It is 100% pro-survivor, but SWF seem to think that as long as one of them can die in the game then it's still pro-killer, even though killers are tougher to rank up and we have to get at least 3 kills and 9-10 hooks to have a chance of ranking up (Every time you heal we lose all the score we got from injuring you, because that's how anti-killer it is).
You do what, 2 gens and do it with co-op and you're near maxing pips. Do a gate and that's another third of a pip alone. No reason to leave early during EGC because every second alive is just more free score for you until the killer chases you off. But killers? Play shape and if you don't max out your stalking on all 4 survivors, even with the no-one-escaped bonus you won't max out deviousness pip.
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I don't know why you keep bringing up points, it's proven, time and time again across a million matches that a killer will get more points than survivors, even when a team of survivors escapes they can end up with less points than a killer, I really don't know why you're using the system we use to spend BP as a reason that the game is survivor sided.
DS & Borrowed time together isn't an issue, this 100% means that you chased after the one being unhooked instead of the unhooker that you were right next to, you just need more time in the game, or if you have a tonne of time you've hit your peak and likely won't get any better so keep playing, be deranked to the rank you're supposed to be at and when the matchmaking is fixed you can continue on with your 1/2Ks or whatever it is you average.
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Y’all killer mains ijnit asf. That new DBD Mobile parody my samination is so accurate it hurts.
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So you're telling me it's impossible for SWF to stack DS? I see this every other game now. It's end game collapse, you can't be tunneling, it's EGC, by definition no one is getting tunneled as they made it to the end. Know what SWF do? You hook player 1, so player 2 unhooks Player 1 who has DS. You down player 2 for this, and hook them. Player 1 takes a slash from borrowed time if he can, unsafe unhooks player 2 and now both have DS active. Unless they are on the wrong end of a rectangular map, they can crawl to the gates in time, if you pick either one up, they deduct -3 from your pip for DS being fired, and get away guaranteed. If player 1 lacks DS, they use player 3 and player 1 takes borrowed time smack to ensure bodyblock, and still 2 people have DS active.
And killers earn a tiny bit more than survivors, it's like 25k versus 22k on a good game, but that's 1 killer versus 4 survivors, and again survivors keep getting more and more ways to earn free points. "aww diddums you DS'd him and died anyway, here's 1000 points just for being the obsession". Survivors get more points every patch, and now they don't even lose items. Unless I waste a perk slot on franklin's demise, as long as you escape in any capacity, you don't even use up your items anymore, you get to keep fully used items. I assume you've seen how long a semi-decent flashlight actually lasts against a killer, just how many blatant stuns it lets you get.
Survivors get to stack extremely efficient OP meta perks, which never get nerfed in the slightest, whilst killers are getting nerfed at every possible opportunity. Hexes are useless, most killers have no way to be mobile enough to cover the map now, and whilst survivors keep getting new ways to earn ever-more points, we get shafted by things like "well if you were near the gate, your attacks just don't count lol"
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I'm sorry that you struggle at such an easy game.
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"Survivors don't have it that easy"
*explains how survivors game the system and how their core meta perks get abused to defeat their purpose and make it easier*
"lol well you're just bad then"
Outstanding counter.
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You must be though, anyone who's first point of balance is to talk about how "free" survivor points are when every man and woman under the sun knows killers earn more clearly isn't thinking straight, anyone who constantly complains about the meta perks but probably also likely complains about any survivor perk buffs isn't worth talking about, try killing people during the match I don't see how people see end game all the time with 4 survivors still up, you have to be pretty terrible at this game if your'e constantly end gaming it with 4 survivors and none of them are dead on hook but ready to pounce with the indestructible and undefeatable perks.
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My complaint is killer meta gets nerfed constantly whilst survivors don't. When was the last time they fixed DS? As I've already explained, it's easy to stack and abuse it, but will there ever be a patch even attempting to mitigate DS abuse? no, that would be too anti-survivor. Hex ruin, Nurse in general, iron grasp, the list goes on for the amount of times they obliterate killer meta.
And yeah, I complain when survivors keep getting new ways to earn even more BP whilst killers get things like no BP gain when attacking at the gates and trying to shoo off gate campers. On a good game I'll earn 25k or so BP as killer, top 2 survivors will earn ~20k, other 2 will earn 10k+. all 4 of them will go on to afford new items and addons (but they never lose items without dying now anyway so hey they even get to save BP now), at a significantly faster rate than I can. Best items for killers all revolve around minimizing our score. Sure a mori gives as much pip as a direct sacrifice, but you lose all your extra pip and BP from 1-2 more chases, 3-4 (or more) injuries inflicted, and that's how it works for killers; almost all our ultra-rares are built around minimizing our progression. Meanwhile survivors get to keep ultra-rare items if they survive at all, and things like good flashlights can stun us 6, 8, maybe even 10 times with reasonable add-ons. We are forced to spend more, whilst survivors save more and overtime just earn more and more.
But if you think everything is fine, you should be fine going back and waiting longer and longer queue times as less and less people play killer.
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I'll just play killer because I'm actually competent at it, I'm surprised killers haven't gotten tired of "nerf everything" yet, DS was nerfed, it's way better than it used to be, I very rarely if ever get struck by DS but I know I'm competent enough to win without tunneling.
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So people stacking DS in EGC to prevent anyone being picked up is countering tunneling?
Gee almost makes you wonder why every killer only plays if they have moris now.
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This is simply false. SWF teams do not out number random teams. Sorry.
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Again, false. The majority of teams are not SWF.
Not every core meta of killers have been nerfed. But you're right, DS and BT probably won't get touched, and shouldn't, because camping and tunneling aren't perks - they are rampant cheap game play that occurs in almost every single match. :) So they are here to stay. You can thank your killer brotheren for that.
It is absolutely not 100% pro-survivor. Almost every patch for the last 18ish months has mainly contained changes and nerfs that effected survivors more deeply in an effort to balance the dreaded SWF, all the while solo survivors - the actual majority - get cucked in the process.
I do agree it is more difficult to rank up as killer - absolutely. It's a broken system and I blame some of the outrageous and unfun sweat on the broken pip system, for sure. And no, you cannot do 2 gens and max pip. Sorry.
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So just making it that DS can't fire during EGC, or that your own DS turns off if you unhook someone with DS, is pro-tunneling? I'll tell you what it is, it's lazy design allowing for open abuse.
Pretty sure the devs said the majority of all games are SWF now too, unless I'm mistaken. Was like 53% or something and they have a higher average winrate too. I'd wager that percentage would be higher if you excluded all games where the average rank is worse than say 10.
Also yeah I'm pretty sure you get almost the entire way there through 2 gens with some mild co-op action and a gate.
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On the topic of prove thyself, yes I believe its a decent perk but it does still have drawbacks. For one, one or more survivors have to use up a perk slot just to gain normal efficiency speed when doing a generator with another teammate. Another reason why prove thyself is not always favorable is that it encourages doing gens together, but this is almost never the most efficient way of doing gens. If three people were on a generator with prove thyself and the killer happens to go to that generator, the killer is pressuring three survivors simultaneously rather as opposed to just pressuring one survivor. This is huge as half or more than half of the survivor team is off generators thus not progressing their win condition.
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like i said, i actually kill people during the match and not at the end of it.
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So you say camping/tunneling occurs "almost every single match"? So what do you consider camping/tunneling?
Camping - Is the killer staying CLOSE to a hooked survivor. Definitely not a solid strategy, because it ruins everyone's experience including the killer's.
Tunneling - Chasing a single person until they're dead. Now, if some stupid survivor is going to unhook near the killer, it's not tunneling to go for the injured person first. However, if this killer ignores people they find anywhere else and ONLY searches for a specific person, that is tunneling.
Camping happens MUCH more frequently than tunneling. But the problem is people have begun to say chasing an injured survivor instead of going for the rescuer is tunneling, which just isn't the case.
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Honestly, the biggest issue I have is that it's almost a crutch for skill checks, it only helps those who can't hit greats
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Well say you hit about 50% greats or so, that just means your tokens will last you the entire generator instead of just part of the gen. When you under pressure like finishing the last bit of gen or heal off before the killer gets too close it can help land them in tense situations.
To be honest I play survivor because it's super chill and easy anyway so I'm fine with a crutch
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Honesly, if the rescuers would stop vanishing, I'd stop going for the unhooked survivor. Hooking the same guy doesnt get me my chili
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Yeah whenever a topic pops up about camping/tunneling or just saying slugging is bad. I often have to wonder what their meaning of these terms are. Since well, i seen people call a three gen, camping. Going from gen to gen, to keep the survivors off them, is camping. That or a injured Bill who just got off unhook a short time ago, try to hide in a locker in the basement, right in front of the killer, as they are bringing a survivor down to hook. I seen get called tunneling, rather than the Bill doing something stupid. Since they did not have head on or inner strength. That and heck, even seen some say camping is ok [staying near or around the hook], if done during the end game when the survivors might have 99% the gates or possibly even open them with the hook being near a exit gate or the exit gates are spread out, and not right at the start to the first victim you find.
Something you bring up as well in your own post when giving context to tunneling, unhooking a survivor in front of the killer, when you don't have burrow time, plan on bodyblocking for them or trading hooks. Well, can you really put all the blame on the killer for downing the injured survivor? When it was the survivors who made a risky/dumb play of unhooking in front of the killer. Since it does seem like, some just use these terms to ignore context and just pin the blame fully on the killer, without asking themselves. Did i make a poor play? Was this a bad idea? Which context, can change things massively. Since context, can make a world of difference and make it seem more like the survivor made a bad play, rather than the killer is the scum of the earth. For this topic is about gen times and well, what is a good way to stop survivors from doing gens? Hooking or downing one or more. Injuring them might also give you more time, if they choose to go to a safe place and heal up.
That and hitting the survivor who just got unhooked, might allow the killer to get information like if one of the survivor has burrow time or they might be running a perk like save the best for last, so if they hit the survivor and they don't have burrow time. They can still catch up with the other person [which might be possible even if burrow time is in play], who made the unhook and possibly get two downs and at least one hook, with a possible third survivor, getting off gens, to heal up a downed team mate. While some would scream their heads off slugging bad [ slugging aka leaving a person on the ground who is in dying state], even when the intent is not to waste the survivors time and have them bleed out but rather to keep the survivors off gens by forcing them to do something else. Since well dropping a survivor on the floor, to go stab his buddies that are busy destroying near by hooks, bodyblocking and the like, might be a better idea than risk your prize escaping, by traveling to another hook. Which going back to unhooking a survivor, if they do have burrow time. Well that gives the killer in slight and make them aware of a perk one of the survivors has now.
Context can make a massive difference. For some survivor groups, well like to swarm the hook like Leeroy jenkins the second someone is hook. Rather than waiting a bit, to make sure the killer is far away. Since sometimes a killer might stay in an area longer than normal. For oh hey, a hook is near an almost done gen. Killer has pop, well hook the survivor and kick that gen. Also a pallet nearby the killer can break. Than go off to hunt the next survivor. Yet if the survivors leave marks all around the hook or just rush towards the hook in plain slight of the killer. Well, are the survivors really giving any reason for the killer to leave, when they are all rushing towards the hook like Leeroy jenkins and making it clear as day to the killer? Sounds like the killer would be wise to stay near where the survivors are, since none of them are doing gens and just seem to want to die.
For often times the words tunneling, camping and slugging are all brought up but no one really gives context to what they mean. Since i could have a massively different meaning for that word than they are using. [which is why i am thankful for you bringing up the meaning of these terms] That or one us might be using the term correctly and the other person using it incorrectly. If it not just a case of someone simply hating anything a killer does, that doesn't benefit them and would rather have them start a boyband with their hit song being called, "i'll kill you that way". For some just do seem to want to limit what a killer can do, even if it logical and fair to keep survivors from doing nothing but gens for a majority of the match. That or just call certain things bad, without thinking about the context behind the actions. https://youtu.be/oliCVn7Ic68
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Tunneling is hitting/chasing a fresh offhook. And Camp/Tunnel/Slug is 90% of matches I am in these days. Just tunneling those fresh offhooks, slugging them to chase down the offhooker. Rinse and repeat. It is lazy, cheap gameplay but I agree that at least some of the problem is survivors and killers being able to pip is vastly different.
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This is a post from Feb of this year, from a Dev:Community Manager with statistics in how many matches are SWF. Vaslty less than solo survivors. SWF are not the majority by a large margin.
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Okay so we should punish killers for poor survivor saves? "Tunneling" comes from "Tunnel Vision". But, let's say that you're right, and tunneling is "hitting an unhooked survivor". Now, in order for this to happen the killer needs to be close by the area of the hook. Which also means the "saver" is just going for unhooks without thinking that the killer WILL turn around and down them again and go after you. Why should the killer be punished for the "savers" poor judgement? I've been unhooked in front of the killer more times than I can count, and I NEVER thought it was tunneling. They're doing their job, and you made it easier.
Think about wolves or lions for example, do you know what they hunt for? The weak, sick and the young. They go for the easiest target, not the strong and difficult one. So you expecting a killer to go for the "saver" rather than the already injured person, is just an excuse for poor choices.
Granted there are times when you don't have a choice, but those are uncommon. The most common mistake by survivors which is blamed on killers is poor hook rescues. And it probably happens in 90% of your games because you're unhooking a survivor next to the killer or your team does it to you, and you automatically blame the killer for your team's mistake.
This isn't to be rude or accusatory to you, but just to show you a different perspective. If you look at what you said differently you may notice you're trying to accuse killers of being unfair for doing their objective. Minus Camping/Tunneling (how I explained them). Slugging is a different thing altogether, but there is slugging I'm okay with and slugging I believe ruins the game. There's a fine line with all three of those.
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For starters, it is not the hooked survivors fault that a team mate, and likely a rando, got them off the hook in front of a killer. So to you, Why should the fresh offhook be punished by the killer for an action completely out of their control. Second, what are survivors supposed to do when every hook, in 90% of games, are getting the proxy camp. And now maps are getting smaller. Killers like to say, "They should not have gone for the hook in front of me." but if you never leave the area there is no other option. And we are human beings, playing a game, not wolves fighting for survival. You make a conscious choice to ruin another human beings match when a killer repeatedly goes after a freshly offhooked survivor and does not let them even play. I play killer too, and I don't tunnel fresh offhooks, I don't hang around hooked survivors, and I don't slug survivors down so I can leisurely hook em all for the 4k. Most likely because I survivor main, I don't participate in poor sportsmanship when I am in a killer match. And you know what, my score does not suffer for it and I avoid 99% of negative after-chat.
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I'd be very interested in what that chart looks like if you change it to only show games where the average rank was between 1 and 10. I strongly believe that chart is muddied heavily by the low-rank solos
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