If you're smart, you'll stop running Self-care
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so you have one injured person somewhere on the map with self-care
He can sit in a safe place and heal for 32 seconds
Or he can take another survivor away from a gen to heal him for 16 seconds right? But... thats one person healing and one being healed ? You not only bunch up and loose map pressure but you tie up hands for 16seconds twice that's 32 either way.
This also puts you in activation for several killer perks , requires communication and travel times for both players.
If my buddie and I are the last alive and he's in a chase... he can't stop and heal me ima self care and at full health swap with him to extend the chase letting him also heal/toolbox a gen
Selfcare is one of the most powerful perks in the game, not because its good but because it takes co-op only actions and gives you that power.
Deliverance is another in the self care build that makes you
totally independent and thats a better power then any killer has : /
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Sure, just let me go to the other corner of the map so my teammate bot can heal me and miss skillchecks, or i could use self care anywhere without any time wasted.
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Self care gamers especially with sloppy butcher and other slow down perks/add ons are allies with the killer.
Just bring a med kit with two heals, bond, or inner strenght.
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16 second heal with 2 people not doing gens, or a 32 second self heal where the other person could be doing gens. Are you still sure about efficiency?
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The ruin was changed because the killer was getting pressure just by using a perk, the next thing would be to eliminate self-care because the same thing happens
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You know if you get someone to heal you you're basically wasting a similar amount of time considering you're getting two people to stop working on objectives for 16 seconds
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Herp Derp play the way I want you to tooooo!
No.
Gfy.
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Why so I have to depend upon others when they will sell me out to live anyways? Better off with and not need it then needing it and not have it. Plus easy way to get survival points.
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I disagree. It's not bad nor, is it really a huge time waster if you're using it correctly.
It's only bad if you're a dull blockhead with the perk and are using it constantly 24/7 during your matches for every possible heal. When in reality, that's not how you should be using it in the first place: obviously accept heals from anyone who's running bond, empathy, or aftercare and can find you really easily, obviously accept heals immediately after being unhooked (if safe and you have the time to do so) especially if they're running we'll make it or other perks that increase healing speed like Botany Knowledge, etc.
The perk itself is only as bad as how stupid you are with it, simple solution: don't be stupid with the perk, and it won't be a bad perk. The same logic can be applied to almost any other perk in the game - if you're being stupid with Dead Hard it's not a good perk, if you're being stupid with Object of Obsession it's not a good perk, etc. so on and so forth.
So how should you use Self-Care? For heals when you're limited on options: nobody else is around, perhaps everyone is already dead so there would be no reason not to use self care, perhaps you need an extra health state because everybody is dead or dying and you need the extra health state for protection to make safe(r) saves. Self-care can be used mid-chase if you can afford the few seconds of being stationary behind a vault or pallet, it can be a game-changing way to extend your chases if you manage to heal yourself back to full mid-chase. Self-Care can also be used to mop up a heal maybe you were being healed by teammates but the killer came and interrupted that heal, Self-Care is a perfect way to finish that off and get you back to full. It's also fine to use self-care if you're ahead of the game, the killer is struggling to apply pressure and gens are being done quickly so you can afford to spend that time self-caring. etc. As a general rule you can use Self-Care maybe one or two times per match outside of those conditions / situations that I already laid out
It also serves the dual purpose of making self-heals better when using a med-kit, the efficiency is increased by 10/15/20% so not only are you pulling off a heal with a medkit which takes the exact same amount of time as someone else healing you (16 seconds) but you're also using less charges to pull that heal off, leaving more charges for later to finish up a heal quickly or maybe even fit in multiple more heals depending on how good your medkit is.
TL;DR on "how should you use self-care?" use it as a last resort, preferring and attempting to get heals in almost any other fashion first and foremost before relying on self-care. Never as your primary method of healing, in this way it can be a very good and useful perk to have in your back pocket. If you don't believe me, please re-read the previous two paragraphs.
The only real problem with the perk is the widespread incorrect usage of the perk by bad players, but that's hardly a valid argument you can make that a bad player is what determines whether or not a perk is any good or not. Part of the reason for this is that Self-Care is a teachable that belongs to one of the original 4 survivors and one of 6 that are free to play. As such obviously it will naturally make its way into the hands of new players more quickly as opposed say, a perk like Decisive Strike which is a teachable owned by a licensed character.
A lot of these bad players can often bring their bad habits with them as they slowly climb up the ranks maybe even all the way to red when they shouldn't really be there in the first place. Simply because nobody told or taught them otherwise on how to properly use a deceptively simple perk in a far more nuanced, complex, and thoughtful manner. But again, bad players sticking a bad connotation and giving a bad name to a very decent if not good perk is not an actual point for argument, that's just a stigma.
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I don't know where you got your numbers but self caring with botany takes 24 seconds.
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If you use Self Care this sensibly, you're barely ever using it, making it again a bad perk. You could take something like DS that gives you consistent, massive value anytime the killer brings you closer to death, Iron Will which is valuable anytime you're wounded and in danger, Unbreakable, BT, etc.
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Thanks, but i'll prefer to stay dumb. 😘
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Sure, but sometimes it's better to be healed because that 16-32 seconds wasted by healing could be used to prolong your next chase and give your teammates freedom to do them.
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I never used Self Care. I didn't even level Claudette up to 40 to unlock it yet.
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I will run self care every now and then even though I am in red ranks. I get tired of finding survivors to heal me but they stay on the gen, I think fine we will do the gen then you heal me... then they run off. This happens far too often in solo queues.
You are correct that I don't deserve to be in red ranks though, I am purple ranks at best, but as long as you're doing something that benefits the team then it's harder not to get pips. I can't wait for the new matchmaking to see if that sorts the problem out.
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I hate running Self Care but at times it's necessary (mainly when solo queuing). It doesn't matter if me and everyone else is rank 1, because at any rank you can't rely on randoms to heal you because a lot of times they won't. If I don't have a medkit I'll usually run self care because taking 2 hits to get downed can makes a huge difference when looping the killer and can be worth the 30 seconds it takes to heal yourself.
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Yesterday i got a survivor in my team using both self care and adrenaline. With the last gen at 50% he still choosed to self care at the other side of the map.
I swear removing self care would be the biggest buff to solo survivor ever. It would remove all those bad survivor from the red ranks.
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I'll stop running self care when I get inner strength.
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I dont really see many people refusing to heal at reds. Often when I do run injured next to another survivor they will gladly heal me, unless it is completely pointless, such as legion who overuses FF and just runs off after hitting you, even if you are already injured.
I can count the amount of people who refused to out right heal me in the last month on my fingers and the number probably wont be higher than two guys.
As I said before, self care is fine, the down time is miniscule compared to other forums of healing, IS isnt as time efficient either, it is however two birds with one stone. Useful at green ranks, but reds arent plagued by noed.
Personally I like autodidact + solidarity combo, as it drastically cuts time "wasted" on healing, but it also removes the self sufficiency that SC provides and adds the unknown down time of traveling.
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I would like to make an argument for why I think everyone should run/use self-care. For me personally, because everyone ran self-care I was able to get to rank 1 very easily.
It's 32 seconds of being injured while you heal, sure, but it means others can focus on being chased or recovering, it's really helpful to me when people run it. Hell, with Sloppy and/or Thana the time is longer, meaning they get even more time on the hook, being chased or they can be self-caring as well which means a higher chance of a player being spotted and going down so the other person can heal to full. I've won matches, because of a Claudette that's self-caring in a corner, not gonna lie. I think self-care is a must-have for survivors.
-Sincerely, A Killer Main.
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18.72 seconds actually.
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Your math is so painfully incorrect it's not even funny. You can also check out that video above that someone else linked If you don't believe me.
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how to die as survivor try to open the door while having selcare get hit at 99% of the gate survivor starts selfcaring instead of opening the gate get hit again and this is why i run inner strength
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Self Care heals at 50% speed. Botany makes it 33% faster. Which makes you heal at 83% speed. Or 17% slower. 17% added to the normal 16 seconds is 18.72 seconds.
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"barely ever using it" which implies you still are using it though.
Even if you only used self-care once per match, that still brings it in line with the effect of other perks that only activate once. Two of the 4 examples you provided yourself are perks that can only be used once, DS deactivates after it's used and so does Unbreakable.
The difference is that Self-Care provides the possibility to be used more than once, even if you do only use it once, it can change the tide between whether you survive or whether you don't. Much in the same way that Unbreakable allows you to pick yourself up from the dying state once, or DS prevents you from being hooked completely once.
If anything, you're "barely using" the perks that you yourself mentioned namely Unbreakable and DS, you could go through a whole match without ever being slugged or tunneled while the DS timer is active. Whereas every match it's very likely that you'll at some point be injured and looking for a heal, making way for the extreme versatility that I already described in my previous post, just to rename a few: Healing yourself mid-chase, healing yourself when no one else can heal you (everyone else is dead), finishing off a heal from a teammate the killer interrupted, healing yourself more efficiently with a medkit, etc. just to name a few.
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Why not running self care with botany knowledge? Fast healing, counters slow down perks, faster healing others 😏
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So, hypothetical.
Survivor 1 is injured, and has self care.
Survivor 2 is not injured, does not have Prove thyself, and has nothing to speed up healing another survivor.
Survivor 1 and 2 arrive at a generator at the same time. They want to heal survivor 1 and complete the generator.
The fastest way to go about doing this is for survivor 1 to self care, and survivor 2 to repair the generator.
Healing 1 survivor takes 32 seconds of survivor time. This can be 16 seconds of 1 survivor, or 32 seconds from 2 survivors.
Repairing 1 generator takes 80 seconds of survivor time if only 1 survivor is doing it, but 92 seconds of survivor time if 2 survivors are repairing it.
Self care also makes your medkits MUCH stronger, getting 20% more use out of them can mean a lot when they're the particularly good ones. Self care can also be combo'd with botany knowledge for even longer lasting medkits, faster heals, and the ability to heal up other survivors quicker even when your medkit finally runs out.
Self care is also very strong with Resilience, you can 99 a heal and then hold it until you feel threatened, raking in that 9% bonus. Resilience ALSO guarantees that your self-healing goes faster with its 9% action speed bonus, as you're always injured when you're healing yourself ;)
And, critically, self care lets you heal when you can't safely meet up with another survivor, or the killer interrupted you getting healed. It gives you a tremendous amount of flexibility, combos amazingly with some perks, and lets you do more to ensure you can survive a trial.
It's also worth nothing that inner strength isn't as fast as some folks think. Just cleansing a totem takes 15 seconds, you need 8 seconds in locker and, assuming you don't want to be loud about it, another 4 doing quite locker entrances and exits, for 27 overall. That seems good to self care's 32, but it doesn't benefit from self care's synergies, and, importantly, inner strength has five uses for the entire trial, across all survivors, and needs you to actually go find a totem and locker. Self care is available any time, any where, as many times as you need it.
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DS and Unbreakable are ridiculously powerful effects that enable extremely bold plays by their presence as a safety net even if they aren't used. They directly undo time spent by the killer without wasting any of your time. Offensive use of DS doesn't rely on tunneling. Their activation conditions are less "everyone is dead" or "heal interrupted" and more "killer slugs in the mandatory slugging meta" or "killer dares to fulfill their objective by hooking". They are on another planet to Self Care, in my opinion.
In a game where the highest level survivors rarely bother healing at all, and healing itself is situational, a situational healing perk with big drawbacks cannot compete with heavyweights like DS.
Also, Self Care takes 32 seconds. If you get that off in chase, I tip my hat to you.
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In my opinion they function much the same way, the only reason Self-Care takes as much time as it does is because it is that versatile and can be used in so many different situations both defensively or aggressively in the middle of a chase. Although I would never make the claim SC is better than DS, all I'm saying is the perk has it's uses and threads like these which basically say "only idiots run Self Care" are blatantly false.
"Offensive use of DS doesn't rely on tunneling" -Swans
I want to briefly mention this is exactly why DS is a problem perk, and the fact that you mention this so openly proves that point, although this isn't the thread to talk about that, it was just a side thing I figured I'd mention since it's talked about so frequently.
Also, (though it should have been apparent) I guess I neglected to provide the hypothetical that Self-Care can be used in a chase after most of your heal has already been completed. So I guess you'll have to tip your hat to me because in that sense I've technically pulled it off.
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I can't rely on randoms to heal me. Or do anything else.
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The few times i run ill equip botany and a medkit with it self care boosts medkit heals that way its reliable but its not a bad perk it can be very usefull late gsme ive gotten doors open because ive healed first
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Self care heals you at 0.5 of the normal speed or at 50% speed. Botany makes it 33% faster resulting in 0.665 or about 67% healing speed. Healing with 0.665 (~67%) healing speed takes 24 seconds.
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I use inner strength personally bc it forces you to do the secondary objective and also gives you a quick heal but I don’t mind people who use self care
think about it like this: it takes 32 seconds to heal yourself with self care at base, but if you have someone else heal you it takes 16 seconds but you’re wasting 2 survivors time so you’re still wasting a net of 32 seconds
either way you waste 32 seconds so who cares. Just run inner strength it’s superior in every way lol
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I'm at a high rank and I use self-care on all my survivors. And I think I shouldn't be at a high rank, for sure, but that is where the game puts me based on the amount of time and matches I play. I'm not very good at looping, so if I'm hurt, usually the killer downs me quite fast. If I'm healthy, I can last longer and makes me do less mistakes, because I won't be panicked that a single attack will put me down.
Also, sometimes there are no survivors around to heal me and if I have to spend time looking for them, I might as well start healing myself. Of course not every situtation is good to use selfcare. For example, we need 1 gen left to finish, I will just do the gen instead of healing, but at 5 gens I will heal myself because if not, I will probably not get to see when there's only 1 gen left to do.
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.5 plus .33 is .83. Or 83%. DbD doesn't do there math the way you would expect.
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Id like to counter with Inner strength even on max ranks take less time to do a complete full heal than SC does. Self Care takes 32 seconds 40 if sloppy. Max Rank IS takes 22 and 20 on lowest I believe.
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Add in a need for locker, which may take you additional few seconds to get in also IS doesnt start as soon as you initiate the locker animation anymore, so another 2 or 3 seconds, then exit animations if you do it slowly.
SC can be done anywhere you want.
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Yeah but TYPICALLY it isn't smart to actually do it out in the open. Plus Inner Strength negates Nurses, Thana, sloppy, and deathbound
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To use IS, you need to find and clear a totem (so that takes time for both of those actions). Then you need to find a locker and get in, which also takes time. Then you need to crawl into said locker and sit and chill, also taking time.
There is also the risk of the killer using Iron Maiden so now the killer knows where you are. There's also the risk that you can't find a totem (either because you've been hit before so you needed it multiple times or you just have a hella efficient team or the RNG Gods have decided they hate you today and totems are all in the sneaky hiding spots) so now you have a healing perk that can't heal you.
There's certainly nothing wrong with people using IS over SC if that's your preference but people pretending like SC is some super bad perk with nothing but problems and risk love to absolutely ignore all the potential problems with all the other healing perks.
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Tbf Im not sure how an up too 40+ second heal is worth it in 99% percent of games.
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Which is fine, you're allowed to not like certain perks.
My FAQ thing is more for the "Self care is a fifth killer perk!!!" dum dums who are under the impression that SC shouldn't be used by anyone ever because THEY think it's a bad perk.
Personally, I prefer the versatility SC gives me. You personally might prefer the safety net of IS as there are less killer perks (and rarer as outside of Archive, Killers generally don't use Iron Maiden) that directly affect IS while accepting the risk that you might get to a point in the game where you're hurt and can't use it.
Neither of us are objectively wrong; it's just a play style difference.
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You can't use the time it takes to find another Survivor as a base of 10seconds and not include any time it takes to find a place to selfcare.
What if you aren't looking for someone and just happen to run into someone? Also 16seconds for two survivors =/= 32seconds total match time.
This is why I have an issue with Selfcare. It isn't the player taking time to heal themselves. Its the nonsensical math and cherry-picked situations self-care supports love to pull out and use. And they act like it proves something.
About your Inner Strength argument: This is a faulty argument and you know it. There are 5 totems in the match. If you are running Inner Strength you aren't popping every Totem you run into, and if, somehow, someone else gets to all 5 totems before you so they can use Inner Strength then they obviously need it more than you. Not that this would ever happen. Ever.
Also, running SC + BK is 2 perk slots, good on you if you think its worth it. I don't.
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Agreed! If you find a use good for you! As long as its not hurting the team go for it!
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yes you failed on your primary math, self care takes almost 30s to fully heal YOU! without sloopy butcher if the killer has it's 47s almost 50% of one gen did by a solo survivor so let's use math in the right way.
You take 30s to heal ONLY YOU so your teamate has the same ideia to self heal another 30s so it's 1 MINUTE with TWO PEOPLE healing themselves and 90% of the time thoose people are in corners of the map where's there's no safety AND most of the time those people get interrupeted and get down again and repeat this whole cycle so they go through the match without doing NOTHING.
When i play killer and people use self care it's a bless because they waste so many time that i can easily do my object wiithout problem but when i the survivor it's annoying se three guys without doing nothing each one healing themself in the corners and getting hit 2s after the heal to just repeat this process.
Inner Strenght it's much better people love to complain about noed and say that there's no gen rush in the game so if there's no gen rush why survivor don't have 10s each one to do totems? 4 survivors, each one do 1 totem, in 40s four totems got broken and later in the game you find the final and break too.
Survivors have to learn that, you only save someone when the killers it's chasing other person and then you HEAL the guy in right after the save because if the killer give up to the chase just to tunnel you he lost time chasing someone and this person get's a free escape, you probrablly gonna complete the heal because it's only 15s and there's tons of perks to help heal speed AND even if you don't it's probrablly that the other guy gonna have DS and if the killer it's smart he gonna chase the other one leaving him with time to find other people and complete the 2 last seconds to heal or work on a gen since people who have DS use to rush gens instead of get heals and get back to the game.
So it's completely bs those things you guys say that we waste time find other survivors, we can't heal on the hook, break totems for heals it's useless and yada yada yada if everyone in this game just did their part we would't need play in SWF but everytime i try random people they waste two minutes healing themselves without necessity and the killers wins with 5 gens no matter how long i loop him people are to afraid to stay injured and do their objectives.
BTW leveling up my jake from 1 to 50 i got almost 25 brown medkits, 12 yello medkits, 4 green medkits, 2 purple medkits and thousand of other items like purple and red keys and any type of toolbox so bring a medkit and heal youself.
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Those are great perks but I get worried people will use Bond to bring the killer to you. It's happened to me many times. Just last night I had Feng Min repeatedly and deliberately run towards me despite having already been hooked 2x and her never. At the time I gave her the benefit of the doubt and thought it was just incidental. Then at the match summary, I see her perks: Spine, UE, SC and Bond. That's why I kind of want to see a toggle in match where you can disable your aura being shown to a specific Survivor lol
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I’m about to ruin this whole mans career so say me and a teammate are beside a gen but I need healed if I do it myself while they do the gen then within 32 seconds that many charges are into the gen but if they heal me then we both hop on the gen within 32 seconds only 27.2 charges will have been used
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Sc is not a high tier perk
For swf is a very bad perk.
For solo are better perks.
If u solo q with Sc is better use u time making gen. Bad survivors thinks Sc are good because sc in a corner is safe and the another survivors are doing gen or loop the killer. Sc survivor are not team players. Is a waist of time 32 seg. If u dont extend the chase 32 seg y lose time making obj
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