Feedback on Billy Rework - Please Read
Billy in my opinion is one of the few killers in this game that I could point to and say he was perfectly balanced in terms of his power. Playing him to his fullest potential requires skill and game knowledge, he's not a killer that you could just hop on and destroy survivors with mindlessly. Being quite honest, the only time I would consider him overpowered is when it comes to his addon choices, namely insta-saw and tuning guide. Frankly I think I speak on behalf of most billy mains when I say that we would not mind such strong addon combinations getting nerfed.
In the article given to us you guys said "we want to focus on the skill-based gameplay ", I am then confused as to why "insta-saw" is still a thing. Instead you brought us an extremely unattractive new feature, essentially another power gauge that does nothing more than limit our own gameplay. It is especially going to hurt us Billy's who like to mindgame with their chainsaws out revving and going for curves and flicks at certain loops - like before, mindgaming already took a good amount of time to make the survivor overextend to a certain position that he can be curved at, and if you missed/bumped into an object you would lose a lot of time and distance, now with this overheat mechanic Billy is punished even more for it. Like, you're just encouraging Billy players to play way more simple-minded and go for backrevs instead of the more skillful high-risk high-reward mindgames that a lot of us go for.
And no offence, but I'm almost certain this overheat mechanic was introduced just for consistency-sake so that both Bubba and Billy have the same mechanic since they're of course both chainsaw users, I understand why you guys brought it for Bubba (to discourage facecamping with a 99'd chainsaw), however I don't think this feature this be copied and pasted onto Billy. I really hope that the developers see this and reconsider the Billy changes, as I said at the start I think he was in a perfectly fine spot and all that was needed was some addon-adjustments.
Comments
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Don't assume something is going to be bad until you try it.
Don't like it after you try it? You have the right to complain, but wait until you try it.
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I see we already have the comment saying "wait for PTB to see", but I will reiterate that I do not think Billy's power should be touched, and what they're doing right now will alienate a large amount of Billy mains. I want to make my point clear that even if the new overheat mechanic is "not so bad", that does not mean it should be added.
Post edited by PrinceAshitaka on12 -
Yes and last time they pulled a stun like this it as to the nurse and people said the same thing...
Guess what happened?
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You don't have to try out the changes, when the overheating is such a clear limiting factor to Billy's gen pressure, even from the video sample it's clear. There are things that are just obvious, and it is quite obvious that it will affect him.
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I am just so disappointed at how lazy these changes are, another cooldown mechanic as if we don't already have enough gauges in the game. I am sorry but you guys are headed down a bad path of homogeneity and frankly unfun. I hope this reaches you developers and that you don't take offence to my feedback I only want the game to be better @Peanits @Almo @not_Queen - wish that someone at BHVR sees this.
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Not that the devs even consider feedback to these changes..they have a vision of their own and the ptb is a glorified bug sweep at this point..it will be added no matter how much it is hated
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While I agree with the rest of the post. It's unfair to assume that insta-saw is still a thing. They are doing an addon-sweep along with these changes, so insta saw will probably be addressed in those changes.
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And people were right to judge it once it came out.
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We don't know that though, and frankly insta-saw is something that should have been addressed in the article if they're discussing important changes to allow for more "skillful gameplay".
And nothing has changed since. We're speaking out now, as early as we can, to make it as clear as possible to the developers how unwanted this change is.
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Do you remember when you were rubbish? I bet you and your team got destroyed by Hillbillies. I did. That is probably the reason for the nerf.
We all like killers being rewarded for being skillful. But when a killer cannot pip because they are so effective, it shows in the devs stats when these killers perform too well at the lower ranks but stay at those ranks. It makes them appear OP.
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I agree that Billy can stomp low-ranks and your average pub team, but compare him to a killer like Spirit. I just don't feel these changes are justified in the slightest, and not being able to pip because they have a one-shot mechanic should not mean a nerf it should mean a change to the pip system to accommodate for that and allow the Billy to face stronger survivors. In fact we're supposed to be getting a new MMR system to allow for more fairer matchmaking so I still am completely opposed to these changes.
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They addressed the existence of a full addon pass. So that qualifies.
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This just concerns me more that they messed with addons like his engravings, only time will tell.
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Yes. Reward Billy for his destruction of lower ranked opposition appropriately and this nerf would not have been necessary.
Additionally. I'd love to be on a DBD pub team. This needs to be a thing.
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This.
Some really quick overreactions I'm seeing just in the first day after an announcement was made, not even a finished product that we've yet to tinker around with.
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Since you guys are copy and pasting this response, I will also paste mine:
"Because I believe he did not need any change besides his addons, why force this change on us in the first place when the vast majority of Billy players consider it unnecessary and limiting? We get the idea from the article and video, and we don't like it. Just because it's "not so bad" in the PTB does not mean we're going to fall in love with this new power gauge (as if we don't already have 100 cooldowns/gauges)."
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They are doing a FULL addon pass. They are messing with ALL of his addons.
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Its not like it matters, even if everyone hates it I doubt the devs would actually revert him back to before. Whenever there is a change in the PTB i see it as a permanent thing with minor tweaks maybe when it goes to live. Im just going to face the facts billy will never ever be reverted back to his old state.
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It really is a shame, I knew Billy would one day get messed with but did not think it would be this bad.
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Going by the teaser/test footage, yes, I can see why you are hating the overheat of revving up. However, the PTB exists for a reason, and most likely the overheat will be reduced to make it so the chainsaw rev and sprint have, either equally 'slow' heat rate or just a tiny bit slower overheat for revving than what was shown. Otherwise the new purple add-on may well be all you see new Billy use XD
But, yeah, wait until the ptb comes out to voice concern/relief; and then wait again for live release to voice annoyance/praise.
Edit: and to cover the issue of Insta-Saw, I still hold out for the day when add-ons don't stack. That's all that needs said about that.
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If anything the new cooldown Encourages instasaw (if those addons are even still there) It would be more efficient to quickly rev up and down someone with instasaw than without to avoid the long cooldown.
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Do you believe we need another cooldown/power-guage mechanic? Do you think homogenizing killer powers is a good route for BHVR to go for? Sometimes you can tell an idea is bad without having to play it, yes it's important to do tests and give feedback but I am sure that I will not like it.
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What a joke, i didn't play for a couple of months, watching a stream and hearing about this.
Congrats to remove another killer that requires skill, you removed essentially the mindgames in order to curve. Oh and to the people who say "ptb exists for a reason" yes, i liked to play nurse. She is still completely ######### up after the rework, not because the nerfs are utter unjustified garbage but literally because the killer is bugged. There was lots of feedback regarding the lackluster job you did back then. Yeah well have fun with those changes. PTB feedback will be ignored anyway. Maybe you give the billies the courtesy that the killer can still be used without bug galore.
What a bad joke you are.
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Exactly what I was thinking.
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All it does is mean you have to chainsaw sprint you can’t back rev until you are on the survivors butt for a free hit
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No it doesn't lol.
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The change literally just made it so you can’t spam back rev to either camp a hook or sit on a survivors butt for the free hit his sprint still lasts the same amount of time that part didn’t get nerfed
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Do you even understand what backrev means?
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@PrinceAshitaka honestly, my idea for a Billy tweak was to make it a power gauge that decreases upon use, and enters a full cooldown and recharge when depleted. This change is very close to my idea, so i'm all in favour for it, and yes I do play Billy and enjoy him as he is, however, I am also with the belief that all killers need a fair, yet noticable punishment mechanic for misuse. Atm all Billy has is a stun for crashing and a tiny bit of cooldown when missing. So, i'm not against this new gauge system for him
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Yeah it’s when you hold for a bit let it go hold for a bit let it go etc trying to close a gap or make it where you can camp but not swing the saw until a survivor gets in the way
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Yeah ofc we all have the right to complain. But I guarantee you that NOTHING is going to change. It's basically already set in stone but once it's out they will NOT role back no matter how many people will send feedback and complain.
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Well we will have to see. You have the right to complain when you've genuinely experienced it, not just seen a short clip of it.
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Exactly. Same with MoM when it good leaked. Everyone who had game experience and some brain cells knew already its going to be busted af without even testing it. But even then people said "wait". And it turned out exactly how people predicted it. Why is feedback BEFORE trying not valid? We are humans with brains, we can do logical conclusions based on experience and knowledge.
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This this so much this. Devs are have their own vision and they will push it throw no matter what. Other example: struggle on hook. EVERYONE hates it since release. But since the devs have their own vision what interesting mechanics are they don't care and keep it.
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People called Doctors changes dumb and stupid.
Tried it.
People found it great.
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wrong.
You do not close any gaps with backrev. It means to get to the back of the survivor with 115 and rev him in order to down, which takes no skill opposed to mindgames in order to curve. Usually done by billies who equip instasaw as it is done much faster.
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We don't have to wait to see it. It was already happening 99% of the time in the past 4 years. I don't need another example to proof my point. Devs showed it to me over and over again.
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Well, just wait and play the ptb. I believe it's not as bad as it sounds.
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Something being "not bad" does not mean it should be added lol.
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Regardless, all I can hope is that the devs reconsider their position on this. Please feel free to tweak Billy's addons as necessary but don't mess with his base kit and give him another plain old power gauge.
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Amen. Adding something for the sake of adding it is no reason at all.
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Ah well, I guess I'll stick to survivor now. RIP Billy :(
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May I ask you why are you bothering? They don't listen anyway.
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At this point I have no idea if they just don't know how to change things to be balanced and interesting for both sides... OR they just love gauges.
Soon even Pig might get one for her charge mechanic...
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What people don't seem to understand.
Billy can be played in a few ways.
Crack billy, insta saw, regular billy with just normal addons, M1lly (which disgusts me, using saw just for movement).
It's like they are killing a few ways to play him, but I will not fully judge until the PTB, then if it plays the same as he currently does I will be happy, if they basically remove a way to play him, they know they will be called on because "it was minor tweaks" nothing bad to the kit.
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I don't know, guess I have some hope that someone like @Peanits or @MandyTalk will pass on our feedback to the team. I understand the developers have their own vision for the game but I hope they understand that us players also want what's best for the game too, we're not simply opposing this because we dislike change, we have valid reasons for not wanting Billy's kit to be muddled like this.
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They kinda set a trap for you billy mains. After infectious fright got buffed, it became meta on him instantly and enough billies switched their playstyle to trying to get everyone slugged at the start of the match to justify toning down his snowball potential. All part of a larger plan...
(I'm just having a tinfoil hat day don't mind me)
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I start by saying I don't play Billy. So I am by no means familiar with the finer points of playing him. From a survivor perspective I see no reason for this change. I always felt Billy was pretty much perfectly balanced. The issues I had with him were insta saw and the chainsaw hitbox felt a bit too generous. If they would have addressed those two things he would have been perfect in my mind.
I will say I hope they either scrap this change. Or the overheating bar isn't as punishing as it appears. My only bit of optimism is I'm sure there will be some addons to help with the overheating. Either increasing the time it takes to overheat. Or increasing the rate of overheat cool down.
In short things might not be as bad as they seem. But I see no need for this change.
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Yall said it with Nurse. We complained and complained, provided evidence, logic, everything. Only 2 addons got changed and it was a nerf. Her only bug fix was one that benefited her.
We have the right to fear the exact same thing for Billy when it's literally the same thing happening to him.
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This. I am getting annoyed by all of these posters regurgitating the same "wait until ptb first" comment. We get it, yes we'll have first-hand testing of this new feature but we're in opposition to such a concept and we are expressing why it would be bad.
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