Autodidact--It's not very good

Does it proc on self-healing? I can see it being useful at lower Ranks, where new players might not have SC or a medkit, but if it only procs on other person heals... that's a pretty garbage return for a Perk slot. Better to run We'll Make It since most other healing will be done after an unhook.

Totally agree with you. On the PTB the perk was really good. Yes it was strong but if you managed to get 5 stacks you deserve to have a really strong instaheal. You went out of your way to heal your teammates. You stop doing your objective to heal people. Plus it's so heavily RNG based with the skillchecks. I've only managed to get 5 stacks once and that was in the PTB. Otherwise I only get like 2 or 3. The chances of getting all 5 stacks are slim cause there are so many things that can prevent you from getting the stacks. Self Care, other people healing the person before you get there or the killer interrupting and just the horrible RNG. I thought the PTB version was fine and didn't need a nerf. Right now the perk hinders your team more than it helps because you need 3 stacks before the perk starts rewarding you. Before you just needed 2 and that was alright.
When I played the PTB I was excited to have this perk in my build but not anymore.

@HaterMcTater said:

@UncannyLuck said:
Fun fact: you actually never positively impacted a match with that perk. At 4 tokens, you've healed -10% of a bar (-25 + -10 + 5 + 20). You need an average of 5 tokens (aka 5 skill checks) for it to not be a net negative per match.

I think reducing the starting penalty and reducing the number of tokens would make it more usable. It'd still be better to run We'll Make It most of the time, but if you wanna run an empathy healing build it'd be usable then.

I think the original math you said is incorrect since by the 4th token, you'd have a +35%, (-25% + 15% = -10% + 15% = 5% + 15% = 20% + 15% = 35% + 15% = 50%) however, it still doesn't positively impact the match like you said. The amount of time it takes to work, not to mention the amount of time you waste on healing action for the initial build up is detrimental. Then most importantly, with skillchecks being RNG based, you may not get a skillcheck until the end of a heal, and by then it wont even matter what token you have unless its a -25% or a -10% which shows how it hurts healing progression rather than help. I agree that if they can limit the initial build up penalty to something like -10%, it could help this perk a bit. Thanks for the comment!

Yes, you'd have +35% on your next heal. The problem is, at 4 tokens that means you haven't had a chance to use that +35%. This means that if you look at it cumulatively, you've added a total of -10% to a heal bar. And that's how this perk should be looked at.

To further clarify:

1st Heal = -25%; -25% cumulative
2nd Heal = -10%; -35% cumulative
3rd Heal = +5%; -30% cumulative
4th Heal = +20%; -10% cumulative
5th Heal = +35%; +25% cumulative (you never got to this state because your max was 4 tokens)

It's even worse because even if you average 5 tokens, it'd be better just to bring botany knowledge which would be almost as good (+20% cumulative vs +25% cumulative) and have a 0% chance of being actively harmful.

Yeah, on the other hand if people want to do true "hardmode" builds then Autodidact 1 is perfect for that as it makes all your skill checks only slightly better than great ones after you do like 3.

HaterMcTater said:

@yeet said:
Survivors don't realise that their meta perks are absurdly broken and they're never getting perks that strong again.

I'm a survivor main; I find it more enjoyable, but I also play killer. When I say perks like these need buffing, it's to add incentive to pick these kind of perks OVER meta perks. If you're tired of survivors running the same annoying perks in your killer lobbies, then that's why perks like these need fixing, to be used over the annoying meta perks. Not to mention, it's designed to slow down the game and give survivors other things to focus on rather than just generators. If you're saying this perk shouldn't be fixed, you're agreeing that survivors should only focus on generators, especially since the games go by so fast. If you don't want that to happen, it's why we need autodidact to be fixed and other perks to follow it's lead of getting survivors extra tasks to do.

HaterMcTater said:

@yeet said:
HaterMcTater said:

@yeet said:

Survivors don't realise that their meta perks are absurdly broken and they're never getting perks that strong again.

I'm a survivor main; I find it more enjoyable, but I also play killer. When I say perks like these need buffing, it's to add incentive to pick these kind of perks OVER meta perks. If you're tired of survivors running the same annoying perks in your killer lobbies, then that's why perks like these need fixing, to be used over the annoying meta perks. Not to mention, it's designed to slow down the game and give survivors other things to focus on rather than just generators. If you're saying this perk shouldn't be fixed, you're agreeing that survivors should only focus on generators, especially since the games go by so fast. If you don't want that to happen, it's why we need autodidact to be fixed and other perks to follow it's lead of getting survivors extra tasks to do.

Why don't we just nerf the absurdly powerful meta perks?

It's been done already, exhaustion perks have been nerfed, decisive strike is being nerfed, sabotage was nerfed, etc. Instead of nerfing every perk, making other perks viable give more options to pick from while giving survivors options of what to do. Autodidact rewards survivors for leaving gens and focusing on healing, meanwhile, you can nerf decisive strike but survivors still do gens. That's why it's important to give survivors a choice of what else they can do with their time to slow down gens.

@HaterMcTater said:
INTORDUCTION:
Autodidact is a very cool premise for a perk and I love it. I feel that more perks should have a push and pull effect to it. What I mean is, you start by being penalized and slowly start to buff your self up as the match goes on. With autodidact, you start with a -25% on healing progression and it removes the ability to hit great skillchecks. The up side for this perk is that you gain an extra 15% for everytime you hit a healing skillcheck. These are measured in tokens as you can have 3/4/5 tokens depending on what tier of the perk you have. So if you have all 5 tokens, every healing skillcheck is +50% automatically to the healing bar which is amazing. However, the issue is that is usually never happens.

EXPERIMENT AND RESULTS
I ran some experiments within trials to see on average you get this many tokens. As a control group, I used 20 matches, each time I had tier 3 Autodidact, here are the results in order; 2t, 3t, 3t, 2t, 1t, 0t, 2t, 3t, 4t, 3t, 2t, 2t, 2t, 1t, 1t, 0t, 2t, 3t, 2t, 1t. On average, I had about 2 tokens (1.95 to be exact) per match. This is dissapointing as that means I was NEGATIVELY impacted on average everytime I brought this perk. Once you hit 3 tokens, you begin to see some of the upsides, but that requires you to be healing other survivors and getting more skillchecks. The other downside to this is RNG, this whole perk RELEIS on RNG. Wether or not you get a skillcheck is completely RNG, in some matches I fully healed 2 survivors with the mangled status and never triggered a skillcheck, meaning, no benefit. But when I did get a skillcheck, it only negatively impacted the survivor I was healing and never got a benefit. On average, every match you bring autodidact, you are hurting your team. I should also mention im rank 1, so matches go by quickly, meaning, this slow burn perk is almost completely useless. Not to mention, using We'll Make It can heal faster than a t3 Autodidact perk with 5 tokens can.

HOW I WOULD CHANGE IT
As it is, autodidact is almost completely useless. With the recent nerf it receieved from the PTB, it's hard to say why anyone would use the perk. While it's concept is interesting (as stated earlier) the flaws are hard to ignore. In response to this issue, I would suggest these main changes. 1. Allow skillchecks to appear while healing other survivors with a med kit. Trust me, this wont break the game and make this perk "op", it's simply to allow med kits with needle addons to increase the chances of presenting a skillcheck while also increasing the rate you heal survivors by slightly. 2. Increase the rate at which skillchecks appear. The RNG is too much to handle with this perk, it can make or break your experience with this perk. To combat this, simply up the rates at which you are given skillchecks to help push survivors out of the penalization area of their tokens As long as survivors get 4-5 tokens, the perk becomes worth it. 3. Give it a point bonus towards Altruism. If you want survivors to use a perk that will hinder them before rewarding them, give them a little insentive. Blood Point bonuses dont affect the trial itself, but help motivate survivors to bring this perk. And finally, 4. Allow survivors to gain tokens from self care, give them the healing progression penalty, and dont give them benefits. If you allow tokens to be obtained off of yourself, you are able to gain more tokens while using this perk while not providing benefits to yourself. Since the whole premise of this perk is to learn overtime, using yourself as practice isn't a bad idea. You can provide yourself with tokens so that you may use your new found skill on other survivors.

CONCLUSION
As much as I like autodidact, it kind of sucks. With these chanegs I suggested, it could become one of the greatest altruism perks without being considered as unfair to fight against. I'd like to hear any complaints or discussions anyone can provide, im always open to discussing the perk!

i like youre idea and we all agree at each chapter killers are getting good perks but survivor no except david king perks audidact was good and i like it in the PTB it will be good for a new meta for survivor but of course they still nerf alot of survivors and buff killers and if they continue like this i will not even play the game and the next patch they will nerf more survivor healing so they need to THINK use they head and how to make balance to survivor and balance its not nerfing its buffing for got sake