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Who should the devs listen to?
In dbd, a lot of players complain about multiple problems. However, a lot of people have biased opinions or will just get ignored while making valid complains. I am gonna say, in my opinion, what people should be listened at.
To put it simply, people that play killer and survivor equally. These people have almost no possibility of having a biased opinion: they play both sides equally, which means that they can feel the frustrations of both sides. If you only play one side (or 80-20), the chances of you having a bias are really high. You will not get to play the other side, so you will not experience their frustrations. Killer mains and survivor mains are not all entitled, but they are very likely to naturally see their problems first, even if they try to understand the other side. Now, there is another thing to mention: if you only ever use 1 build or 1&2 killers, then you will defend those since you play them and due to your psychology, you will notice negative experiences with them more than the positive ones. So with these builds or killers, you will think they are balanced while they are not.
The second thing players want to know is: are the players complaining pro at the game? Well, this is a bad factor for multiple reasons: first of all, dbd is an arcade game, not a competitive one. So it should be meant to be fun for most of the players instead of being meant for people tryharding it that want to reach the top. Not to mention that dbd is already frustrating enough for players that are new to the game. Second of all, how can you know who is good? Ranking system is not accurate (killers need to play certain characters and do specific things instead of killing like they should do and survivors can rank up just by playing the game a lot). Finally, balancing around top players also mean balancing around tryharding people: if you balance around the top players, you are basically balancing the game around 4 man swf while most survivors are solos, 2 or 3 man swf. The same applies for killers: if you balance around the top players, you will balance the game around pro nurses who have invested thousands of hours in the game and can pop an ebony&broken add ons almost every game.
And now, lets take a look at how true stats are. Technically, if something is balanced, then it should be proved by the stats, right? Well, this is true, BUT: the stats do not show the fun factor. T-bagging technically does not give an advantage to survivors, yet is it cool for the killer? The same applies for camping: survivors can do gens and escape, but is it fun? Also, swf on coms is broken, but a lot of swf play without coms, so that would lower the survival rate of SWF. Even when it comes to balancing, stats are not perfect.
In conclusion, the devs should just listen to people who play both sides equally, the rest of players are probably + or - wanting to get a 4k every game. Other factors are bad due to not reflecting the community or not taking certain things int account. Now, time for me to get raided by killer mains, survivor mains, and pro players.
Comments
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devs should listen us killer because we are oppressed.
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They should listen to content creators on both sides, because they promote the game and they usually have more experience and skill than average - plus they usually have evidence (clips) to back their opinions.
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Honestly, I think they should focus on the general feedback of the playerbase instead of any one person or group of people, along with looking at internal stats to see where to fix things. One without the other would be kinda silly, like how if they just focused on statistics, they might ignore the fact that some people still don't find certain killers fun despite getting above average kills.
If they just focus on player feedback, we would probably have every killer nerfed and every survivor perk nerfed because people got pissy.
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I am also think, that the devs should think on the fun parts, but not to much.
They should always try to think on both sides with a higher awarnes for the people that have to live with their nerfs*, if they gonna nerf something and I at least have often the feeling, that they ignore at least 1 side of the coin.
*As example: If they nerf a killer, the nerf will be more annoying for the killerplayerbase, because they will see the outcome in every match, while the survivors anyways see that killer only once or two times a day.
The same can we put towards survivor nerfs.
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The loudest people are the ones that don't play both sides and have very little time put into the game to fully understand what they're talking about.
People also misuse the word "bias" tremendously on these forums. As soon as you say that this or that needs buffs or nerfs, you are immediately labeled "bias" for thinking one side needs something, which isn't what bias is at all.
I for example think killers are generally speaking quite weak. That isn't bias, as I play both sides equally at the highest rank. i experience it all from both sides and have come to the conclusion that one side needs help more than another. That is an analysis from seeing both sides from all perspectives, not bias.
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Me I'm smart.
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Whoever the devs are listening too, they need to stop right now. Cause for every 1 thing they do right they screw up another 10.
I watched that video of a champion overwatch player getting his ass kicked in dbd. My first impression was "He's a champion player for a FPS. This is not a FPS. Dbd is an entirely different game. The way the MM is and the fact he is just starting this game why wouldn't he be getting crushed?"
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people who play both side know what going on.
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They shouldn't listen anyone who would describe themselves as "oppressed" in a video game, for starters.
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the devs should listen to the strongest players in the game. It doesn't matter about players playing survivor or killer equally, what matters is that good players are the best at breaking a game, and if a game is balanced at the top end of play, it will be balanced at all levels of play.
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forgot to add the big /s
lmao i was being sarcastic because killer mains always think they're a victim of bhvr lol
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People that have 1000's of hrs in this game and aren't biased... People that actually help others out. An example would be someone like Tru3, or otz, etc.
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Tru3 a example of someone that isn't biased.
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Depends on what goal you want to achieve: a) Balancing the game or b) making as much money as possible in a short amount of time.
If you go for a), you have to listen to completely other people compared to when you want to go for b).
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The dev's shouldn't be listening to us at all. When they listen to us, you get crap like ds and unbreakable and freddy.
The dev's should be capable of making a balanced and fun game on their own, but they're not.
They shouldn't do that either. Content creators are concerned with growing their audience, which usually means they need exciting content, which is not in the best interest of the game. The dev's need to watch the content creators to see what's broken, but nothing beyond that.
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Devs should take opinions into consideration but not treat them as fact. No one group should be the one devs listen to, even 50/50 players will have a bias because of their rank.
People giving opinions should take into consideration they aren't as good at the game as they probably think they are. They shouldn't escape/4k every match and rank doesn't mean you are skilled, just that you lucked out with match making and know the minimum to pip. People should also consider how they are voicing their opinion, many do so by insulting the devs and that's really not great way to get someone to listen to you.
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Simple, they should listen to me.
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Problem is devs, even if capable of balancing their game, would do it at a really slow pace. To expedite the process they need experienced players to give feedback, this survey malarky I have been filling out for ages doesn't seem to get the point across (and they don't even show the results for us to see the overall picture).
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k, dude the circus is waiting for you!!! you're not supposed to be clowning here in the forum!!!
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I dont think that's true, but even if it is, they need to hire a better balance team, not listen to people that will almost assuredly have an agenda.
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They should just listen to OhToFu. I swear they nerfed Spirit, Oni, and Executioner right after he made a video about them. That man is powerful and they are nerfing his main, smh.
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The first thing I would say is just because someone plays both sides equally in no way means they have an unbiased opinion, or even a less biased opinion. 2 examples:
1) Someone plays both sides equally. They enjoy both sides, but they are naturally good at one side and naturally suck at the other. Their opinions will be biased based on their experience, and even their skill level.
2) Another person plays both sides equally. They hate one side and only play it because it helps them be better at the side they actually enjoy. Again, this person is going to have a biased opinion based on the fact they don't actually enjoy one side.
The bias in both situations may be completely unintentional. Neither person may realize their opinions are biased, but we all have biases in this no matter how hard we try not to have them.
Having said all that..... the first and foremost thing they are going to listen to is the business side of the whole thing. While I think they try to be fair with changes and such the bottom line is this is a business.The top 2 things for any business are:
- Attract new customers
- Retain current customers
Conversely anything that does the opposite of one or both those things is what they are going to hear regardless of who any of us think. They could implement the most fair change ever in this game, and if it caused a steep drop in the amount of people playing and/or being attracted to play that change is not going to last.
To be fair, that is how they have to do it. DBD is a product, and the way to make the most money of any product is to make it appeal to as many people as you possibly can.
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they should listen to everyone and not exclude any groups of people.
they dont need to follow every advide they get, but they shouldnt ignore any player, just because they play one side more than the other.
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Just because content creators say something is weak/strong, doesn't mean they're right.
Ghostface, Wraith, LF have all been seen as classically weak at some point or another by content creators, yet Tru3 was able to prove that they aren't that weak. He's put out a series of videos that says LF is hilariously underrated before the rework.
I am in no way saying Tru3 is someone they should solely listen to (I love watching his stream, but he can definitely be very biased at times), just that he has been able to prove people wrong.
All that aside, I feel like Otz/ScottJund would be very good people to listen to: SJ strikes me as very fair in his judgement of things, and Otz, while a little biased, does attempt to see things from survivor side.
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This exactly. There are plenty of viable reasons why a person might main one role and mostly avoid the other. People who play both sides ~equally may have a better overview between the two, but they also tend to not see all of the specific nuances or issues that one side may run across (and with specific killer mains, this rabbit hole can go deeper).
Same thing in regards to player experience with the game. Things that affect new players may be different from those that affect people who've stuck around for hundreds of hours. Like Ruin: it's old effect wasn't much of an impediment at high levels of play, but brand new players were getting shut out pretty hard by it. Or Nurse, who is plenty weak when handled by someone who hasn't played her much, but can devastate smart survivors in good hands.
The grizzled veterans of the Fog have the benefit that they've been around for a while and can often propose better and more specific changes that they believe would help the game, and can (usually) provide some solid reasons behind their suggestions. But complaints about issues that could harm the new player experience are still worth consideration too (no new players means no further game growth, which is bad).
The best compromises that I can come up with:
-Experienced players should be more encouraged to think about some of the most consistent new-player problems that come up (to think if there is any solution that might work beyond dumbing down the game or "git gud"). I personally think simply commissioning a series of tutorial videos (possibly from some of the big DbD content creators) to put online and in the Help & Tutorials section could go a long way to helping newbies play better and have more fun.
-Role "Mains" should be encouraged to be more understanding of the fact that their role is only half of the game. Their opinions and suggestions are still valid, but filtering them through some of the players who more evenly split between the sides may help highlight any parts that might disrupt balance in a bad way. However, there's basically no way to track how much most people actually play one role or the other beyond what they claim, so good luck to anyone that would ever be in charge of such a thing.
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I really enjoy Tru3's content but I also disagree with some of his viewpoints. I've watched Otz and disagreed with him a few times and seen him get stomped by SWFs. The only one that I've fully agreed on was with ScottJund. He's very factual and shows proof. If you don't like these creators but you try to insult me over it, you're argument becomes invalid to me and will be ignored.
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Sometimes it's hard to tell lol
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Sure, Jan.
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@Khakuate I hope the day you get banned is a day that I'm online. Being rude to other's because you dislike their comments or statements need to stop. All you're doing is making your own worthless to others.
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lmao, keep dreaming.
I treat people like they treat me, glad he got banned :)
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dw friend
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No time to listen. Time to nerf.
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The devs don't listen to anyone. Not even the HUGE and BENEFICIAL resource they have in Fog Whisperers. Ask Puppers. He outright said "the devs don't listen to anything we say". You have to be awful to get PUPPERS of all people bitter.
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Oppressed? Are you kidding me.
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They should actually listen to EVERYBODY!!! There is no doubt in my mind that the devs listen to a particular sub group of intermediate one sided players. With the recent hillbilly nerf and the ruin nerf a few months back it's clear that this group is most likely survivor sided. (Not to say that survivor hasn't been nerfed recently, just not to the extent that killer has faced.) If the devs actually listened to players on both sides and of all skill levels, it would work out better for the games health and future.
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@Khakuate I just want to apologize for what I said. It was out of anger, not out of reason. It wasn't about true but making fun of a person who showed a thought of something that had me mad. I don't want to be a negative person on here. I made an account to help people with info and facts, not engage into negative behavior. For that, I am sorry, honestly.
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Hey dont worry! it's just a forum, I was happy cause that guy was pretty biased and rude to everyone else, that's why I was rude too, that's why im glad he got banned, I think we dont want people like him on this community.
Have a good day! ;D
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@Khakuate I do appreciate your kind words! You also have a grand day!
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No One. This game will never be balanced.
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Definitely not whomever they're listening to right now, that’s for sure.
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