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why mmr will kill the game and content for it
Storytime, when I used to play fortnite i was a very good player, top 1%. Epic added skill-based matchmaking into solo public matches, which has driven away everyone that isnt terrible enough to only play bots or people that play 12 hours a day and play every solo pub like a competitive game. Content creators basically cant make funny content anymore because theres no more random players that could be really bad or really good.
If dbd gets MMR, every game will literally be sweaty nurse or a sabo squad if youre good, and if youre bad you will probably suffer from playing with people that are even worse than you or playing against killers that are way better than you because the system wont be perfect.
The game isnt competitive, its not a 1v1, theres no way to measure survivor and killer skill relatively. I actually believe this could kill the game and I am really not looking forward to only being able to play nurse and never being able to solo q.
Also content creators rely on getting bad/interesting teammates or killers, which doesn't happen often since it takes hours to get a couple good games. This is why when you're favorite survivor is playing on stream they always have a teammate or two to ensure the stream can still be entertaining instead of losing half the games.
In short, I hope MMR is either removed or not as bad as i see it to be, but for now i can only hope.
Comments
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I mean they're trying something they can always reverse it if the results aren't satisfying,
You people take in comparison MOBA and FPS experience but DbD has quite an unique genre and MMR never been experienced in this kind of game. As far as I know.
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It will feel nice to have games where people don't run in a straight line against Billy and actually do gens so I'm all for it.
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Ultimately, content creators isn't a priority when it comes to implementing MMR. Players should play against other players of similar skill, regardless if they intend to meme around, or create videos.
Plus, the whole idea of a streamer/youtuber relying on bad survivors/killers to create good content is stupid. If they rely on crushing weaker players, then thats not healthy content for the community. No one wants to be on the receiving end of a stomping, nor is it particularly interesting to do the stomping.
The MMR, if done well and it working, will be a healthy thing for the whole community, at least in my own opinion
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Imagine needing bad players to make content
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Also, it won’t work so matchmaking still is gonna be random
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The rank we have is a stand in mmr.
It hasnt killed the game yet. Matchmaking on the other hand....
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love it when people say Players should play against other players of similar skill,playing killer and playing survivor are different roles skill playing survivor and skill playing killer is different normally it easier as survivor then killer so where the similar skill lvl?
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I think we're going to see the same issued pop up with the new MMR as we've seen with the broken MM the last 6-7 months.
Let me explain:
First of all, most killers have had to endure awful matchmaking for the last several months and as a result I think many are bunred out on it and have given up trying. Many have probably snapped and gone full face camp 24/7 or have just switched into casual mode.
Second of all, a lot of survivors have had to endure awful matchmaking the last several months, and after months of playing with potatoes in solo and getting matched against rank 1 killers many of them have probably resorted to using extra sweaty builds.
As a result we have more competitive solo q survivors and more uncompetitive killers.
If the MMR works it will start placing a decent chunk of killers into lobbies with lower skilled survivors since the killers no longer give two [bad word] about winning and just about playing for fun how they enjoy playing, which sadly means as killer you'll lose all the time. I don't think most killers enjoy slugging, camping, and tunneling to begin with but many times those tactics along with slow down perks etc are the only way to win against the more competent lobbies. I think it's way more fun to just get in one chase at a time and down someone, put them on a hook, go look for someone else. Rinse, repeat. But you don't win that way against skilled survivors.
On the flip side you'll see more and more survivors ending up in more "skilled" and competitive lobbies but with less killers available that the system will think, based off it's algorithm and parameters, equals the same or similar enough skill to match them with.
And then there we are again with an MMR that starts just throwing randoms together because lobby after lobby of highly "skilled" survivors have been waiting ages for a killer to enter lobby.
I could be wrong, of course. This just crossed my mind lately.
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Nope you’re right I think. Too many good survivors not enough good killers, and by good I mean high MMR. So in order to not keep people waiting they’ll open up the ranges farther and farther until it really just becomes a random first queue, first play type of system.
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Exactly. It's a decent possibility.
Right now this is what the difficulty of both sides looks like in a graph
When this is what most of us THINK we're hoping to achieve
But when you take into account that both sides have opposing objectives it seems less and less likely we'll ever get to that point.
How can both sides start out and progress along the same trajectory when they are in opposition to each other, objective wise?
You can't have both sides winning and losing in equal amounts across the time progression. In theory you would think you can if they're always being pitted against equally skilled opponents but this doesn't take into account where the current skill ceilings are for both survivor and killer.
Something has to be done to address the skill ceilings for both survivor and killer to make the second graph possible.
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End Game Collapse began killing this game.
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Why should i be unfairly matched with someone so a streamer can put on a show?
Having a chance to bully someone lesser skilled than you is no reason to keep a ######### MM.
People have been saying this game will die when X happens. Its still going
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Content creators who need low-skill players to create content need to get gud.
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That's a really good point!
I created a new thread from my comment. I'm going to see if I can copy this there.
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I don't see the problem in players going up against others of equal skill, regardless of what they do as a hobby.
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I'd be OK with this as well.
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In regards to DBD not being competitive, I agree. However due to rank being the only option and the constant "pip/depip" after a match being tossed in your face, DBD resembles a game that IS competitive. If rank didn't exist and you didn't see "Entity Displeased" or a "depip" after a match you wouldn't feel so bad.
I have been playing since day 1 release and I do not care for kills/escapes. I play for fun interactions and funny moments, but even I feel a little punch in the gut when I see a "de pip/entity Displeased" because its a negative score on a game I tried to have fun in.
If a casual mode existed I'd play it ALL the time, not because I lack skill or can't handle pressure, but because I want to have fun and not take DBD seriously and I'd like to do that without the game telling me "YOU DID POORLY!".
So the reason I don't think MMR is going to fix anything is due to the fact that DBD forces elements of a competitive game without the required balance of a competitive game. This forces casual and competitive players to be grouped together no matter what. Meaning that solo survivor who is goofing around yet getting escapes will eventually get matched with competitive players and be crushed for goofing around. This in turn will cause the competitive players on their team to "flame" them for goofing around. Rinse and repeat for both sides and you still have people fighting, people trying to lower MMR, people trolling and a game that doesn't identify with either player type trying to magically make both happy.
DBD needs to either balance for a competitive setting, remove ranking and give DBD a more casual feel OR add a rank/casual gamemode.
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So. The issue here is actually a much deeper issue that I've been thinking about for awhile. And honestly, I don't really know if its fixable anymore. This game base concept has some pretty big issues. This is coming from someone who loves the base concept, by the way. It is built as both a horror game and a competitive game. Now, on the face, this isn't a bad thing, its an intriguing concept. And as we can see by the retaliative popularity of it, for the most part it works. The issue arises from how individual players see the game. Some people see this game as a horror game, and are mostly in it for the "fun and interesting experiences" as I've seen multiple times. But some people see it as a competitive game, and will do whatever it takes to win. Many see it as a mix of the two, everyone will have their own perspective on it. In some ways, that's really cool, a very interesting social experiment in some ways.
The issues happen when two (or more) people's base ideas of what this game is clash at a very fundamental level. For example, a killer trying to live a power fantasy going up against survivors who are just trying to have a good time, or vice versa. Sometimes one side leaves feeling sour, but often both sides do, because to both of them, neither had a fulfilling game, simply because they weren't really playing the same game.
Trying to balance for that. I can't imagine it. It is an impossible challenge, and every decision you make will piss off one part of the community or another because everyone has a different idea what DBD is. This is somewhat true of every game, of course, but DBD has the unique issue of having two base genres mashed together that don't work very well together. Horror and PVP do not have the same goals, which is of course why combining them is so interesting.
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you didn't take into account SWF groups. IIRC the stats i previously read indicated solo players survived much less often than 2+ swf groups.
BECAUSE the 2nd graph is nearly impossible due to the community, I just tend to meme most games. I'll try until i'm tunneled, camped, or farmed... which is more than 3/4s of the games I play solo. Then it is what it is at that point.
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All I think about these "MMR will kill the game" threads is people are afraid of challenge. They want to bully and get easy games. Matchmaking is bad and has been for a while. You can get red rank killer as yellow / brown rank survivor and you can get red rank survivors as yellow / brown rank killerr. How can MMR kill the game when all it does is make matches more fair, if it works properly?
Post edited by hahadrillgobrrr on1 -
That many people would rather watch a bully than a competative match is not a good enough reason to keep the miserable matchmaking we have now.
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I prefer close matches and don't care about people who edit videos to show themselves going against people who don't have time to devote to a game.
Anyway, OP, you realize that each individual killer will have its own MMR, right? Meaning your nurse will go up against a different level of survivors than say your Pig.
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igy but honestly the problem isnt that they need to verse bad players its that the only players you will verse if the mmr is good and you are a good player is either death squads or spirits/nurses
all variety will be stripped from the game with mmr
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I think plenty of people can play the next tier of killers well enough to stay high MMR so you could also go against solid Freddy, Huntress, Etc
But yeah as a high rank killer the only think keeping me sane now is half of the red rank survivors I go against are flat out BAD... if it turns into going are really good players and good SWF playing killer will be 100% stress
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I rather go against killers who are equal with me and not have teammates who just UE all game while doing nothing. Same goes for survivors who I go against who aren't the ones who run in a straight line against Billy. I'm a bit competitive. I try not to get too upset but sometimes, I do get upset with RNG Layout. I would still feel better going against a good team rather than a 1 minute, 4k slugfest because everyone swarmed the hook.
I'm not the majority but I have been in games where my anger has extended, not from my mistakes or skill but from my teammates either doing nothing or just bad triple window RNG.
Post edited by AVoiceOfReason on0 -
I mean the worst it can basically do is change nothing. Which ok, im dissapointed but eh its not a disaster.
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Every time I think “well it can’t get any worse,” the devs prove me wrong
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Fair enough, but what I forgot to add was that the devs have mentioned they can turn the mmr system off again if it isnt working, so my guess would be the old ranking matchmaking isn't getting deleted its just being turned off. And by that logic, it cant get worse.
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You know what the problem is?
Killer perks are essential to their success and they take ######### ages to get. This is why you see so many of the same killers like bubba; for bbq and chilli. It takes way too long for new killers to get a decent set of addons, even longer for a variety set of killers.
On top of this your mmr doesnt change depending on what killer you perform well on, i dont give a ######### what anyone says, I played my 1st match of Gunslinger against two 1s and a 3 and 4 SWF with 3 perks and the following 2 games were red ranked SWF.
On top of that survivors usually all run the same meta perks with some variation, the best of the best and i would argue that having just one duplicate of a top tier survivor perk is a massive pain in the ass.
They took away killers option to change killer in lobby after assessing the survivor composition so thats part of the reason your SWF group is going against my lvl 15 gunslinger with welfare rng perks.
I will make a few suggestions, take it or leave it.
- give survivor (or survivor categories) exclusive signature perks.
- limit certain perks across a survivor lobby.
- make killer perks more accessible or allow killers to change in lobby, this will bring back variety instead of spirit, cannabal and freddy alllllllllll day (I know you know what Im talking about).
- give survivor teams that have no parties a little bit of an upper or hell, give them chat/voip/proximity voip.
I will add the I am a rank 6 killer and rank 3 survivor in case this information matters.
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