A core game mechanic: Hooks, is the primary source of most of this games complaints.

I meant have it adjust similar to but not effected by terror radius. So it's a separate measurement not effected by terror reducing effects.

Even so, if someone wants to run a bunch of terror radius reducing things just to camp, they're probably sacrificing more useful things.

I'm not really opposed to this idea, but I agree that it's a huge change to the core mechanics of the game -- both in terms of taking people on and off hooks, and in terms of the loose, slippery play style that we all like and hate about DBD.

I admit, one of the things I enjoy about Pyramid Head is that, supposing everyone's tormented, getting a down = getting a hook and no one can mess it up for you. And there's a part of me that's like, "Yeah, that's how it should always be." When I go against Pyramid Head, as survivor, I also always hope to get sent to the cage, because then I know I'm far away from the killer and I'm definitely getting a safe rescue. Also the cage struggle mechanic is better.

From a gameplay POV, I wouldn't mind at all if things somehow changed so that that was the default way of doing things, and I think many of the perks that currently work with hooks could just work with cages instead.

That said, I can think of a few objections that I'd have if I were on the dev team -- the biggest one being that I think they actually want things to go a little wild and crazy when killers are carrying survivors to a hook and/or survivors are trying to get a save. I don't think the game they envision is an orderly process where everyone gets hooked immediately after they go down, and the cycle repeats three times for each person. I think they want opportunities for people to do something risky and daring.

The other big objection is that so much of the game content is built around the idea that being downed is not an automatic hook -- like all of the perks that affect slugging, all of the perks that affect carrying, sabo boxes, flashlight saves -- it's a ton of stuff that they've already put a lot of work into.

I agree that the loose play between the time someone goes down and the time they get saved from the hook often doesn't feel super fair to me, and I think you're right to say it's the source of most of the complaints about the game. I just also feel like what we're identifying is an intentional feature of the game -- a pocket of time where anything can happen no matter how annoying, and even though I think the game might be less aggravating if some of that was removed, I'm not sure it would still be the game the developers wanted to make?

I don't think the majority of the killer cast could keep up with survivors if all the hook mechanics went the way of pyramid head. With gen speeds the way they are, letting survivors unhook for free isn't feasible unless you are significantly more skilled than your opponents or are playing a top tier killer.

A typical rank 1 lobby without any slowdown perks lasts maybe 5-6~ minutes? It is borderline impossible to get 12 hooks in that timeframe with an M1 killer. Being able to defend hooks is a huge source of pressure, and also gives survivors a reason to travel into dead zones you have created. Camping / tunneling / slugging are all basically required to beat good teams with mid-tier and below killers.

I like how you're thinking about this.

I've never been a part of a community that gripes so much about something they do several hours a day. At least you're thinking about productive solutions to design challenges rather than screaming "unfair" at the other side.

Yeah i worded my first post very poorly

Just meant there was a game already that had the mechanic op suggested

The second thing was indeed silly to say. It's more my personall opinion rather then fact

I'm a killer main in favor of buffing solo survivors and nerfing SWF. Yes. Solo survivors I ######### on hard. I seriously can't remember the last time I even lost a game against solos. Against SWF though. This game tips too far into their favor.

And you can't just nerf SWF. You need to buff solos to their level in ways that don't effect SWF. I'm not saying these do that but they do address the problems of camping and tunneling. I'd also say they need to make it so there are 0 I mean literally 0 "safe" pallets on every map. Nerf looping in general, and then increase the number of pallets. Make every pallet mindgameable. Bring back some skill to this game. Give solos more information. Give them a totem counter. Show them where their teammates are. Make kindred base kit. Then buff killers to compensate for all of this.

As a killer main in not sure what changes should be made to killers yet if they did do this. I'd have to play to try and find out.

No need to read the whole thing when it starts off this bad.

I don’t like playing killer anymore because it’s a big chore. I imagine the killer as an angry parent chasing their spoiled brats for children. It’s found it’s way more thrilling being chased, and with randoms. Rather than a team of SWFs that coordinate to the point that the killer is essentially bullied.

The killer being unable to kill survivors unless they have a Mori is completely stupid. The same way you always need a key for the hatch after it’s closed. Stupid. The Mori should allow the killer to kill much sooner, say after first hook. The key is for when you want to get inside with allies or after it’s been shut.

Hooking should be optional at the expense of displeasing the entity. Just allow killers to kill the survivors after being hooked twice. When they would die after being hooked anyway. In exchange they forfeit any points they would’ve gained, and doing it too much depips you.

The hatch should be able to be picked open after it’s been closed, but you have to pass some insane skill checks. Doing so also alerts the killer. The entity will block it for good if you were to fail said skill checks.

Its clear that this game is in its infancy stages based on the Archives. We’re not even half way through the game since we’re at what? The 4th tome? I expect about twice as many killers and survivors IF DBD lives long enough to deliver all those tomes.

It is unbalanced the development team has even made statements about it in previous vids as well as in statements about bug fixes. The fact that they want to balance it means that they intend to improve on it though recently they have made few efforts to improve the balance. If they were to keep the game the same for "the ones that enjoy the game" would be completely financially irresponsible. The new platforms and allowing them to play together has helped the game. But if they didn't intend to improve on the game ie. Change it then they wouldn't get new players and the new players is were the money is. Cosmetics and graphics are top priority atm but if this game wants to be around in 5 years it will need to make balance changes and it will need to get more players. Right now as this game stands I can't reccomend it to friends simply put because of the toxic community among other things. When someone tries to make an honest effort to improve the game instead of hearing and being respectful they out right say "spoken like a survivor when the person who posted just wanted to talk about it but as I scroll through the comments I see no real ideas or help/feedback. This may not of helped you but i hope it did. Please have a good one.

you're a survivor main pretending to be impartial...

I think that might be cool for a more Hide-and-Seek game, but those problems you mentioned also come with some exhilarating gameplay. Unhooking right under the killer's nose and escaping is infinitely more exciting than finding the respawn point and running to the exit.

the game that behaviour gave up on making had this mechanic of respawns

I think the best solution would be to create some new game modes with somewhat different rules and let players try them out. The game seriously needs some changes in some areas.

The problem with this idea is that sometimes actually going back to the hook is the best thing you can do.

Because many times I have found myself going to each generator and finding no one. Which led me to believe they were playing hide and seek, and when you need the pressure ASAP you can’t afford to not be able to see where you hooked someone.

Also many perks are connected to hooks so they would have to do an overhaul on perks which I don’t see them doing, considering what it takes just to fix one.

I'm actually a Killer main, I was just continuing the discussion for the most part. You make a lot of really good points, and that was exactly what I was hoping for. Just some discussion.

When I do play Survivor, I don't really encounter camping or tunneling all that often. In fact, I can think of once that I was directly face camped, and I was tunneled earlier today (for five damn generators), but I don't know how often it's actually happening. I don't personally see these two things happening as much as these forums would have you believe.

You hit a very good point with bad unhooking (mid chase especially). Often, it's not the Killers fault they were led back to a hooked survivor. I think what happens with a lot of Survivors that they don't see what they're doing as a misplay, but as bad manners by the Killer. Because very few players seem to want to admit their mistake. That's probably where the majority of the complaints come from.