Anyone else think med kits are way overtuned?
Med kits are kinda that thing that isn't completely broken that everyone starts talking about, but isn't weak enough to almost never see it. Here are my issues with them:
- It is extremely hard to start pressure at the start of the game using hit and run playstyles, which is almost required to do against good squads due to all the pallets being available.
- When you are forced to bail a survivor mid game this wasted time is used by the survivors to almost completely heal, removing the injury pressure you had.
- In late game they remove slugging opportunities (situational as the med kit will probably be used, but it's something to add and consider).
I barely see anybody actually talk about med kits, but I'm actually seeing a few 4 man med kit squads and it is so hard to get pressure going, even if my chases are short.
Just wanted to see if other people have an issue with them as well.
Comments
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The worst thing you can see is 4 medkits in a lobby. Basically guarantees you aren't going to be able to have map pressure.
Honestly I'm not sure why they buffed them a while back when they were already very strong.
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-go for chase
-get one hit in maybe
-survivor gets to a very strong tile
either
-either chase him through the tile and get 1 hook for 3 gens
-or leave him and he heals with medkit while 3 gens are atleast 50%
Everything broken about survivors consists of free healthstates. Now medkits atleast make you immobile and take a few seconds to do but look at stuff like DS,BT,DH,Adr etc lmao.
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I love green medkits especially with the right add ons and perks and you got yourself one speedy ass self heal
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Can’t say I’ve ever been particularly bothered by medkits.
If I see a squad with 4 med kits I use Doc and run Distressing, Coulrophobia, Overwhelimg, and Unnerving.
How you like healing now huh, survivors?!
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Except you can't swap killers to respond to items anymore.
If that were an option, we'd just play Plague.
Now your options very well may be "Wraith with Sloppy/Franlkins" or "dodge".
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True...
Although I’m either using Clown or Doc anyway, and can quickly swap in these perks.
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Why coulrophobia? There are so much better options for anti-heal.
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Franklins is actually a really good counter to med-kits because the Survivors are probably relying on them for healing, so they're pretty motivated to go across the map to get it, which creates slowdown. It's unlikely they'll have a perk like Bond, Self-Care, Blood Pact or Inner Strength if they're bringing a med-kit
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My favourite perk. Great for slugging in conjunction with Mangled. Easy hits on survivors trying to pick up downed teammates in your face.
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I mean, yeah, but it's really easy to counter.
Drop the Medkit on the ground at some accessible. Go get it when you need to heal.
Failing that, have an ally in your SWF pick up/drop the item when you get hit to cancel the consumption.
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They're definitely a bit strong if they're bringing in purple/pink addons or green/purple medkits for more than 1 full self-heal. It's a steeper uphill battle for the killer than normal against competent survivors - it's fairly ridiculous how much smoother even my solo-queue surv experiences improve by just bringing a brown medkit into every match. The issue is still that in most solo queue pepega hands it doesn't cover their shortcoming enough as they burn through half their medkit then get downed while being 3/4's healed.
Killer buffs and further survivor nerfs currently are centered around those solo queue survivors who can't communicate or easily meetup even with Bond or share "The killer has Nurse's Calling". It's a strange decision by the balance/design team to ignore that people can play with friends by the necessity of keeping a sizeable playerbase but actively hoping solo queue survivors not performing "optimally" is what they need to balance the game around.
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Dropping a Med-Kit is still slowdown because they'll have to come back for it even if it doesn't have a Franklins count down timer.
As for SWF... thats the counter for literally everything so it's not really fair to use it here
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Med kits are fine. Healing was substantially nerfed already if you didn't forget. Besides, killers have numerous options to deal with med kits.
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I think that the actual speed of healing is the biggest issue. If 4 survivors bring in a yellow medkit with a bunch of charges... Yeah, I'm kinda screwed, but what if it's a purple medkit with charges and speed? That's going form "screwed" to "you just annoyed Vlad the Impaler."
However, other than that, I don't think there's a problem. It's okay for something to be strong, and now that instaheals are autoheals I don't have a huge issue with them, except on a personal, I-bloody-hate-medkits level. But that's a personal tick due to them directly countering my playstyle, not a balance issue.
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I think right now the issue is that a lot of the other survivor items are just not that great.
Keys are strong, but it's a gamble on whether or not you'll find the hatch for it.
Maps are okay, but often you can remember where most things are anyways. And if you really need to find totems there are perks that do that too.
Toolboxes got justifiably nerfed, but they do feel awful to use.
Flashlights are wonky right now and honestly you don't really need to try flashlight save people.
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So you counter the perk by doing what it does before it does it itself?
You still have to waste time to go get your medkit. Not the mention that if you're solo changes are high a random passing survivor nabs it.
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Not exactly.
Franklins wastes time by forcing somebody to run into the middle of bumfuck nowhere to collect their item and has the added threat of destroying it entirely.
Say you're on Rotten Fields. If you put your Medkit by Shack, you can access it quickly from basically anywhere on the map.
Hell, you can even just put it by the generator you're working on. If you get interrupted, your Medkit is waiting for you next to a generator. Go there after you lose the killer (or get unhooked) to heal and immediately start repairs again.
Sure it's possible for ######### to steal your items, but if the killer has Franklins it's not like you were carrying that out of the trial anyways.
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Aah i see what tou mean. It does give you control of where the medkit is dropped
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Killers are locked because of the MMR-System running in the Background. Not because of a simple Bug. (And personally, I think complaining about not being able to switch to a Killer which negates the Survivor Item completely is kinda scummy.)
@Topic:
Medkits are probably the strongest Survivor-Items after Keys, but this is mostly because Toolboxes got nerfed so hard and Flashlights are bad as well. Only Maps havent been nerfed but were not good ot begin with. You can equip Franklins, you can equip Sloppy Butcher, it will also reduce the Healing Time against Medkits (aka the benefit from the Medkit will be smaller).
If the Devs seriously want to nerf Medkits, they should really remove a lot of stuff from the Survivor Bloodweb. There is already so much Junk in it which will never get used, and Medkits and a few of their Add Ons are basically the last things worth getting.
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Not saying that quickswitching to a different Survivor is not scummy (even tho, I think this is the result of Killers dodging Lobbies which was a huge time-waster on P2P), but I think it is a difference between "I use this Killer because they cant use their Medkits at all" and "I am not comfortable with this Killer, I want to use another one".
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medkits are hands down the strongest items in the game right now, I bring a medkit 8/10 games I play and for those good reasons you mention above. It counter a few perks like tphobia and lower down the pressure on killers like Wraith that benefits from hit n run
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👆🏽Yes, totally agree👆🏽
Medkits and their add ons were cut down fairly substantially.
Since I frequently run into Sloppy, or any of the 10 or so add-ons that cause the Mangled status effect, a med kit is necessary to not always force my teammates to heal me. Also, I Solo queue, soo can’t always be depending on anyone to get me back to full health.
I almost always bring Inner Strength and We’ll Make It anyway, so I’m not wasting too much time healing off unhook, and we can all get back to our objectives.
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Yep, one of my fav underrated perks!
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I think a lot of killers sleep on this perk, and get too caught up in the “why would survivors heal in the TR?!” thinking.
But a survivor that’s run away to heal still has a high probability of inadvertently be healing in the TR. It’s not like a killer stays still.
It’s great for slugging, and can actually become an area control perk when the survivors become desperate to regularly heal if the killer has proved they’re enough of a threat injured. I.e. the survivors will run as far away as possible in order to heal without the debuff, buying the killer gen control time.
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Medkit squads definitely got a buff since Killers can't switch to Plague anymore. Just slap on a Mori if you're worried.
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i mean, tbh i think their undertuned.
not as if there not strong speed wise, but in terms of charges. bringing a heal build is only so useful until you run out of charges, unless your doing a botany/desperate measures/we'll make it build, in which two out of those 3 perks are conditional.
Medkits themselves... i like how they stack now. if they had anymore speed increases i'd feel it was broken, but with how they require a lot of perks in order to get to a very powerful stage i feel their quite balanced, even if i wish they had more charges and less speed to an extent.
i do very much enjoy my green medkit, heal in 4s builds, that have like, maybe 1-3 heals max out of it. has killed me as much as its saved me. not to mention its countered by portions of the cast, not always safe to heal, not always valid to heal.
If your struggling against medkits specifically, franllins demise, unnerving presence and coulrophobia are all amazing counters to them. coul takes away all their healing speed meaning they can't heal around you, franklins can deprive them of their medkits, and unnerving presence (might be the other one always get them mixed up) degrades them at double the rate, meaning less charges, and if their using greens, possibly no full heal at all. sure two of those perks are tied to terror radius, but when your pressuring areas of the map as such, it forces survivors to move very far away from you, which also likely means far from generators, making it very difficult to get things done. not to mention coul also stops people picking up slugs fast, or franklins stopping people using flashlights or toolboxes.
besides if they've bought medkits, their typically bringing a heal build, which means 4 of their perk slots are likely to be taken up by other things. harder to fit decisive, adrenaline, dead hard, unbreakable, etc into a build with botany, desperate, born to last, self care, streetwise and resilience/we'll make it.
i see it as an opposite to the kind of thing ds is, or perks like it. whereas ds encourages you letting that survivor go even if its not optimal, medkits and heal builds encourage you to keep pressure on the survivor even if its not optimal.
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And with that new perk... They can use the whole kit to only get 50% back (which is usually another heal) in what 12-16 seconds (I think)
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Absolutely... Coulrophobia can also work well with Distressing, but I like it combo’d with Nurses, M&A and Knockout. It’s a build that most people won’t use since other aura reading/ alert perks (BBq, Infectuous, Tinkerer, etc.) are so common in builds.
I like this build tho, it maintains that similar area control mindset you mentioned, while intensifying the slugging aspect of the strategy.
Although Cphob, Nurse, M&A Tinkerer can be fun too, depending on the mobility of the killer.
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Great point. Medkits are by far the item I hate most going against, it's one of those things that seem 'fine' but if you think about it are completely busted when 2-3 survivors already are running them. It basically nullifies snowballing
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Well you got:
Franklin’s Demise to knock their Medkits to the ground
Overwhelming presence and Coulrophobia makes healing almost pointless within the TR.
Sloppy butcher to discourage and slow down healing.
Nurses Calling to catch out those who dare heal within 28m of you.
Take your pick
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Only the most busted Addons were cut down somewhat, and that is the minimum they could do. Even bringing just one brown Medkit eliminates far too much pressure from the killer, as it basically is a 5th perk (Self care) with absolutely no downside (if you bring self care, it wastes a perk slot)
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Play Plague. That goes for Op as well.
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the medkit is the best item a survivor can carry. the keys alone compete in strength. the problem is not the medkit itself and its addons as everything that happens in survivors is the amount that ends up unbalanced. 4 brown medkits are 64 seconds of time that can be spent repairing. Not counting the time you lose finding someone to heal you. if we add addons or other medkit rarity. the time saved is greater. not counting syringe and styptic agent. Today in a game there was a group of swf with 2 ranger medkit with gel dressing and styptic agent. that's 6 health states and 2 hits they can avoid. That time saved is like 2 generators plus the saving of perks. The only way i see to aboid this situatios is limit the amount of item per lobby.
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Except we can't swap killers in lobby...lol
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And?
Just pick Plague anyway, lots of survivors bring medkits.
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Medkits are already insanely strong with the right addons. And then you have stuff like We'll Make It, Botany Knowledge, Inner Strength (which is even stronger now that totems are actually a thing to deal with), and Desperate Measures—goodness, Desperate Measures...
Survivors have so many tools at their disposal to heal at the speed of light. Ever since the devs made the healing changes back in 2018 which made healing take 16 seconds at base, healing tools have been given a buff almost every patch, big or small. And it really makes me wonder why they nerfed healing in the first place if they were just going to make it go Super Saiyan anyways.
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Id rather not play plague.
I like deathslinger and already use Forced penance or sloppy, even then the heals still go extremely fast.
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Fair enough, just trying to help.
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Slightly I see people bring med kits most of the time. And one anti heal perk like sloppy will get trumped by it. But if you bring another anti heal from my experience they go by quick.
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Telling people a solution to their base game problem is to just play 1 killer just doesn't make any sense at all.
I personally play Plague all the time, but that doesn't fix the problem when I'm on any other killer.
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I think medkits are fine. At base they give only one heal, one and a half heals, or two heals. You can bring add ons to beef that up but it’s still capped out at... 3 full heals and 12 charges, if I’m remembering right.
If the devs nerf med kits they’ll just push the “don’t heal and rush gens for Adrenaline” meta which is insanely boring, so I’d rather they didn’t, personally.
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They're busted when multiple survivors have them. There's a reason most tournaments limit survivor teams to 1 medkit. It is almost impossible to generate any sort of pressure if survivors have 4 yellow medkits+charges. And before anyone chimes in saying we can't take tournament play into account...yes we can. The games are often 2k/2 escape because they remove broken stuff like keys, 4 DS/Unbreakable, Moris, 4 medkits, etc.
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Speaking of medkits, dodge if you see a ShinobiSlayer360 with one. If I have a medkit, its going to be me trading it for a flashlight, which I WILL bully you with. Not to mention I only trade insta meds for lights, since I hate insta meds and try to get rid of them.
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Please, don't nerf medkits too. I don't use flashlights, maps are meh, I avoid using keys and I used toolboxes a lot, before the nerf. The medkits are the only items I like now.
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I also think that there are way too many stackable gen regressing and heal slow down perks in combination with a hex perk that lets respawn hex perks as often as possible. I think those should get nerfed. And then we nerf medkits? Deal? Nice :)
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