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THE PIG - IS SHE VIABLE?
*Please note that these charts/statistics are not the 'be-all end-all' and should only be referenced for a very general/narrowed glimpse into actual gameplay*
I'm curious as to why Pig is currently (apparently) doing so well - I've always done pretty good with her, but as we know, anecdotal evidence is not worth the paper it's printed on, so I'd like to table this for discussion.
I realize that her kit is pretty decent/fun (stealth/ambush/trap/trap kill potential), particularly when used properly.
At worst, her traps force a survivor to cleanse 1(+) totems (-2s) in order to survive with the additional stress of seeing a DOOM ^_^ timer ticking away - This is particularly useful/sinister if multiple helmets are used with 1-2 generators remaining, as it prevents actual escapes, too (barring hatch). The choice of when/where to use your traps also opens up varying/adaptable playstyles depending on how the match is going. Survivor travel time (and potential exposure to the killer, resulting in rehooking/slugging) should also be included when looking at trap usefulness. Activated traps also negate survivor stealth/Iron Will with their beeping.
Like several other killers, she can negate Borrowed Time on a whim, which is a boon in this meta.
Her add-ons are also pretty useful (and more importantly, fun), fitting a variety of playstyles - Buffing her stealth, ambush, and even trap lethality (reduce timer/increase search time/aura reveal). Extra box add-ons also buff her traps, potentially forcing additional map traversal in order to remove it.
Do you think Pig is underrated by the community? Overtuned?
There is no question that she IS performing well to some degree, but how and why?
Comments
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She's definetely decent.
The only things she need is an addon rework,because most of her addons are just straight up garbage.
And her RBT RNG should be more consisten for both sides.
It's frustrating to see a survivor immeadiately find the right box after like 10 seconds,but's it's also frustrating to die from the RBT because you were just unlucky.
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Well, the vast majority of DBD players are not 100000 hours 4-man meta squads on coms so pretty much all killers are viable in my book if you take your time to master them especially considering the very best survivor teams will beat even Spirits and Nurses anyways so might as well practice and master the killer you truly enjoy.
EDIT: By "viable" I'm referring to the chance of winning most of your matches.
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People who play Pig are usually more than competent enough to stomp people at red ranks. In my experience Pig players are on the better side.
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Just a trash M1 killer with some very overpowered add-ons. Anyone who thinks anything else is out of their mind.
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I may be in the minority, but I like her add-ons. That's not even sarcasm @_@
I've honestly had some very silly/fun games stacking the extra box add-ons / using Tampered Timer and an extra box.
I think it will be hard to balance her add-ons if they give her a pass based on all the different things they effect.
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Given the current state of Nurse (bugs included), I'd really like them to take a second look at her. She'd probably the only killer I have trouble getting consistent/average results with, and often times it's literally not my fault :*(
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Pig: Built in slow-down and free kill with some luck.
She's gonna get a high-kill rate because of this. Red ranks? Use any sort of slow-down that's over time and after that first to second gen, no more will pop. The problem with pig, and why she needs a rework, are her addons. Currently, she only has about 2 addons worth running every game. Last will, and combat straps. Combat straps should be base kit anyway, and last will let's you get even more slowdown out. The increased search time addons are fine, but reduced timer doesn't do much against good survivors. They focus on traps first anyway. Her ultra rare addons are both kinda bad. Amanda's letter is ok with certain playstyle, but rule set n.2 is terrible. It goes against the main point of her traps, slowdown.
Pig sits in an ok spot, but the devs need to listen to the community when we say "__ needs a rework." And what we are complaining about. Most of the time, it's the addons that are the problem. Not the base kit. We don't need an entire rework every single time we want something fixed. Minor changes are easier on you, and get things changed faster.
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What add-ons do you think are overpowered?
The general consensus seems to be that she needs an add-on pass (I think she has some useful add-ons, though, personally).
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One could say the Nurse's bugs are as crazy as her power haha
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If you put on tampered timer and jigsaws sketch, there is actually 0 time to search all the boxes if your trap is activated on the hook. It is up to RNG if you live or die. I play her when I want to play russian roulette with the survivors. It is a 20% chance to die by RNG, more if the pig wants to deny you boxes. Does it bother me? Not at all. It is punishment for going down to one of the weakest killers in the game.
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no.
next
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it's nice to know that the pyramid head change was entirely unwarranted
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Well,even Scorpionz admit that the tampered timer,extra boxes and longer search time addons are absolutely busted given how likely those are to give you free kills.
And i'm mainly talking about her ultra rare,more skill ckecks and RBT status effect addons.
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She needs more addons that relate her crouching/Dashing abilities. I also wish her hats (and Trapper's traps) were less RNG based. When survivors get all 4 hats off on their first try it feels like ny power's been crippled.
Other than that though I think she's in a pretty good place - and I used to think she was one of the worst killers in the game. Since then though I've gone against some scary good Rank 1 piggies and I've gotten pretty decent with her myself.
She's also the only killer bound by the Ancient Accords of Boop, obligated to release any survivor who honks her snoot. This legendary pact always tickles me as one of the more wholesome elements of the game.
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It makes me so mad when I'm dominating a team, and then....THE BOOPING BEGINS.
Be free, my beautiful angels....be free ^_^
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I believe that there are techniques now that minimize/nullify the change (more or less).
I haven't played him enough from the change to try it out - I don't think he's very fun.
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Upon reflection, I think she is better/more consistent than certain controversial killers like Pyramid Head and Deathslinger.
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Not really.
Her traps are still heavily RNG dependent
Deathslinger and Pyramid Head are more consistent but harder to play than pig.
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My dislike for Pyramid Head comes mostly from the fact that triggering his Torment mechanic is largely outside of my hands outside of certain scenarios.
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Your title's weird, because every killer is viable at every rank so it's kind of a redundant question. But about Pig herself she's just...meeeeh. Meh slowdown, meh stealth, meh chase ability. I used to play her a lot but ran out of combat straps and video tapes and she feels awful without them so I stopped playing her. She definitely could do with some changes to make her more unique, because she's like Demo: Does a lot of things but unlike Demo she doesn't do any of them well.
Apparently she had a 28m Terror Radius at one point in time, I kinda want that to come back, would definitely give her something kind of unique and interesting
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She's semi viable to me. Her bear trap rng can swing the game too far to either direction. Either they cannot get them off and spend all match not working on gens or they get them off immediately and she no longer has a slowdown. Her add-ons also need to be looked at. If you're playing mainly stealth and ambush her better ones are yellow and an Iridescent but all of the add-ons that should be stronger affect her rng heavy power and become 4-5 time use or are kinda useless depending on how quickly they get them off.
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Not gonna lie - Demo is a killer that I honestly think is HUGELY underrated.
Most of my Demo games end in 4k w/ 32k BP.
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At worst, the time it takes to remove a trap is equivalent to time spent on hook + 15% of a gen (search time) + travel time to a box - Even if a survivor does progress gens/heal/whatever with a helmet on, they're eventually going to need to take the time sink.
I think it's a bit more impactful than people realize, especially when combined with 'actual' slowdown like Ruin/Pop/Surge/etc.
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He absolutely is under-rated, at least on the forums. A killer that requires some work and practice to be good with will usually be viewed as weak on here. It's the same with Deathslinger and Nurse. Deathslinger is very underrated, and I consider him to be the 3rd or 4th best killer in the game because if you're good at aiming with the right build and add-ons you'll almost never lose a game.
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Someone made a topic recently about Deathslinger having some type of weird aim shakiness/bug right now.
I think it was @MeltingPenguins
I can respect your opinion regarding him, though - I don't think he's weak at all!
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I could be an outlier - My experiences are definitely not universal (or at least I'd pray to God that they are not T_T)
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I definitely agree with you there but when an unhooked survivor has theirs off within 30 seconds of being unhooked it just negates the add-ons for that trap, you can either put a new one on them or hope it provides a longer effect on the next person. I've had matches where they stay on for a very long time but I've also had games where within the first three gens I'm out of traps and all of the survivors have theirs off.
She is a stronger killer than most people give her credit for, I just think her power rng is too much of a variable. That's why I say she's semi viable.
I'm also looking at it from a baseline standpoint, just her, her perks, and her add-ons. I can slap BBQ, Ruin, Undying, and any random 4th perk and any killer can become more viable. After grinding and finishing adept achievements for the last couple months I have started to look at viability from a basekit, add-on, and teachable standpoint because those are what's needed for the adept rather than someone that has unlocked everything on that specific killer.
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If I get a quick down + trap + hook followed by a second down shortly after, I usually save the other 3 traps for mid-late game (3 or less gens) pressure based on the assumption I can outplay at least 2 of the 4 fairly easily.
Baseline, unfortunately, she suffers just like many other killers (look at Blight - Hex Undying w/o any other Hex perks). You could also state the same for survivors, though - Sure, they can be strong baseline without any perks depending on the player (just like most killers), but adding extra abilities/boons is obviously going to make a difference regardless of who/what you play.
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I've learned and do conserve my traps as needed. Generally I prefer playing her stealthy since her traps aren't as reliable and are a limited resource unlike every other killer.
Blight has Hex: Blood Favor to go with Undying and his add-ons can drastically make up for his shortcomings. Compound 21 for the "wall hacks" or any turning add-on if you're like me and have a hard time maneuvering with him. So him at baseline isn't that bad. Pig is a little off when it comes to perks but hers provide a lot of information (reworked Hangman's and Surveillance) with snowball potential (Make Your Choice) but her power makes up for those shortcomings having such a potentially strong slowdown with the rbt.
In general I agree with you, I just think everyone has a different idea of viability, win conditions, etc, when it comes to this game. I do place Pig in above average tier with how I look at viability though and other perks are cherries on top. My three killer mains are Pig, Hag, and I'm learning Nurse so I'm not dunking on her at all, she's super fun but to me rng can be spotty.
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in solo q and normal survivors? yes other than that no
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I forgot about Blood Favor :(
*runs away*
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I’m tired of people complaining that the pig is all rng based. The whole point of her reverse bear traps are meant to be rng because the moment she puts a trap on you head a secondary game begins in the the dbd match. THE PIG IS MEANT TO BE rng stop complaining.
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She's viable but she takes time to master unlike Freddy so be patient!
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I'd say yes, she is viable, I love that she has a somewhat slowdown.
She is fun to play as, not sure against since I rarely play against her.
The only personal issues that I have with her are her addons, most are completely garbage and some are decent to good.
She just needs an addon rework imo, also her adept sucks ass.
She is also one of the best users for stbfl since she doesn't lose stacks if you attack with the crouching dash whatever is called.
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In the right hands she's viable
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I'm pretty good with M1 killer, as I usually play them. So I usually do well with pig because she has the best slowdown among all killers...if rng favours you.
But against experienced survivors, she's quite underwhelming as her secondary power (crouch & ambush) is too weak IMO
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Random thought: Would it make the Pig more or less RNG based if the odds of escaping a Reverse Bear Trap increased by how many you've already searched?
If I'm not mistaken, right now when you put a trap on someone, that trap is keyed to a specific Jigsaw Box on the map. You can find it in one go, or it'll be the last one you search. What if, instead, you had a set chance of escaping on a Jigsaw Box that increased with each one searched. The first one you search is a 25% chance, second is 50/50, third is 75%, and last is guaranteed.
It would offer consistent odds of getting the Reverse Bear Trap off while reducing the odds it occurs the first time you do it due to a lucky guess. Add-ons that increase the number of Jigsaw Boxes change the odds accordingly, so for example 5 boxes would be 20/40/60/80/100. Odds are most people would get it off on second or third, but a bit of good luck can get it for you on the first, and bad would cause it to be last. It would be less guesswork where you're guaranteed to fail unless you find just the right box.
I'm not sure there's a way for the Pig's power to work as it is currently without some RNG element, so something consistent across the board would seem the best way to work around that.
I've also seen a few people mention that Ruleset No. 2, which causes Jigsaw Box auras to be hidden until the trap activates, should be baseline.
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IMO, she is not strong (though that won't stop me from from playing her). I think her powers are either inconsistent (her Traps) or unreliable (her ambush). Also, she has a lot of add-ons that aren't just bad but downright trash.
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Just taking a gut guess, Pig might be really good against average survivors but relatively weaker than other killers against top survivors. A couple of reasons for that
- Her stealth works best against survivors with average situational awareness. Top survivors tend to be much more aware of their surroundings and possible ways a stealth killer can approach so are less susceptible to Undetectable characters sneaking up on them. They also are more likely to have Spine Chill which further hurts her stealth
- The reverse traps work best against survivors who aren’t intimately aware of the map and box locations and aren’t as savvy about how traps work (e.g. not knowing the trap doesn’t turn on until a gen is done so they may have a bit of time to finish a gen if needed before taking it off). Also Pig needs to down the survivors in the first place in order to place the traps on them, but obviously the better the survivor is at running the longer it takes to chase and down them. So in a way reverse traps are a bit if a “win more” ability, they can help you even more when your winning but if you’re losing and having trouble getting downs they don’t have as much impact.
So it’s possible that Pig os a killer that has a relatively high success rate at mid ranks but a relatively low success rank specifically against high rank survivors. And since those charts both appear to be including all survivors (i.e. the Red Rank chart is the killer is red rank but includes all the games where they faced non-red rank survivors) and since there are more average players than red rank players it would lead to an above average kill rate for Pig in this scenario.
I’d love to see a third chart which is filtered for games where all five players are red rank. It would be interesting to see what sorts of shifts there might be in these percentages. (I’m guessing that the overall kill rate across all killers in that chart would be closer to 55-60% for instance and that you might see Pig go down and Spirit go up, that sort of thing.)
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if you ever saw skorpionz play pig, you wouldnt be asking that question
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Honestly not suprising, pig is actually one of the best m1 killers against decent survivors because she's got the built in slowdown with RBTs. Even if each RBT only keeps a survivor off gens for 30 seconds thats still 2 minutes of keeping a survivor off a gen that you wouldn't be able to otherwise. Realistically you will probably get more than 30 seconds from your RBTs. Even a survivor getting their trap off in 1 box is probably wasting at least 20. More often you'll see them wasting anywhere between 40 seconds and a minute and a half getting their trap off.
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She's a good killer, but got the same problem as trapper: RNG.
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Pig is pretty strong, except in chase. She's kind of the opposite of Clown. I'd trade a bit of lethality of those RBT's for more consistency and a better chase power.
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In my opinion Pig is the worst killer in the game along with Trapper. The thing about her is that she, while being bad, is extremely effective against bad players, if you have right build. 90% of her addons are useless or BS. Imo she really needs changes, desperately.
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I rarely survive the pig. Highest rank I’ve been is a 5. Too many tools in her chest.
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