Is the ebony mori really needed?
First of all I don't think having moris over all is a bad thing, but the ebony mori is really too powerful. Having the ability to kill every survivor right off of the first hook is just too powerful. It make matches boring and stale, and I have come with a solution. Instead of being able to kill all four survivors after their first hook; killers should only be able to kill two survivors off of first hook. If not that isn't good enough you could have the ebony mori kill all the survivors when their on dead hook. Keep in mind that the last solution kind of comes into conflict with Pyramid Head's power so it's viability on Pyramid Head wouldn't be the same as other killers, but when you're using a mori I don't think you're thinking of its viability. This is just my thoughts, I'd like to see what you think.
Comments
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Something a lot of people overlook is how much pressure the killer loses when he kills someone with a mori. The remaining 3 survivors don't have to stop what they're doing to go and unhook the (now) dead survivor. If people were messing around then sure, the game could snowball really quickly, but if the killer is having a little trouble getting survivors down in the first place, that's a loss of 3 gens.
Start using ebony mori in your games, you'll see it's not the instant win that it seems like.
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I think your first option probably works better because the second one will cause tunneling even more than now. My only question is how would you change keys. Moris can't be nerfed in that way but then have one survivor bring a key/find a key and have 2-4 survivors all jump in the hatch (depending on part of the match and situation). If you have a reasonable solution to keys so that those don't become way better than moris (when they are essentially the same concept but for the different sides), then I think the first option would work best. Assuming those two options were the only options.
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Personally I think you should have to hook each survivor once to be able to start using it. That's the best fix imo. It doesn't kill the offering and it discourages tunneling. Honestly though I wouldn't care if they just deleted them completely. I don't use them anyways.
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Yes, in the sense that it's nice to have broken toys to pull out every once in a while.
No, in the sense that some toys are too broken and too common.
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I do use ebony moris from time to time and the pattern I see is that the pressure lost from using a mori is gained back immediately because the survivors have lost 25% of their team. Now if you can't use the mori because of personal skill that is a different story, but to killers who have a good understanding of the game and also have some skill ebony moris are too powerful.
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It's not instant win that's for sure. Definitely overpowered though.
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Except if someone is mori’d the game goes from a 4v1 to a 3v1
instead of 3 people on gens it’s two
instead of 3 people able to save, it’s 2, 1 when the killer goes to the other guy on BBQ
etc.
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Lol, this is great. I have never seen someone try to imply ebony mori's favor the survivor.
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lol you can never really "see them all" when it comes to the things people say in DBD
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Pretty sure that that's a copy pasta
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Ya'll laugh, but you lose the weak link on your team to a mori and you don't have to rescue them anymore. The rest of you loop the killer and escape. You've played matches where you don't get hooked once, right? An offering does not change the killer's loadout.
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Except it doesn't work like that. It actually becomes extremely easy to pressure the remaining survivors if you immediately remove one from the game as once you hook one of the three, the second is forced to rescue and heal and the third is being chased by you, meaning no one is doing generators.
The only chance the survivors have to win is by forfeiting altruism or the killer is simply inefficient and gets looped for 2-3 minutes and allows the other two survivors to do generators for free.
Even the weak link can hold M1 on a generator. It's why four survivors is much harder to pressure since there is always someone on a generator, progressing the game, whereas with three, you're not.
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I feel like the survivors I go against are much harder to hook/down than most people. The entire bloodlust outcry went completely over my head too. Don't get me wrong, eliminating a survivor is a good thing as a killer, but I've never seen a situation where everything collapses in on itself when the first survivor dies.
Then you lose two survivors. Okay. Then another, then it's a hatch game. I get that.
...I simply don't believe a mori changes the outcome of the game. If you were going to stop the killer, he's still getting stomped. If the killer was going to stomp you even without a mori, it's just killing you with flair.
Using a mori as a game changing offering kinda goes over my head too, but I believe Mori should be how it used to be where you were mori-able on first down and didn't need to be hooked, and NOED shouldn't be a totem and activate as soon as the exit gates are powered. These are wildly unpopular opinions in the current crop of players, but I haven't really seen a reason to change my mind.
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I see the argument a lot that it makes the game boring and stale and thats why it shouldn't exist however
I haven't seen moris in days and haven't used one in a few weeks because I only use them under certain conditions
I see 4x as many key wielding survivors as I do moris but I don't hear people complaining about the moris counterpart as much as survivors complain about moris
plus the moris were in the game for the flashy kills and flavor in a horror game not because every now and then it makes people lose when they other wise would have lost 6 minutes later instead
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An ebony mori, or even a green mori are the strongest things Killers can bring because they significantly shorten the game down.
For ebony, you reduce the win condition from 12 hooks to four hooks, which is even more powerful if you're nasty and immediately tunnel the first hooked guy out of the game.
For green, like I said above, three survivors are easy to pressure into no generators being done, easy win.
Mori's are just an easy win for the Killer. You might not 4K if you're terrible at the mechanics of Killer, but if you're even decent, you'll kill most of the survivors without effort.
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We agree with each other, a killer's skill is the big deciding factor in all of this. My argument is that if everyone got mori'd, they were probably going to die anyway. It's just like being one/two hooked because your team didn't save you. You just got a special intimate moment with the killer instead of floating up to the sky.
Also while I'm at it bring back the Brand New Parts. I want to see modern killers poop themselves when 4 gens are done 30 seconds into the match.
Also bring back pallet vacuum kthx.
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It's just much harder to win in comparison to using a red mori since you need 12 hooks and cannot bypass perks like DS.
Not saying its hard to get a 4k as a Killer (which is amazing considering a 2K is the balanced result the developers want) since survivors can be potato, the difficult just becomes extremely easy if you have any idea how to play a killer with a red mori.
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Not only are Ebony Moris incredibly powerful but they are also incredibly common on the bloodweb. How can my Legion (lvl 32) have 4 Ebonys, 2 Greens, and however many yellows??? Thats pure insanity. Low-rank/low-level killers should especially not be given free Moris. The whole point of low-ranked matches is that they last long and award more BPs so new players can level up their perks and make their characters competitive, and more importantly to actually get better at the mechanics of the game; Moris shortchange them on both accounts
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I don't feel like it is but at the same time it gives Killers a safe feeling. If they see that the game is falling out of their grasp they can just kill off a survivor and feel like their in control again. I feel like Ebony's should be more rare than they are maybe even more so than Cakes and Bloody Party Streamers. I think I collected 20 of them when I was trying to get Midwich map offerings which I only got 2 out of nearly 2 million bloodpoints.
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Personally I don't think Moris or Keys (in the hatch sense) should be usable until after 9 minutes in to the match. Or whatever time the silver Gatekeeper emblem checks for. Stops either from making the game too short, doesn't need to make and new hoops to jump through to use them.
Also the "you have no idea how tunneling and mori'ing one survivor loses pressure for the killer" argument is the best troll nonsense I've seen in weeks.
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What? How does someone get the line of thought that a Mori can be bad for the Killer?
If a Mori is used early (which means - before 4 or at the very least 3 Gens are completed) and the game turns into a 3v1, the Killer can only lose if the Skill Gap between them and the Survivors is REALLY big. Meaning if the Killer is way worse than the Survivors he is going against.
The usual way of playing is that 1 person is on the hook, 1 person is going for the safe and 1 person is getting chased. Which leaves 1 person on Gens. If it is a 3v1, that last person is gone, the game cannot really progress for the Survivors anymore. You have to mess up massively to lose while using a Mori.
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Well, in the current form of DBD keys and mori's are kinda tied together too tightly to remove or change one without the other. See a key, bring a mori for that survivor is the current sentiment. See multiple, bring an ebony.
But on its own, yes the ebony mori is definitely overkill imo. I don't even like the green one js, but that's a different story.
I think the second suggestion would be fine potentially as its just taking the place of death hook, so it'd mostly just be a small time saver.
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It's not needed, but watch the killer community nerd rage, even if keys were removed at the same time.
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It's like what I was talking about with Mr. Zaytex. We agree. Based on the killer skill, if he/she/it gets enough downs before a certain amount of gens are done, then yes it does toss the game in the killers favor, absolutely. However if the killer can't get enough downs to create that pressure due to looping, flashlight saves, pallet saves etc etc, the killer would lose regardless of what its offering is.
Like for example this was when I was a baby Trapper learning the game, and I kept this screenshot because it was my first 4mori kill.
Did I win because I was a god at Trapper or did I win because we're all newbies and killers have an advantage at low ranks? Do you think I could have pulled off a 4k mori at red ranks back then?
If only one survivor gets mori'd, is it different from an ivory? If 2 get mori'd, is it different from a tombstone piece? Alternatively, is a Huntress can't hit her iri hatchets, does it matter if she's running it?
This game is way too random to be competitive, but I see people disconnect in the loading screen if the killer offering is hidden. I'm just saying you're overstating the danger. No key in the world can save you if you can't find the hatch. Just my two cents.
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I primarily play killer. I support this
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Red and yellow mori should be removed and the green mori should take the reds place
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I need something to can play Trapper against SWF of 3 or 4 people.... 1 day i just get tired when i played 4 consecutive matches against full SFW and didn't get a single kill, impossible. Thousands of hours, lanterns, DS all.... Since then, if i see they are SWF of 3 or 4, i go take mori 100%
I play more survivor than killer, but need to say more problematicthan mori is SWF... with many killers... and specially Trapper.
Mori just need a little nerf, maybe like need to hook 3 or 4 survis before can mori them
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The devs have stated that keys and moris are being reworked, but BHVR has a track record of announcing something's happening and either taking months to follow up on it (reworked perks), or doing nothing at all (console optimization).
Personally I don't like to use moris. I don't find it fun as killer to end a match as quickly as possible, and it's even worse as a survivor knowing that you're dead after your first hook. And being on the receiving end of a mori is the worst because most likely that means you're going to be tunneled and camped until you're dead. Nothing worse than knowing that thanks to a toxic killer with a Mori, that you walked away with only 5,000 blood points.
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I cannot believe this is getting upvotes. Never have I seen a more pure example of killer main bias in DBD history.
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They can fix Mori's by making them only work after the second hook phase.
They can fix key's by removing them from chests.
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Don”t play against moris. End of the problem
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It's important to remember a lot of people just don't like to argue. However, despite the vocal ones dismissing and laughing, the simple fact is I am correct and the majority agrees with me.
I'm not a killer main either, I play both sides equally and have for a few years now. I don't see how people would pay for the game then not use everything available to them. Plus some survivors look cool.
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It really is an easy win tho. Having 1 person dead is way more pressure than 1 hook.
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Eh I'd like these changes to moris
Cypress Mori stays the same, but is no longer a secret offering
Ivory Mori can kill 1 survivor after all survivors have been hooked at least once
Ebony Mori can kill 2 survivors after all survivors have been hooked at least once
That's honestly all you have to do to them and they're slightly balanced while still being strong enough to bring into your games.
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Is the KEY is really needed ?
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LOL
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i have to agree with your one point. that ebony mori should only work when they are on dead hook. taking a survivor out off the game so early on after being hooked once literally can ruin the entire match for the other survivors aswell as the person who spent 10 mins in a queue only to play like less than 3 mins in a game with less than 5k points to show for it.
the other survivors are not getting the other 3 gens done plus do the gates and plus do any HEX TOTEMS aka ruin/undying on the map. its completely unfair just like keys.
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Imagine how you would've felt at the beginning of the game, when moris didn't require even hooking someone 😎
While many perks and abilities exist to kill survivors, moris I feel are fine to keep, after all, there's challenges that require you to kill survivors, daily rituals, and even achievements... so, having a mori increases those odds of completion.
I feel people who have the most issue with moris are relatively new to the game, and only complain about them now... never have I seen as much complaining as I have in the last year or so... 🤷
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Daddy
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