The Twins - Enjoy the non gameplay while it lasts.
Good evening,
So far not enjoying versing the twins against rank 1 killers. I wholeheartedly agree the twins aren't overpowered but there are very mundane aspects of the kit that I've felt I need to vent.
Issue 1: Charlotte doesn't have terror radius when swapped to victor. One strategy currently is to leave Charlotte at the hook with a hooked survivor and use victor to pressure survivors off the gens and swap to charlotte as soon as there is indication of survivor save. Swap back and now there is no borrowed time effect and an easy tunnelled hit.
Issue 2: Basement is blockable by Charlotte. Therefore basement hooks are currently unsaveable if the killer decides to block the stairs whilst still being able to use victor to pressure generators. I'm not gonna go into detail with this because basement is meant to be a tile killer can turn/win games easily with. It's your fault for going down in basement etc. Just found this extremely unfair because the twins can keep basement locked down globally and have victor stop generator progress.
Issue 3: Hits are very quick with victor. It plays like legion but with the ability to down. The pressure is insane. Pallets, Windows are unsafe as well as the lunge range being huge. You feel the need to try and weave side to side to at least try and throw the killer off. This is an interaction similar to deathslinger where he baits ADS then gets the free m1 because you didn't run in a straight line.
Now I haven't mentioned with getting all these downs the time it takes to actually hook survivors with charlotte is uncanny. It isn't hard to get to the endgame against this killer. Also, the killers I'm playing against tend not to swap to victor until getting the m1 on a healthy survivor first. I'm guessing this is because the survivors in this rank bracket know to not crush victor on your back.
Solo queue against the twins is also incredibly difficult because it's not uncommon for the twins to get a lot of slugs. However, not be in position to hook them and have victor chasing someone else and nobody gets anyone up. Perhaps allow survivors to hear victors lunge scream global maybe similar to demo?
Overall, I'm not suggesting the killer is overpowered. On the contrary actually quite weak. It's just extremely unfun to go against these players using these strategies which are just not fun and I don't think they were intentional except maybe victors very small charge time, zero lunge cancel time and a very forgiving hitbox cone. It's a mess at rank 1 for this killer. I only manage to do well in the games if I take first chase and run a 115% killer to the best of my ability. Usually they will give in and use victor to get the ball rolling. Is it enough time to win a solo q match? Maybe? Only if everyone is optimal with generators!
tl;dr weak 1v4 killer but the 1v1 seems to not challenge either party - easy free hits and not being able to use environments effectively as survivor. I've found using small unsafe pallet loops quite feasable against victor but I'm sure once killers practice it more they will have no issues getting the hit.
I suggest giving terror radius onto charlotte when swapped out to allow borrowed time - it's only fair... There is nothing you can do to prevent a tunnel except for taking a hit - if the killer allows it or if the hook was on a loopable tile. I don't think it's fair to say that if you get hooked on a deadzone hook it should be game over.
All my analysis was from perspective of survivor. I tried to make sure all my claims were correct to the information on the wiki. Please correct me if I'm wrong on anything. I do play killer and was a huge fan of the blight release. I love high skill cap killer play! It's very healthy for high rank dead by daylight!
Cheers!
Comments
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I agree there's camping issues with The Twins, both with leaving Charlotte close with 0 terror radious or camping with victor who also has no terror radious and so no Borroed time is applied. This being said I do disagree in that Victor's Pounce is too strong, it it indeed a very useful tool to create massive pressure but if it comes with the risk of missing, which is much more punishing than any other killer by letting the survivors get rid of your power for a few seconds (which, admitedly, I think it's too short) and moving you across the map out the the chase.
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Thanks for your reponse.
I didn't cover the fact that missing is very very punishing which was part of what makes the killer really weak. I do understand that it's meant to be high risk high reward play which is what BHVR were going for here. I was more alluding to the killers that use it to get in your face with victor and hold the pounce to guarantee the hit. I mean starting the pounce, cancelling it, rinse and repeat until it's impossible to miss. Remember, it is 150% movement speed. Again, it's a 1v4 I get that killers need to down to win the 1v4. I suppose I would accept it like I accept losing to a good deathslinger. I suppose my frustration is from the gameplay I've watched and played against victor is that he is much much easier to use. I'm probably not going to see this killer much anyway when the fad is over but I'm glad you see the camping issue too. That being removed would be enough for me.
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You do realize you can just kick victor while Charlotte is being controlled if he's left at the hook right?
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I think they meant camping controlling victor - not Charlotte. Victor has no terror radius either therefore BT does not activate.
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I honestly appreciate the constructive criticism instead of just complaining which is the norm on the forums. You make some good points, the only thing is (I haven’t tested it btw so I don’t know) but doesn’t Charlotte have to be a certain distance from the hook before she can switch to victor, like can she actually be out of that designated range while bodyblocking basement stairs?
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if you stick with injured survivors and vise versa let them take the hit, crush victor, then heal them. unless charlotte is close you wasted the killers time and if you use wglf you can heal them almost every time.
heal and don't take off victor, whoever has victor needs to wait at a loop near a gen no one is on this takes away the killers power turning her into a m1 killer which is very beatable with 3 survivors.
using victor to down only one survivor or only latch onto one survivor is extremely inefficient regarding time and the reward you get for doing so especially if all the above is being used against you. victor is only good if he gets a down and a healthy survivor or if you use him in a chase and can get back onto the survivor quickly.
this killer is only strong if you let them be, prepare to be idle for a bit, make sure your team is healed, know when you can crush victor. if you have WGLF follow injured survivors being chased by victor because if they get downed it won't matter you crush victor and pick them back up resulting in the killer gaining nothing. it's literally a god tier perk against the twins.
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I haven't played the twins live but on the PTB you literally could not camp Charlotte while controlling Victor since
1.) Victor can't hook Survivors, only down them.
2.)Charlotte has to be a distance from the hook after hooking someone to switch back to Victor. In the time it took to switch from Victor back to Charlotte is enough to finish the unhook animation and get a considerable distance before the killer fully regains control of Charlotte, even using her Black Hood add-on.
Like I said, I haven't played as or against them yet in live so the numbers might have changed a little but I can't imagine they would reverse this.
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Are you sure basement stairs are still blockable? I thought it was patched out a while back, mainly cause of the pig; and the only entirely blockable hook is the 2nd floor one on Tompson's House.
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That's an excellend point about crushing victor after he downs a survivor. I'm facepalming at missing that detail. Honestly this post was more based around the camping that's currently live. I'm all for the killer being able to setup an idle off gens with victor. I seriously am all for it. Pressure is great. I was just hoping the the pounce cancel was so quick given it is 150%. If it doesn't change; I will live. Many more killers with doomed if you do doomed if you don't in their kits.
Yes victor cannot hook survivors. Point was leaving Charlotte as a ward at the hook and controlling victor. Switching back to Charlotte as soon as you are notified of the save. There is no borrowed time and a very small amount of time to gain distance from charlotte.
EDIT:
I could be wrong about this. What I experienced happened once on fractured cowshed. I was able to walk into the basement with the charlotte ward at the top of the stairs but couldn't get back up when she was in swap phase. Could be a one time bug maybe not consistent. Apologies.
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My point is she has to be a distance from the hook before you can swap back to Victor and he even has to be a certain distance before you can swap back to her after you've been controlling him. The time it takes before she can do anything other than walk in a straight line after taking control is considerable and the only thing that shortens that is a single add-on that doesn't shave off much time.
Additionally the only way you can leave Victor close enough to a hook is to plant him before hooking and when/if you switch back to him you cannot switch back to Charlotte until you are crushed or move away from the hook as him.
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I've been enjoying her as a survivor
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