Do the new killer promote toxic behavior?
I main as a survivor. I have seen tons of great killers and not so great killers. Now without bias I think that the players that play as the twins face camp and tunnel more than most. It may not even be intentional, i just think that the twins promote this by being able to split into 2 killers. Not every twin ive come up against has done this but a large majority do. They will hook a survivor, let victor loose and down everyone else with victor. as soon as another survivor tries to unhook they switch and down the previously hooked survivor.
I would say 8 out of 10 in my experience with the twins have done this. The match ends with one survivor on the hook and 3 survivors on the ground.
i understand that not every killer face camps and this is not a universal occurrence but i would like to open up a discussion based on my personal experiences and see if you guys are going through something similar.
ALSO WHAT IS UP WITH VICTOR JUMPING THROUGH LOCKERS?!?!
i know every killer has a different play style but i would like to ask if you dont camp as anyone else do you camp as twins? Like i said it may not even be intentional but like the title says "Do the new killer promote toxic behavior?"
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Problematically, Victor enables fiercer camping. And Devs have already said that "Its a legitimate strategy" Sooo take that as you will. I think the twins just excel at it
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The way the twins are built absolutely encourages slugging and, to a lesser degree, camping. If you're playing to win, then you are most likely injuring everyone with Charlotte and some Victor, then slugging as many as possible with Victor. Against good Survivors who are also trying to win, it's pretty much required, otherwise gens will quickly and easily outpace your damage.
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Agree, I main killer and I have played a lot with the twins. The most efficient way to play is camping, I don't know what can be done, but they need to address this.
On the other side, jumping on lockers is fine. You can't be able to completely deny a killer's power by just jumping in a locker
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So then what you are saying is that the players who, say main as nurse, do NOT play this way and it is essentially the best strategy as the twins?
I question if the killer doesnt camp as their main do they camp as the twins because thats what the twins promote?
I think there are hundreds of strategies for a killer to use as trapper or Myers and so on but the twins promote this single strategy.
perhaps not face camping as much as babysitting.
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i suppose youre right. there should be a way to attack the survivor if they are in a locker. If the survivor is fully healed and victor jumps in the locker charlotte can not retrieve you unless you get out intentionally or victor dies, i think this is a bug or oversight by devs
also thank you for answering my question as far as do they promote camping. i have to ask do you camp as other killers?
no judgment just wondering
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My statement was that yes, the twins power setup actively promotes slugging, because at the level of both sides being good mechanical players and both sides are actively trying to WIN the match, the Twins optimal strategy is injuring all or most Survivors, the using Victor to down all the injured players. I'd argue that the Twins, in fact, cannot even win without doing so (again, looking at it from both sides being high skilled, trying to win, and playing optimally - because that's wheee balancing in pvp games has to actually start from).
Obviously, twins vs Survivors who are less skilled than they are leave them more room to play with other strategies. Even then, it's still most efficient to do it the slugging way.
I don't think the twins REQUIRE the alternating control camping, but they absolutely are well suited for it.
Same goes for exit gate camping.
Not necessary to win, but the design makes it effective to do on her.
So yes, unlike a few, much stronger killers, the twins design definitely encourages methods that are less than fun for Survivors to play against.
That being said, heavy slugging is often very effective on any killer, and when a high tier nurse player decides to play the slug game, say when the Survivors all grouped up to heal someone, it's scary how fast a match can go from up in the air to "all over but the crying".
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Dude i didnt even think about exit gate camping. Thats a scary thought lol. Thank you for your input i didnt want to just chalk it up to a batch of toxic killers. i figured this is promoted and dont want to hold it against the killers. without them there will be no me. cant play killer to save my life.
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Yeah, it is pretty terrifying.
Honestly, despite the general belief of many forum Survivors, there's a large number of killers who don't camp or only camp when the situation calls for it (like you hook a guy and there's 2 Survivors just standing around waiting like they don't have anything better to do).
There's also a subset I'd call desperation camping, when the game has gone totally off the rails for the killer and they decide they'd rather at least have one skull on the score screen than zero.
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yeah but as a survivor main if i see someone getting camped at the fallout because the game went off the rails in the survivors favor i will risk my escape to save. especially if im running BT. Usually this method ends with ME dead on hook but hey my conscience is clear lol
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Yeah, and you're not alone. Just always remember if you wind up giving a camper multiple kills doing that, you're encouraging them.
It's also why I can't take kill rate stays seriously. I see a whole lot of people throw away the whole team just to try and save one guy.
I guess I'm just a bit more mercenary in how I play, I save folks when I can, but if you get nailed right at the end and the killer is clearly securing it... I'm out, man, I'll see you at the campfire.
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Well, there isn't much they can do besides that
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Oh man I have never seen a killer camp or tunnel as much. I thought bubba was bad. Every single time I've gone against the twins, everyone was tunneled and camped. Every. Single. Time. It's not fun, and I don't see how that's even fun for the killer either
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Yeah exactly! I'm not trying to throw the survivor book at them but honestly I've seen so many people DC whenever they hear victor being let loose because they're probably tired of the same outcome. I love this game for the vastly different matches that I play but when I know we're all going to be camped and tunneled it becomes dry or stale. All in all maybe we're just in an early stage of this killer and haven't found our right counter strategy which probably involves unbreakable and soul guard.
I'm not trying to Killer Shame the twins for trying to do their jobs, I honestly just wanted to open up a discussion and see if this a reoccurring theme for everyone playing survs
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Thats not true. like i said before 8 out of 10 twins do this. the others play the twins differently and do not camp and tunnel yet still win. there are other ways to play as twins but the twins promote the camp/tunnel strategy.
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100% but don't expect any changes to fix this.
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Camping is a strategy (the devs themselves said it) and definitely not toxic. If the killer wants to camp and tunnel, they are allowed to do so, since it is not against a rules. But most of the time they risk losing all the gens and finishing the trial with just one kill if survivors are smart.
Just as survivors are allowed to genrush, so too killers to hookrush. Neither is toxic, period.
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You cannot hook every survivors you downed with victor every time because it wastes too much time. You need make the most out of victor when you control him, otherwise it’s just too inefficient.
And people seems to find difficulties in differentiating between toxic behaviour and just gaining tactical advantage.
Toxic behaviour doesn’t give you any advantage other than being rude. Examples are T-bag, constant hitting survivors on hook, bleed out everyone, etc.
However, slugging tunnelling camping can sometimes win you the game. Survivors gen rush can win most of the game. These are not toxic. Sometimes it is the best choice depends on the match.
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Camping and slugging is their biggest strength. Neither are particularly fun for either side. I find camping and slugging extremely boring as killer, and just frustrating and boring as survivor.
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I made a comment about this earlier.
In short: the twins only real strength is map control.
If Victor is babysitting, wait till he de spawns.
If charley is babysitting, don't heal at hook after save.
You have to team up and hook save together, or sit on gens. Same camping counter as other killers.
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It does actually, part of the twins power requires splitting and having the ability to be able to guard a specific area or in other words, camping. I think it's fair as it is basically what you are supposed to do as The Twins and crushing victor forces the player to become Charlotte once again. There also is a sort of stunned period during the switching transaction.
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I'm sure that by some people's definition of "toxicity", they do. However, I'd like to note that this has been asked/said about every new killer release.
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Also
Victor can hit through lockers because devs too lazy to add the Victor blocking lockers mechanic that they already addressed.
All in all, this killer isn't even done, so try your best against them, or even better, try playing as the twins.
I lost about 25 games in a row before I got good.
Now I'm a beast.
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i read this just a little bit ago and i think i up voted. i think we as survivors just need to adjust and come up with a good combat to this new type of killer.
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It promotes camping and slugging, for sure. But I do not see it as toxic I see it as boring. The new killer promotes boring gameplay. Toxic gameplay is teaming, sandbagging and using exploits to win among other things not considered normal gameplay.
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Personally one of the things I've noticed as the twins is that I accidentally camp a lot. Like, I hook someone and then I'm like, 'I want to go use Victor to check gens' and so I leave behind Charlotte as soon as I can split from her and fairly people see her left behind and assume I did it on purpose. Like nah, I'm running around trying to surprise people as a baby.
But then I hit someone as Victor and I go back to Charlotte and turn around and see people healing next to me.
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thats what i thought. like its not intentional it is just something built in to the twins.
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Just let people experiment with the new killer... Maybe there is more tunneling/camping/slugging because people are trying to figure out how to use her powers while survivors are genrushing
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Yup, it really is. The other thing I do accidentally all the time is that when I down someone with Victor, I'll go and throw that person on the closest hook, but I'm distracted/busy with Charlotte and don't want to swap to Victor at that moment, so he's accidentally hook camping because I'm trying to kick generators with Pop.
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this just happened to me. this is more often than not with them. I in NO WAY play toxic, i dont even rock BT or DS i did NO t bagging. Just unwarranted toxicity.
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did a few rounds with the twins. yes they are strange and hard to get used to i get that, but it doesnt mean they have to be toxic. i think the twins do NOT promote toxic behavior now but rather ATTRACT toxic players
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The best way to counter the Twins is, scrap the idea of doing all 5 gens -- just hide in lockers and Urban Evasion around the map in a 45 minute game of hide & seek, because whoever gets found and downed against the Twins just kills themselves on hook or DC's. It's basically every man for himself or get camped.
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Thats what it seems like. I just want to have fun, its just not very fun when killers are toxic. but hey such is life. i just think now that the twins are here we will see a new breed of toxicity
its not fun for killers to get toxic survivors either.
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I just had yet ANOTHER slugging/camp round with face slaps and head nodding. i dont want to start doing this but i feel like until the "twin craze" is over im going to run DS tenacity unbreakable and soul guard. No one even attempts to save anymore and i spend the whole game on the ground. that or just D/C but i hate doing that because it ruins everyones game.
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I hate the twins. It does promote toxic behavior. Victor should have a longer cooldown, it's dumb how you kick him then hes back at it again in mere seconds.
Also even when downing an injured survivor, victor should be sent away on cooldown to prevent massive slugging. This is dumb I am hating this game right now.
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I think its frustrating for sure but i dont think ALL killers are at fault here, They are playing to WIN just like us. they will do whatever they need to do to win. im not upset about that, im upset that they pretty much spit in your face when you do go down or get hooked
I agree, Victor does need a larger cooldown time, i dont think he needs to be sent back though. I've bleed out on the floor the past 2 days of Twin Craze more than i ever have. Im sure we will see refinement eventually but until then we just gotta GIT GUD! XD
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i really would like to hear from killer mains and their perspective on it. Im not even too upset about the toxicity. i mean yeah it sucks but the main point of this post is do they promote toxicity. after getting a few perspectives on the topic i think they attract toxic players more than promote toxicity.
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They don't promote toxic behavior, toxic behavior is the only optimal way to play them to secure victory. As stationary Victor is punishable, he can be kicked, a survivor can be picked up with STBFL, and they can run away before Charlotte even gets there. Slugging and camping is really the only way to play them if you want to win as them.
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