Killers Crying
Comments
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But here's the thing old BNP, insta heals and vacuum pallets were QOL improvements. It took them years to nerf insta heals. Both sides complain but from what I've seen survivors complain the most because there's more of them. Every week there's a new discussion how undying and ruin have no counter play or how spirit is OP!!!. Meanwhile all killers just want a fair chance against certain perks like DS/UB. Or an equal chance against people with comms.
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I honestly miss when hooks could be sabotaged to 99%, but Sabotaging has been nerfed, too. Now it's kinda useless.
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Idk what the hell ur talking about. Virtually, every time I defended killers, a horde of survivors would just shut me down to include mods telling me not to insult survivors. But if I insult killers, ppl seem perfectly fine.
Even ppl who claim to be killer mains comes after me. And I'm not even a killer. I'm a survivor.
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- Vacuum pallets
They helped survivors who messed up on a chase and allowed them to prolong the chase even further. Good survivors would exploit this.
- Brand new part
Used to repair a gen inmediatly. 4 BNP = 4 Gens inmediatly done.
- Keys
IMO keys themselves aren't a problem, but the way the hatch spawn is. 3 survivors can steal a game from the killer just by having an item when they should be perfectly able to repair a single gen. Not very fair if you ask me.
- Instaheal
You literally answered yourself in your post.
Everything you mentioned is/was a broken feature, why should it be a problem if killers complain about it? I agree that both sides get unnecessary nerfs, but these were completely needed.
Now, let's talk about a swf with DS + Unbreakable + OoO + key...
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I don't act like that. I just proved your statement wrong.
And instead of other parts of this community I have adapted to the changes, but Nurse still suffers from bugs and her addonpass made most of her addons useless imo.
Billy is still playable, too. Doesn't change the fact, that his rework was in most parts a nerf.
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The difference is, the majority of things that get "nerfed" on the survivor side are actually balance fixes. Literally everything you mentioned qualifies. You can't call it a nerf. It's fixing a mistake.
Meanwhile, survivors on the other hand are demanding a nerf to Ruin/Undying - a perk combo that, if survivors would run the perks/items that counter it instead of insisting on running their busted meta, would actually be pretty garbage.
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No those were nerfs, I would only count vacuum pallets as a fix.
Also are you saying ruin/undying is not busted?
Not only do you have 5 security cameras around the map (sometimes you run by a totem that you didn't even know was there and it will make you shine bright red for 5 seconds lol) but if the other hex got broken it transfers to another totem, which can be very hard to find especially in indoor maps.
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Insta gens most certainly were a thing until like 2018. Brand New Part was an immediate gen completion. He complained BNP was nerfed, so yeah he defended them..
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No, they were fixes. Something that is actually broken and game breaking being fixed isn't a nerf, it's a fix. I'm not saying that kind of stuff doesn't and hasn't existed on the killer side. Prayer beads spirit? That was broken. ORIGINAL forever Freddy? Broken. Deathslingers lack of counterplay? Broken.
And yes, I am saying Ruin/Undying isn't busted. Strong? Yes, busted? No. Because I'm not a boosted survivor who replies on crutches, and therefore have no problem running the actual counters (perks, items/addons) that make ruin/undying disappear within the first minute of the game. Distortion exists. As does Off the Record if you want to go that route. The only thing broken is your inability to understand this instead of blaming perks.
The average survivor meta is far more powerful than ruin/undying, and has been around FAR longer, unchanged, than ruin/undying. The issue is, now that killers have something, survivors are just like "whaaaa my fun whaaaa my fun". When did you guys take killer fun into consideration when running your busted meta?
Spoiler: You didn't.
And thus the circle continues - only survivor crutches are deemed okay. Anything that helps the killer win though? OMG BUSTED HERUDURUDUR.
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Congrats. Escape rate is 25%, so when you play no one else escape. I know, all potatoes of course. Only killers are semi gods survs
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No, they were nerfs.
Calling something broken means it's op not ACTUALLY broken as in bugged, so no they weren't fixes. They nerfed those things into the ground.
I would only call the vacuum pallets a fix because it looked weird when you character teleports to the other side.
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I never complained that the changes were made. I simply stated that it happened and that survivor didn't ######### about it as much as killer mains would if a killer/add/offering on was to get nerfed. That was the whole point of the post. You scroll through the forums and 7/10 you'll see killer mains complaining about everything.
It has never been this easy to play killer and yet new killer mains just want things to keep getting easier and easier lol.
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I think this thread is for comedic purpose, then? There are a number of threads were survivors complain about
- "enter name here" killers they dont like
- camping
- tunneling
- noed
- ruin/undying
- queue times
- other survivors using self care
- hit validation
- bloodpoints per match
- map reworks
- cross play
- killers nodding while they are hooked
- killers complaining
I only listed complains i think are unwarrented, so i ignored complains i belive are legit, like dcing or hooksuiciding teammates.
Also, the reason surivors "######### less" about changes is that the game even after a lot of changes is still survivor sided. It might change the closer the balance comes to actually being balanced.
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No, they were fixes. There's no version of this where you're right.
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The ecape rate is higher than 25%. Additionally, escape rate means nothing witbout knowing the situation behind it. Was it a NOED 3k? Was it a 11 hook game with one through the Hatch? These are VASTLY different games, one where the Killer de-pips, one where he could double pip.
I am no Survivor god, even in my post I admitted as such. I really should be in Purple Ranks, but I understand that I'm not the greatest in chases. However, because I play Killer a lot, I know that even if we only get half a gen done per hook (conservative estimate) we will still win.
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I think DBD is in a pretty good place atm balance wise tbh.
The problem I see and what survivors cry a lot about even on high ranks is the "survivor rule book". Like for me if I play how I want to as killer without giving a damn about the survivor rulebook I win some and I lose some. Most of the complaints I get are just survivor groups that are like "I got tunneled or I got camped" . I think the game especially in higher ranks is in no state anymore where those rules should be a thing. U are scared of getting tunneled? run ds unbreakable; scared of being camped? run borrowed. Like when I play killer and find someone that plays stupid or makes a mistake he goes down. Doesn't matter if he's the last one that got unhooked. Or blocking someones path to the unhook is also camping for most survivors. Those are the only complaints I get as a killer tbh
I also think playing survivor is fine and I don't get a lot of killer complaints. Sometimes I can understand them though. I get some killers that complain about bodyblocking with borrowed or ds abuses which I can see why thats a problem. Like Borrowed was meant as an anti tunnel perk so why bodyblock for someone when the killer doesnt wanna tunnel you. I had a lot of games where someone blocked with borrowed and got hooked after that again just to go on a rant about how ######### tunneling is which leads back to the survivor rule book.
Honestly I dont think the perks are the real problem just how they are used and how people view the game. Both sides find ways to use those perks in a way the devs didnt think or didn't wanna think about which the other side finds annoying and complains aboiut sometimes. And the survivor rule book with "hook every survivor once or dont camp,stay at least 50 feet away from any hooked survivor; make sure the way to the hook is free" is so engraved in ppls minds; even though I think its way out of date; is the thing that leads to the most crying in DBD.
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I play both killer and survivor and there are things I agree with on both sides. I think there is a problem though that within the last yet almost everything that has been nerfed has to deal with killers. In that sense the game is becoming a little more survivor sided which with the game being asymmetrical with 4 survivors and 1 killer that should never be the case. However, I think people forget that after a massive amount of killer nerfs, they end up stopping and then survivors get nerfed into the ground next. I think that cycle of survivor nerfs is going to start with the keys. I also disagree with you saying that killers ######### more than survivors. The only thing I've been hearing killers cry about is Decisive Strike and maybe get some minor buffs to certain killers. Although I hear a parades worth of different complaints from survivor mains.
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Whatever makes you sleep at night.
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Killers complain because their only win is 4k. A survivor escaping while his teammates died will be a happy player. A killer 3k ing because a survivor escaped through hatch will say that hatch is unfair and start his ranting.
Give them an inch and they'll take a mile
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Sure, mindless complaining isn't great.
But saying it's fine just because many nerfs happened isn't something i agree to either.
Not related to the subject you presented, but if there's an issue making one side incredibly powerful, you can't just say that a lot of nerfs happened and therefore this is fine.
If some Killers get hit with 10 total small nerfs in the next patch, will that grant them a "New OP mechanic" pass for the patch after that?
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Do killers even need more buffs in general though? That's the problem. Considering the average red rank kill rate of almost 3, I feel like its very reasonable to say that survivors are worse off in teh game now. Sure there are still problems on killer's side which i think need to be adressed but when you start sayign stuff like killers arent strong enough and survivors are the power role when statistics say otherwise, you've got a situation where killer is becoming the once OP role survivor was.
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Killers are alone in game - so they come here to vent and be heard is all. It's a nice support hugging circle for those that need it.
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Most killers will accept a 3 man as a win, because it is. They accomplished more of their objective than survivors did.
As for "giving an inch, taking a mile"...clearly you have very little experience playing killer. Don't pose and act like you do, cause with that kind of attitude, you'd be lying. Straight up.
It's KILLERS who are expected to not run X build, not use X tactic, not do this, not do that, to make sure SURVIVORS have fun. Then survivors t-bag at the exit gate because they think they outplayed the killer, when in reality, the killer, to be nice, didn't slug everyone at 5 gens and tunnel someone out of the game, when they usually, EASILY, could have. THAT is giving an inch, and taking a mile, and more times than not, it's survivors taking the mile.
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Both sides have people who completely complain about everything whether it be minor or not both sides of had nerfs.
Can we please drop this stupid us vs them mentality and stop acting like whatever said you're part of his is some unsung victim that is constantly being targeted by behaviour.
Now I'm not saying behaviours balance decisions have been the best and they still got a lot of work ironing things out on both sides but I don't feel like we're the stage where anyone can really act like they're 100-percent the Victim
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Remember 2016 DBD? THAT'S why survivors are getting nerf after nerf after nerf. Survivors started as ######### gods, and are still too powerful. 3 gens can get done by the time the first chase is over, and this is EXCLUDING looping. Furthermore, Killer is 100x more stressful than survivor, so Killers tend to get more frustrated/stressed; Killers see alot more of the game than the average survivor, so they have alot more stimuli to have to suffer from; Killers kind of feel neglected in certain cases, such as our complaints about DS, Unbreakable, Dead Hard, etc.
Not to say Survivor is a breeze. Survivors definitely need some compensation, but the fact of the matter is that Killer players have alot more to ######### about (and rightfully so) the higher you get on the ladder than survivors. Lower rank survivors have as much to ######### about as (proper) red rank Killers.
Also, alot of the things that were nerfed into the ground on the survivor side should have never been a thing, like instaheals, ######### pallet vacuums, and old toolboxes.
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That last paragraph - is why I call them "fixes" and not "nerfs". To me, a nerf is something that was a bit too much, and was cut down to size. A fix, like literally everything that has been nerfed on the survivor side to data, are things that were completely broken, and were corrected.
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I can give you my dbd leaderboard and you will judge. Killers are never happy, they want 4k and a pip. Survivors are happy when they escape.
You can say no as many times as you like but its the truth.
Surely you and other users of this forum will be fine with 3k, but the community is not made by 4 players
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Moris weren´t nerfed they got rendered totally useless.
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Seriously ? When Killers get a rework it usually means they get nerfed (btw strong boy Freddy is about to get that kind of rework again)... if Survivors get nerfed it usually means they get buffed (The Key Nerf is actually making the key way stronger)
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So Killers cry,right? Ok lets do this
When the Game starts vs premade, imagine one spectator player telling the killer what are Survs doing and where are they the while Game.
"Stay near because David is behind that palet waiting to unhook nea" "Claudette is going to the hatch near that gen, go faster"
Unfair right? This is what survivors premade does every Game, they know where we are, what are we doing and they are telling the others.
Plus OP perks, Lanterns, keys, purple medkits..... Balanced AF Game.
But the problem is Killers crying :)
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Those stats are useless though.
High Ranks is full of bad players on both sides
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DBD balance goes like this:
Best SWF> Good SWF> Best Killers> Best Solos> Medium SWF> Good Killers> Medium Killers> Good Solos> Medium Solos> Bad SWF> Bad Killers> Bad Solos.
Killers "crying" is more often than not pretty justified, since the core chase mechanics are designed to make it as ez as possible for Survivors to avoid hits. E.G: 9/10 tiles require the Survivor to misplay in order to get hit, regardless of the Killers skill. Thankfully, the vast majority of Survivor players is very bad at the game, and these issues only ever become prominent when versing decent players.
Also, the tremendous difference in Killer powers contributes to that. Killers like Nurse and Spirit play a completely different game than Wraith or Trapper, since they have agency in the chase and flow of the game. They are the true test of skill for Survivors, since they force them out of their ez mode comfort zone. Imo, many complaints from Killers are rooted in the fact that all but less than a handful of Killers are literal trash in high skill brackets.
On a sidenote, survivor mains cry just as much if not more ever since the game became more balanced. Some complaints have merit, like how broken ruin+undyind can be if the Killer is good and the Survivors are bad, but other than that it´s all git gud issues. By design, the Survivors should always win if not facing a top 3 Killer with the bestperks and addons, but as I said, most of them just aren´t good and prefer to complain just as much as the Killers do instead of getting good.
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Let's be honest with ourselves: DBD has come a looooong way since its inception. It really is in a better spot than before, even if it's taken four years and still trying to balance. If they want to stick with a ranking system, however, that needs to get ironed out and watch 58.49% of these complaints melt away when similarly skilled players are matched together. That, though, will come down to what the players will want: fair matches and long queues, or quick queues and thrown in with the next killer available (I have seen my buddy at rank 20 with a brand new killer matched against two reds and two purples. Say what you will about ranks not mattering, that's plain ridiculous).
It's tough playing killer, especially against SWFs and their 5th perk: Comms. Comms gives a significant advantage, there's no way around that or what you say; they just do. The devs didn't include in-game comms for two reasons, 1) for a more immersive experience and 2) the advantage it gives survivors. Obviously, there's nothing they can do about it in a world with Discord, and it's understood there are likely more SWFs in comms having fun rather than trying to be SWF Team 6, but it is still a massive advantage. On top of that, most often it's survivor mistakes that get them caught and killed and not the killer outplaying them. Well enough, that's what it takes for a killer to catch a survivor.
Saying you see more killers complain than survivors is likely confirmation bias and not what is actually happening, especially in post-game chat. After a couple thousand hours, 98% of sour or toxic messages, for me, come from survivors and their Survivor's Handbook for Killers (there isn't a Killer's Handbook for Survivors, now, is there?)
Also, toolboxes were in sore need of nerfing. Being able to greatly speed up your repair for two gens with one box was insane. Moris haven't been whined about all that much, it's not a bad change. Rather, most experienced killers agree with it. The complaint here is that keys weren't also worked, which they could use. For an idea: Have them take 3-5 seconds to open the hatch, increase the required gen-to-be-completed by one. Do you think there'd really be much backlash with that? I honestly don't.
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There's more killers complaining because the forums are mostly filled with killer mains. Survivor mains are the least common type of player on here.
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Fact is that we didn't need any of those things as survivors and can still loop killers for 5 gens. I feel for the killers, the 1v1 right now can demoralize inexperienced killers.
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Did you even read what you wrote? lol. You're telling me waiting 16 seconds after using a syringe is NOT a nerf from when it was instant? I have no idea where you're going with this "Fixed" thing. They are clearly nerfs and as I said the only fix was the vacuum pallets.
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Yeah sure, only killers are told not to run X build and all, because there aren't a million posts on here complaining about survivor meta builds and using DS + Unbreakable, deadhard, Borrowed time and the list goes on.
God forbid a survivor tries to adapt, counter or outplay a killer in any way because it automatically becomes OP.
As someone else said a lot of killers want a 4k and a pip that's the only way they believe that they've won. But if killers get easy 4k everytime what does that leave for the survivor? You just going into a match you know you're gonna lose so what is the point?
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Its a few days from 2021 and we're still explaining how old BNP and Insta heals were far from balanced? I think most people agree with a lot of the basic changes that killers want. Sorry but I don't think you should be able to communicate with your entire team exactly where the killer is at all times by only using 1 out of the 16 perks your team can bring.
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You need to call down. You know who you are, you're the ones getting mad at me right now for telling you to calm down.
But you do.
This is a game, and those I am speaking to are getting way, way, way to upset. I do not care how many thousands of hours you've played, that doesn't impress me. It just proves my point.
There is nothing wrong with liking and loving a game, but you are getting far to emotionally attached. I know you are going to argue that you are all calm cool and collected, but you know you're not.
I'm not saying this to "beat" you. I'm saying this because I'm worried.
I'm not saying this to insult the ones I am referencing. If I wanted I would directly point you all out. I'm not. I'm legit worried. You should not get this worked up over a game. It's a game. Stop, breath, let it go. Please.
I am not going to respond to replies. I am not here to argue. I am not here to fight. I want you to please, please take a second and let it go.
Please.
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"using DS + Unbreakable, deadhard"
"outplay a killer in any way"
Oof.
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And yet the post-game chat salt is almost always Survivor. Like these psychos will literally leave your PlayStation messages with audio of death threats.
When was the last time you saw a video on Youtube that was just a compilation of Killer salt in end game chat? How many of them are there? Compared to the ocean of Survivor tears?
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Here we go again. Doesn't anyone have anything new to talk about?
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remember when survivors threatened to review bomb the game until killers they didnt like playing against got nerfed? and then review bombing the game after almost every buff to killer back in 2016 and dodging any lobby with a nurse or spirit?. i do, i remember.
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arent the forums supposed to be made up of 10% or less of the entire game population?
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to be fair a 4k doesnt matter, but if you play very well in a match you deserve to get merciless killer and 2 pip. this wont always require a 4k so kills dont matter too much its just the emblem system gets a bit shaky in red rank. in my opinion 4k doesnt matter but getting a 2 pip after playing well does, which sometimes doesnt happen because of people getting 2 hooked or the last survivor who got hatch only got hooked once, issue isnt the 4k but they kinda push you to it to make sure you get your points
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Why do pips matter? They're literally USELESS you get absolutely nothing for pipping. I still don't get why people even care about ranks it's not like you get a reward at the end of a season... NOTHING.
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Yes, outplay the killer in ANY way. Whether it's a perk or just juking. Killers will get upset because they believe that they should be OP cause it's a 4v1 game.
If the killer was even stronger there would be no hope for survivors escaping or doing well during the match for that matter. As a sruvivor you literally have NO way you fighting a killer besides pallets. Both sides have broken perks, if people complain about survivor perks there's many other killer perks that are just as annoying.
If you let someone run you around the entire game you just got outplayed and it was your fault for not switching to someone else. As I said earlier it has never been easier to play killer. Infinites are pretty much gone, double pallets are gone, maps with deadzones.
Answer this:
If you are the survivor and got into a chase, would you just run in a straight line and drop a pallet right away and waste it? OR Loop the killer because that's really the only thing you CAN do to buy your teammates time?
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Pretty sure Killers get upset because there's still unbelievably stupid things still in the game. You can't lie to me and tell me there's more problematic killers perks that are on the level of the problematic survivor perks. OoO is only one perk out of the 16 the survivors have yet if someone brings it then your entire team knows exactly where the killer is, what they're doing, and when a stealth killer is going into stealth. All that for no real down side or cost.
Answer: I'd loop and use my actual game experience to OUT PLAY the killer. Since I'm experienced enough, I dont use exhaustion perks to hold my hand in chases because it feels like a cheated win. It hardly takes skill to realize you wont make it to a pallet and just press E for a free escape.
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Right, sure. It's not like you can see OoO survivor every time they look at you and come after him. Sure, bud.
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Killers aren’t balanced to be honest. They run faster than the survivors, have abilities that allow them to minimize their terror radius, not to mention some can even 1 hit down survivors which is t fair either. The Killers are the ones who need a nerf.
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