How do I play against Spirit?
Hi all!
I am a returning player with 470h in the game. I've been playing the game on and off since it's release and recently started yet again. I was a killer main for a long time and have started actively playing survivor around 380h into the game. I have watched guides, read through forum posts and gained enough knowledge of the game to consistently make it to purple ranks.
But now to the main question I would like to ask:
Wtf am I supposed to do against a decent Spirit?
In low ranks she was always manageable, as basically everyone messed up her power or just couldn't chase that well in general. Now it couldn't be further from that. Every single spirit I face seems to exactly know where I am, what I am doing and it feels like there is nothing I can do as a casual player.
If I try to camp a pallet, she approaches from behind or can hit me through it before I can react. If I try to loop, I end up running in circles by myself with no clue where she is supposed to be. If I hide, she can easily hear my moans or just follow my blood should I decide to take iron will.
Over the games I have played while stuck in ranks 8-6 most of them felt fair, as in I had a chance to escape or make it far into the game if I played well and was playing with other survivors on my skill level. Sadly I cannot say that about games against spirits. The majority of games against her are extremely frustrating as I don't see any way to do gens and not get caught in 20 second long chases. The only way I managed escape or survive more than 5 minutes is hiding in a corner doing nothing and basically waiting for the other 3 survivors to die and escape by hatch.
This also doesn't seem to be only me as basically all survivors in my games that get found are downed in incredibly short time spans and suicide or disconnect way more often than in any other matchups.
If anyone has reliable advice against her I'd appreciate it very much! I don't want to be the survivor that quits on sight of a killer he doesn't like but by now playing against spirit is just a waste of time for me...
TL;DR: I am a bad player that can't manage to play againt Spirit, wanted to rant a bit, and need advice
Comments
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Throw down the pallet and let the spirit mindgame herself. I've stood completely still, already accepting my imminent death, and watched a spirit mindgame herself for a good 30 seconds.
She would phase walk, I'd stand still, then she'd still be on the other side of the pallet lol
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Unless you have Iron Will, there is nothing you can do.
She's one of those killers where you just pray the person playing the Spirit, makes a mistake or is inexperienced.
So yeah, in a nutshell, there's nothing you can do, you're helpless =)
Enjoy!
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Use iron will, that's the only thing you can do against her. Even then she can hear your breathing, hear the grass move, see the grass move, hear footsteps, hear you vault things, see scratchmarks...
If she's running stridor your iron will doesn't even matter anymore, just try and hold W as much as possible and prolong your down so your teammates can do gens. You can't counter a decent spirit in a chase so hide and do gens.
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The hard truth about the spirit:
Every possible mindgame you might pull off is a 50/50 at absolut best, and when she runs stridor or has good headset, its not even that. For example you can fastvault a window and then slowvault it back, but a good spirit will hear that or at least will take it into consideration.
Use Iron Will and Spine Chill so she can not hear you that good and you know when she is looking at you.
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First off, know that this game at the end of the day is skill vs. skill. If you fight a player(s) better than you, you will likely lose.
A good spirit can to some extent be defeated mainly using the perk Iron Will. This gives you some leeway fighting them when they spirit walk, so you try to juke them or gain distance while they spirit walk. It's still up in the air and not a guarantee, a spirit player who is better than you can figure out what you're doing and trying to mindgame more often than not. It becomes a mindgame and a coin flip really but experience will make the difference. Still, Iron Will gives you a fighting chance, which is why many Spirits pack Stridor.
There are a few other perks you can use to give you an adavantage. The first is Quick and Quiet, which really works wonders against Spirit. If you combine this with Lithe, and Dance with Me, you can really evade spirit once you get a vault. It's also a good build that works against many other killers, so you can try that.
Iron Will, Q&Q, Lithe and Dance With Me.
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You can't, it's as simple as that. A decent spirit with a headset and/or stridor will most likely wil every interaction you have with her.
Your best bet is to never be found, but considering how she sees you moving grass/corn (without moving it herself) and you have no idea where she's approaching from at mach 5, good luck with that one too.
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There's quite a bit you can do, contrary to popular belief. Most people haven't put in the time.
She has a specific tell in her animation when she begins to phase. Her left arm snaps up to her chest. It's the only time her left arm does that specific motion. It's not the shards. It's her left arm.
Iron Will won't do much of anything against a really high level Spirit. They'll hear your breathing regardless through headphones and an equalizer.
Crouching reduces your regular breathing sounds by half. When you hear the phase sound, you can stop moving and crouch. Just make sure you aren't crouching right where your scratch marks end.
Watch your step around grass or corn. Don't give her easy phases.
You can bait her into committing to one side of a pallet or window when injured when you understand the timing and proximity relative her phasing audio. It gets louder as she gets closer. It's less of a 50/50 if you wait on one side of the pallet/window making all the noise in the world and at the last split second drop it/vault from the other side. This takes practice and repetition to get the timing down.
Overall: make distance>be patient until you're confident she's phasing>burn as much of her phase as you can then force her to commit on a 50/50. That's why making distance initially is key. She's more likely to be wrong when she has to make decisions in a time crunch towards the end of her phase. Don't let the Spirit sit there and listen closely through an entire phase from 6 meters away. And we know how to prevent that because of the arm motion.
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If they have any kind of headphones, you lose.
Basic Courtesan build for spirit involves Stridor, which counters the only perk that makes her somewhat bearable, iron will.
Spirit is fundamentaly broken and unbalanced mess of a killer, pray she is a bad and deaf player.
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hide as much as possible. Make the most stupid unpredictable plays you can imagine, predictment and sound is everything for Spirit. Dont camp pallets it's often useless as you already said about getting hit from behind. Slow vault windows, go inside lockers, Predrop pallets in front of you.
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You simply hope you are making lucky guesses in chase. That's about it really.
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Avoid chases, even a rather mediocre spirit will always win in a chase.
Don't enjoy stealting and evading? Well that's just too bad because the other option is getting hooked (and most likely tunneled)
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Honestly, the truth is that Spirit is one where you either have to pray that she's bad, or you just need to learn how to stealth (which is honestly super important and pretty underrated in the Survivor arsenal.)
I know a lot of people say to run Iron Will, but most Spirits run Stridor since it completely counters the perk. I would actually suggest running Spine Chill, since it can give you benefits in games outside of Spirit (by increased vault/action speed when the killer is looking at you) and allows you to get an early warning on wandering away from gens against killers like Nurse and Spirit when they're looking for their next chase.
Pretty much the strat I use is if I know someone just got hooked/isn't in chase, and Spine Chill lights up, I start walking away from the gen. Always walk, don't run. Slip your way over to the next tile or to a random spot you can sit in, and watch as they wander around in confusion, wasting time in looking for you. Then once they leave, go back to the gen and keep at it.
TLDR: Best counter to Spirit is stealth and gen rush. Just like Slinger.
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If the Spirit is competent, you lose. Her power assures that if she missed you, it was due to her own mistakes and your actions have little relevancy to the outcome. A good Spirit will phase and track you with Stridor along with other clues such as breathing, footsteps (especially in the swamps), bloodstains if they have proper addons, etc. If she has any kind of doubt of your position, she can just cancel the phasing and recover her power to start a new hunt. Knowing when the phasing started is just the first part of the problem, the second (and bigger IMO) is her position during it. Right now the only clues you have are her footsteps and unlike Good Spirit players that make use of Headphones + Equalizers, they're quite hard to identify. Until the devs introduce a real counterplay, she will remain one of the most unfun killers to play against.
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Detection is easy enough; you can hear a woosh sound when she phases by you. If you're at a gen or a predictable place near her, you should always scram.
Spirit's main gimmick is ridiculous mindgames. However, it leaves her equally prone to mindgames. A spirit will base its actions on a few things; 1) scratch marks, 2) noted behavior patterns of survivors (if they camp pallets, if they hide in lockers, if they turn to the right at short loops), 3) breathing. Rarely will you have to worry about father's glasses tracing blood marks, but you should always be aware of that possibility.
So, the main counter is to play unpredictably, but not predictably unpredictably. Be erratic and never display the same patterns, unless you're going to exploit her memory to mind game later on. However, it's all ultimately a huge 50/50. There's really no safe counter to spirit other than guesswork and divine intervention.
Other things include never approaching her "husk," which is commonly just her standing still. Run iron will to prevent her from tracking you by groans of pain, move erratically or even backtrack to render scratch marks confusingly useless, and don't be afraid to run. You can run a little and stop to walk away, among other things.
Avoid grass, since good players can see it rustling. If you have enough time, you can fast vault a window and slow vault back.
But alas, none of these are surefire ways to throw her off. I think the devs meant to make it so that it was a genuine 50/50 between being right on the survivor or being misled away, but ultimately, even if you can't get true precision, you're always going to know where generally the survivor is, at which she can just smack you in her normal form. This is precisely why people aren't fond of playing against spirits; too much guesswork, which is usually in vain anyways.
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Spireh is a KNOWER.
You need to ascend beyond KNOWER...
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Simple: play against a bad Spirit.
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Spirit is... tricky. She's very not transparent to survivors, so a lot is guessing which can obviously lead to you dying.
Now, some perks can help give you an edge. Iron Will will silence you when injured, and if she has Stridor, you're at least muffled (and nearly inaudible if crouching). If you have Spine Chill, you'll always know if she's looking at you, even if phasing.
But let's say you don't have these. If you see a Spirit suddenly stand still as you're running away, try dashing towards a building or tree or ANYTHING to break LoS in case she's tricking you. If she still hasn't moved, walk or double back because by then, she's going to be on your tail.
If you're at a tile, one trick is to drop a pallet and then just hold W away, maybe with some double backs or weird movements thrown in. Remember, before she can use her ears to track you down, she has to rely on scratch marks and visual cues (ex: grass moving) so be on constant alert of what you're doing and where you're going.
I need to make this clear: While I don't dislike Spirit, even I can admit that the sheer lack of transparency is pretty ridiculous. Because of it, nothing I or anyone else can tell you is 100% a good counter. What I've done is given you some common jukes to help fool her, but in the end, if she sees it coming, you're boned.
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Good spirit and good nurse - accept your death)
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I like to run Fixated and Diversion with Iron Will, that new Elodie perk Deception works pretty well too. Fixated allows you too see what scratch marks she can track and you can manipulate them to mess with her. With Diversion, you can wait until you hear her phase and then throw your pebble and quickly walk away with Fixated to a safer hiding spot.
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Spirit is a slow killer who can only make up distance while using her power. So as a spirit player you have a choice , do you use your ability to make up ground or at a loop. Most spirit's would prefer to save it for a loop. So this is how you can consistently do well vs spirit.
HOLD W. Now what I mean by this is that you need to start running from a spirit early and try to force her to use her ability to make distance, if she does she won't be able to use her ability at a loop (for a bit).
If you can accomplish this then you've got about 10 seconds of going around a loop while the spirit is a 110 percent speed killer. Now after those 10 seconds , she is going to want to get a hit at the loop, so she's going to stand still.
A spirit killer will rarely use the ability right away. They'll wait to see how you react to her standing still. It takes roughly 2 seconds once she really does use her ability before she starts moving. So, you've got about 3-10 seconds of her faking and then 2 seconds + time for her to get to your destination (which can vary depending on add-ons). So, You want to stand still for 3 seconds, start walking after 3 seconds for about 2 seconds and then start running.
At this point your goal is to get to another tile and to make distance.
Try to break line of sight and do not go towards the husk. Assume that the husk is just her faking it , even if you believe that she is phasing.
And pay attention to the sound of footsteps, sometimes you can hear her footsteps and if you do you can vault the pallet into her because at that point she is 100 percent phasing.
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If you are healthy: Mindgame as hard as you can, dance with her, vault a pallet/window and then slow vault it. Basically try to be as unpredictable as possible.
If you are injured with Iron Will: If she does not have Stridor, repeat same steps as above
If you are injured without Iron Will: Pray it's not a good spirit. May the entity help you, for no one else can.
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You have to play Spirit to learn how to play against her. There are specific mindgames and predictions that you have to know in order to fake her out correctly
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Even iron will is useless since most run stridor lol
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You flip a coin basically. There is a 50/50 chance you make the right move.
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I love when people say that you have to "adapt", "git gud", "learn to outplay". But in reality, you can't do anything unless you do something stupidly unpredictible, then you will maybe have a chance to survive till her ability recharges again or when she will focking passive phase and cut your loop short, because you were not able to see her for 0.5 seconds.
Or just don't have an Iron Will and you will be downed on her first ability use.
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the only way you play against them is they make mistakes, "mind games" are still just their mistakes they have one of the easiest downs in a 1v1 scenario vs you as a survivor, and if they are running certain iri addon that highlights blood or have a good headset. Nothing can save you
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There is only one outcome.
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It's actually interesting how nearly everyone on even the forums thinks there's problems with spirit. Yet for some reason the devs don't seem to have any plans in changing her, even Freddy and ds have planned changes.
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Alt + F4
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You have to play against her differently than other killers. Against other killers you are reacting to what the killer does. If you do that against Spirit you will be one of the people in here complaining she has no counter play. It's because you put yourself in that situation.
Against Spirit you have to make her react to you. So the complete opposite of other killers. Don't force yourself to read her, force her to make a read on you.
One example: She's chasing you across the field towards a jungle gym. You see her stop half way across the field so you know she's phasing towards you. Now you force her to make a guess. Fast vault the window and then slow vault back over after a couple seconds. All she saw was scratch marks to the window and she heard a fast vault over it. She now has to decide if you went over or faked back over. Most survivors don't know what to do against Spirit and will just keep going, so most likely she is going to go straight around to appear and now see you on the opposite side of the window.
You just wasted 10+ seconds of hers in chase and now her powers on cooldown where she shouldn't be hitting you without it with how slow she is for another 10+ seconds. That's 20+ seconds x3 for your other teammates, IE 60 seconds or almost an entire gen you just gave your team and she hasn't even got one hit yet. She needs two to even get a down. Time is not on her side and even those numbers are being conservative. If you're decent they can be much higher. Almost 20% of your teams objective completed from that scenario for 0% of hers.
That is how you outplay Spirit. Force her to make the read, not you. It's the complete opposite of all other killers.
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If you are not on a SWAT 4 man team, you don't. You struggle and get out.
She's similar to Freddy and several others, they are a free win. Too oppressive and unfun to verse.
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Her sound bug was too good to be true. I hoped they at least kept that for as long as they kept the hill of death.
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Flip a coin. Call it before it lands. If you guessed right, you might "mindgame" her. If not, she "mindgames" you.
Seriously though, if you can somehow watch the Spirit play, you might see trends in their playstyle, and can use that against them. However, that suggests you can sit there and study the Killer while they murderface your team, which is obviously not a viable option most of the time. Still, you might notice that say, at a pallet, the Spirit player always shifts and gets behind it. This can let you predict their actions at the next pallet. However, most Spirit players mix up how they approach pallets and loops, making it much harder to find any kind of pattern you can use.
A vocal minority of players like to insist that Spirit is fine and has counterplay. She's not fine, and she barely has counterplay. Calling a coin flip is random luck, with tons of math behind it to say "it's not technically random". Spirit is the same. It's technically NOT random, and playing against her has theory behind it, but you would need an absolute galaxy brain and knowledge of the players history from the moment they were born to the moment you play against them to absolutely know what they are going to do when you can't see them. She offers very little reactionary gameplay, and all you can do when you think she is phasing is breakdance like a maniac to throw her off when she pops out for scary "boo" time.
Furthermore, a vocal minority insists she has some kind of tiny visual cue to let you know when she is phasing. If there is ANYTHING, which I would honestly say there mostly isn't, the little she DOES have is so minor it's almost inconsequential. A tiny little glow on her shards, a twitch in her arm, her nose hairs get slightly longer, whatever. They are so minor and hard to really spot during a real chase that they don't matter. Compare that to every other Killer in the game that very openly broadcast what they are doing. ONE OF THESE THINGS IS NOT LIKE THE OTHERS. She DOES have an audio cue... if you're nowhere near her. It feels pretty backwards.
She's a rather simple Killer to play that offers the Survivor team very little counterplay. What little counterplay there is gets boiled down to "luck" really fast.
Oh, ya, you can stealth around her too. It works sometimes. Enjoy that.
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