Why not buff Open Handed?
Every survivor perk buff was kept in the PTB, why Open Handed wasn't? Did BHVR forgot it or they tought it was too strong to keep? Kinda sad, was really hyped to finally use this perk in a meaningful way.
Discovered, idk why not push in this patch.
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Maybe an oversight?
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Maybe but it was cut from the patch notes as well; and it was one of the major things they talked about so I doubt it was an accident.
Tbh I have a theory as to why; but I don't want to end up having someone trying to start an argument with me over speculation.
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Dang, I was looking forward to using this perk buffed.
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Haha, now I am curious what your theory is.
There could be some weird aura interaction that they didn't foresee, or something.
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I feel like they are afraid of it being too strong. Solos would not use 2 meta perks to have something SWF have for free. Bhvr sometimes is something else...
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It really isn't "too strong." It's good but it's far from broken. Broken is Kindred + 4 Open Handed. Which is what his buff is supposed to fix.
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I think it was kindred; in all honesty. A lot of people started pointing this out since it was announced; and I think they might have realized the problem with it since then. That or it was working with maps/keys in some problematic way.
The thing with Kindred is that say you are Trapper, sure with kindred you can't trap too close to the hook, no problem.
However still after hooking that is the best time to put down a trap, and the suggested open handed buff is a much larger radius I think then people realize. So now you can't even put a trap down anywhere near any of the loops near where that hook is or EVERY survivor will know regardless of SWF.
On top of that; even if they don't have that; it's now a serious problem you have to think about with every killer that doesn't necessarily camp but can benefit from the hook at all. Say a myers suddenly can't stalk even from fairly far away; or on smaller maps or ones with multiple levels the killer's aura is just going to be going off from very far away to everyone for free.
A trapper not being able to put any traps basically anywhere in like 60% of his actual main trap zone, or hag or whoever; is a big deal- especially given you don't know if they have it or not.
So my theory is they are thinking about if the range buff is fine as is, if it should deactivate on hook or reduce on hook, or what they should do with it. I imagine buffs are still planned and will happen in the next update just the same, but it won't be the same as what they mentioned before.
(That or I am way wrong and it was just some game breaking bug haha, but I really think this with kindred might be too strong in some situations; and those situations being where the game doesn't actually need them right now)
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People already do that in the current build by stacking Open Handed and then using Kindred.
This was supposed to fix that problem because 4 Open Handed + Kindred was really ridiculous.
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I thought the current open handed we have now can only be stacked twice?
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Yeah but now one person with it alone is 32 meters.
I get that is what they were going for; but I think they are realizing the implications of that.
Also given that you don't even need to have those perks, if they are popular enough you now just have to assume they exist like every game, unlike a 4 man stacking 4 open handed which is rare- this would be just one man giving everyone a 32 meter aura read on the killer.
That would also be his terror radius so that information would be further meta-ized so you know exactly when your teammates can see that aura as well.
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No, it can be stacked 4 times.
Right now I already give everyone a 24 meter aura read when I'm hooked. 32 meter is better but that's only while I'm hooked. That is just two times per match maximum. It's good but not broken.
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They did buff it, apparently. They just didn't bother to change the description or put it in the patch notes. At least, that's what I've been told.
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No, only for Kindred does that limit apply. Kindred cant be surpassed 24m
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I'm positive they didn't
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Never heard about it, where sid you saw this information?
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Unfortunate. It was one of the only things I was looking forward to in this update.
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I know that a 32 meter is scary, but it's a single person that will have this information (unless I'm in the hook), if everyone is using this (so everyone have the killer aura revealed), then it's good for the ######### killer because now this survivor have 2 less meta perk.
BuT sWf?¿?
OoO is way stronger in swf.
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That's what I don't understand. For solo, this buff would have been great but it wouldn't have done anything for SWF because of comms and potentially OoO.
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Can you PM me? I’m curious about your theory.
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Depends on the map really, for a map like Midwich 32m is basically a quarter of the map and that's gonna seriously suck.
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That is interesting, and a pretty good point. Here's what their rationale for the buff is:
"Open Handed makes for some interesting builds, but the low values meant that you needed to convince other Survivors to stack it to see any noticeable results. To make this a more appealing choice, we’ll be increasing the aura reading range bonus to 8/12/16m, but limiting you to the effects of one Open Handed at a time to prevent it from getting out of hand."
The current (live game) tier 3 Open Handed value is 8 meters, and it stacks. So, you would be able to achieve what they are proposing here with two players running Open Handed. As-is, if two or more people stack the perk, it would be insane, as you have thoroughly pointed out. So it seems like maybe they feel that 8 meters is too little, but they have now concluded that 16+ meters is too much. For various aura perks, it would result in:
- Bond: 44 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 52 meters in the proposed rework.
- Kindred: 24 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 32 meters in the proposed rework.
- Detective's Hunch: 72 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 80 meters in the proposed rework.
- Windows of Opportunity: 28 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 36 meters in the proposed rework.
- Plunderer's Instinct: 40 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 48 meters in the proposed rework.
- Better Together: 40 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 48 meters in the proposed rework.
- Left Behind: 40 meters (+8 per additional OH stack) in the live game, and 48 meters in the proposed rework.
If I had a FIFTY-TWO METER BOND IN EVERY MATCH, along with all the Kindred shenanigans you have described (I run both of these perks), that would be nuts.
Maybe they'll split the difference and go 8/10/12 or something. That would still be really significant.
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But Kindred has a hard cap of 24m already. This in effect now. 4 players can stack Open Handed, and Kindred will only read the killers aura within 24m of the hook.
Is the suggestion here that Kindred is currently bugged? That the hard cap is being over ridden?
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You’ve also left out OoO. It’s currently possible for a SWF to have 104m OoO.
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I honestly don't see how that would be in any way overpowered or anything. I've run Kindred/Bond/Open Handed with a friend, it's not some crazy autowin hahaha baby noob killer combo, it's a fun meme that replaces callouts. For all of that info, remarkably little is useful, and even then it requires you to be a good player.
I guess what I'm saying is I would rather this than, say, any actual meta build. Like, by a lot. A lot a lot. Please may the Devs buff Open Handed so people run aura builds instead of second chances, chase builds, healing builds, stealth builds, gen rush builds or... Yeah, no, maybe even chest builds, what with the sheer number of keys and medkits I've been handing out like candy recently.
Edit: I should clarify, most of the time I run aura build in solo que, I was just pointing out that I've ran them with a 16m buff before
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Are you sure? Where are you getting this hard cap information from? The DBD wiki page on Open Handed specifically states that Kindred has a max range of 48 meters when using 4 copies of OH: https://deadbydaylight.fandom.com/wiki/Open-Handed
(Oh, and yeah, I forgot about OoO. Ridiculous ranges on that, too.)
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I dunno, I've always found information perks very useful, solo and in duos (which is how I usually play survivor). My usual go-to build is Lithe, Bond, Kindred, and Spine Chill (though I am currently trying to wean myself off of that one). I have consistently made it to red ranks with that build. I don't think you have to run a bunch of meta perks in order to perform well, if you have good game sense.
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You can already have 60 METER SURVIVOR AURA READING with just a key while also running a whole set of 4 meta-perks, and you think 52m bond by sacrificing a slot for a buff (that very likely only applies to you) is strong?
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Yes, I think aura-reading is strong.
I also don't like putting items and add-ons on the same pedestal, because it's not like you are going to have infinite quantities of that specific combination. And the key's abilities are activated, not constant.
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They probably have issues with it now breaking kindred's aura limit.
It used to be that it simply did not stack. But now openhanded by base would be greater then kindreds 24m limit so they have to completly rewrite that code
That's my reasoning anyway
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Exactly. So why not 16m open handed?
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They probably realised it's too OP and would increase queue times for survivors by even more than its at now, slowly making the game less and less fun for killers
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As pointed out earlier, the 24m limit doesn't exist so this change would not exactly buff the kindred combo.
It could be related to how open handed interacts with knockout but both knockout and open handed are quite rare perks to see
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I agree! I am not siding with whatever rationale led Behaviour to omit the Open Handed buff from the PTB, I'm just trying to walk through what they might have been thinking. I do think it would be very strong to contain 16 meters of perk signal-boosting in one slot, but that would be OK to me!
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The devs have repeatedly said on these forums, and on streams where Kindred is the one exception to Open Handed stacking. Kindred has a hard cap of 24m. You can test this now by doing a custom game and stacking open handed with kindred. Only one open handed will apply.
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Did they remove the hardcap with the buff/nerf to open? Seems fairer to allow it to impact all now.
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No. 32m range on Kindred would be pretty broken.
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CAN'T be stacked anymore though. Which was the point of the limitation.
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