Sick of this killer sided game
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I think devs should release data. It won’t end the killer main tears and trolling anyone who disagrees, but will shed some light. Release the rate players survive . The rate they don’t. The perks used by the ones who survive the most. The maps. What killers score the most kill sweeps. Etcetera Certainly they are making informed decisions based on game data. No one gets all excited when they lose. Buy killer please! What defines losing not getting 20k, one person got away. You got bright burned 3x and couldn’t score a hook. Sometimes it’s not the games fault, or the other players fault. I really think they should release some rolling game metrics.
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They do. It helps very little because we do not know the context behind them.
For example, Nurse has a 40% kill rate. Looking at that, we would assume Nurse needs buffs, but common sense tells us that isn't true.
I will tell you that Decisive Strike is probably used in 90% of Red Rank games.
Based off the most recent stats, the Kill Rate is about 56% at all ranks and 68% at Red Ranks. This means that the Killer is getting 2 kills on average per game.
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Can you point to that data please. Hopefully not some 3rd party site claiming it’s accurate. Based on what you posted, looks pretty balanced. Average skews to the killer and less than half survive. Probably a lot of single survivor matches due to hatch and gate campers. But getting 2+ most of the time seems like skews towards killer. Bet the 4 man escapes are rare even if you throw in bot killers who throw the numbers off and probably far more common that keye hatch escapes.
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You know they might be right....who the hell knows.
That's why i would to see the stats so we know which side has the right to complain.
Currently i am just talking from my experience that it absolutely sucks to be in solo queue at red rank.
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It actually doesn't really show anything, like I said. Objectively weak Killers like Trapper and Myers are fairly high up on the list, while the strongest Killer, Nurse, is the lowest by FAR.
It is also worthy to note that the only Killer reaching 3 kills on average is Freddy, who is getting nerfed.
Here are your stats with zero context @Minaaa
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Another thread where the lack of skill of players is used as an argument for unbalance. Git gud or git gone.
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Chart above is across all ranks. Average is on the right side of the chart (56%).
Chart above is Red Ranks. Average 68%.
3 kills equals 75% since 1 survivor equals 25% in a match. Since Freddy has been averaging 75% / 3 kills for a year now he's going to get nerfed. At least I think that was the reasoning besides the fact he is way too easy to play effectively with nothing you have to actually "master" over a long period of time.
These stats were posted by Behaviour to celebrate DBD's anniversary.
EDIT: @Pulsar beat me to it. Oops.
Anyways also keep in mind kill rates do not necessarily correlate with the overall strength of a killer. Freddy is strong for sure but the reason he is at the top of the food chain is the fact he is strong AND easy to play.
That's why Nurse has the lowest kill rate despite being objectively the strongest killer in the game.
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lol
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Wow thanks so much for sharing this.
Looking at the stats i think this supports my view...at red rank 68% of killers get 2-3 kills.
That means one survivor got away using the hatch so pretty much a loss for a survivors in my opinion.
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If you think that supports your view, allow me to correct you.
How many Survivors are in a match? 4, right? 75% of 4 is 3. 68% means that the Killer is getting two people on average. Meaning Survivors finished all the gens and escaped through the Gates.
Also, like I've REPEATEDLY said, these stats mean NOTHING without context. A 4K with a Mori in play is different than a 4K with 12 hooks and 4 gens done.
The game is pretty close to being balanced. There are still some horribly Survivor-sided maps, but were mostly okay. There are still some problem perks *cough DS* but we are mostly good on that front too. Some Killer's, mainly Huntress, have some add-ons that need changed and there are still god loops that need removed.
That being said, if you took the best Survivors who made no mistakes and the best Killer who made no mistakes, most Killers on the roster would lose.
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I believe all killers besides nurse would lose.
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this entire thread fries my brain, how the F do you consider killers OP when you yourself state the reason survivors dont do well is because they are meming around and flat out refuse to do the one objective they have....
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Spirit and Freddy are also up there.
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I mean, survivors already have long queues.
I´m sure more killer nerfs will improve the situation...
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Of course but spirit and freddy can still lose. A perfect nurse? Yea not so much. Also it depends on perks. Ruin undying meta? Or the perks they come with?
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3 hook is a Kill
2 hook then stop struggling is a Kill
1 hook then suicide is a Kill
DC after 10sec chase is a Kill
The first Kill after 1min into the game ensure at least 3 Kill
The first Killer before 3 Gen done has super high chance to 3 Kill
The first Kill after almost 4 Gen done is a fair game.
Kill rate data is unreliable...
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I am talking meta on meta on a neutral map.
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68% is closer to 75.
If they were getting 2 kills on average the percentage would be closer to 50.
Why does it matter what circumstances caused the survivor to die???
In black and white it pretty much means that survivors on average will go into matches to die and killers will most of the time walk away with a 3k.
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It matters a lot.
Yesterday 2 survivors suicided on the first hook, despite of the fact, that only 2 gens were left. So they clearly could have won, but chose to suicide. This happens a LOT and artificially inflates the kill rates.
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I don't agree with the game being killer sided but I do agree with the point about solo q. Any good killer will beat pretty much every 4 man solo q squad they face. It is extremely easy.
I think you should rename this discussion to something more about solo q vs swf.
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You play survivor right?
You see survivors constantly dc/suicide for the stupidest #########?
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I dont think spirit and freddy can win 100% of their games.
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lol! This graph shows the exact opposite of what's actually going on in the game. Perhaps they got the percentage mixed up and instead of kill rates, they show the escape rates.
As a matter of fact:
- Nurse is one of the strongest Killer and especially in high rank, people know how to play her and usually get 3-4 kills.
- Higher skill makes matches harder for the Killer player, which is why in the process of ranking up, the average kills per match decreases over time due to stronger opponents.
This graph shows the exact opposite; Nurse is the worst Killer and in high rank, Killers get more kills than in low rank.
I have no idea how that can be explained other than "rigged stats".
Perhaps Nurse gets so many ragequitters that don't count for "Kills", is that why her kill rate is so low in high rank? Another meaningless, misleading graph provided by the devs that serves to purpose other than causing confusion and discussions.
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These kill rate stats are pointless for two reasons:
1) Matchmaking is busted. We don't know how many of these games are matches of players of equal skill, and we can't assume that spread of skill is the same because of queue times and inconsistent pipping system.
2) It includes hook suicides and we all know how often it happens. And if someone suicides on hook - the game will probably end with 4k. I'm pretty sure that Freddy and Spirit will lose a lot from their stats if we'll exclude games with hook suicides from the statistics.
So these charts tell us nothing about actual game balance.
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Even most Nurse will lose to top tier survivors I think.
I'm watching Exlelite right now. He's SWF-ing with Sawpalin and two others. They're 3-4 man escaping every match.
The only killer that got close to beating them was a Legacy-Nurse with almost 6000 hours and even she BARELY got a 2nd kill. The 2nd kill was caught IN FRONT OF THE OPEN GATE. That's how close it was for a Rank1 Infectious Fright Legacy Nurse (Needless to say the Nurse depipped after the match, too).
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Correct. That means that the Killer CAN get a 3K. It isn't super uncommon, but it isn't happening a lot either. The average is still two, since you can't kill half a Survivor.
Because a Mori off of first hook is a lot different then a kill during the EGC when that Survivor has been hooked twice already.
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I think they will have a shot against the top 1% Survivors if played well.
Super speed Spirit and Slowdown Freddy are VERY good.
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You might disagree but its not "the survivors" who lost in your hatch escape example.
- 1 survivor got the hatch and escaped. They mightve used a shortcut bit they reached the goal.
- The killer got 75% of their objectives, or less if you're a 12hook guy. Can pass as a win bit its not flawless.
- The sacrificed/dead/ dc'd people didnt reach their goal.
Emblems are another can of worms that'd might srill depip the killer pr pip the dead.
Looking at the hatch escape as a loss for (all) survivors doesnt happen as often as calling it a win. Atleast in my meager experience with swfs.
And honestly. Dbd lacks the emblem / bloodpoint score differentiation of grouped survivors and others.
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I notice this mindset a lot of times here in the forums.
People claim the game is unbalanced, Survivors or Killers are OP and when you go deeper into discussion with them, it turns out they're upset to get queued with bad Survivors that throw the match or as new Killer, they get matched against Rank 1 SWFs.
That is not an issue of game unbalanced but poor matchmaking. In 99,9999% of all cases, a player with 0 knowledge will lose to a player with 2000 hours. It has nothing to do with the games unbalanced state. Same if a Killer goes into a match as naked Clown against fully slotted SWFs, OBVIOUSLY the Killer is at a disadvantage but it was their own decision to play this way.
How can you expect to have an even match as naked clown against 4 fully slotted SWFs?
Balanced game doesn't mean no matter what / how you play, your chances of winning are always 50%. Balanced game means that both sides can increase or decrease their chances of winning equally by PREPARING FOR THE MATCH properly.
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Those stats don't show anything about pick rate or the rank of the players using her. The people that main and mastered her are in the digit percentage and the biggest part of the rest can't really play her resulting in a low kill percentage (red rank or not). Most don't want to play her since it takes several dozen to hundreds of hours to be truly effiz with her.
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Survivors recently got buffed, killers recently got a nerf to the META and buffs to weaker perks
Survivor meta has been the same for 4 years
Something is up here and I think its noticeable
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Game isn't killer sided at all, but it should be.
I want to feel the Lovecraftian hopelessness when playing as survivor. Make me pray for mercy during a match. That's how I want to feel like as a survivor in a "horror" game. There's a whole market that focuses on people who like games where the odds are greatly stacked against them (rogue-likes/lites, darkest dungeon, dark souls, ..). Dead by daylight should be the multiplayer equivalent of that type of game giving those players a lasting infinite formula satisfying that niche.
Right now, killer actually feels more often like a Lovecraftian hopeless experience than survivor which is absurd.
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Very much so. It isn't even close.
I play solo queue the majority of the time and I don't even run the plethora of second chance perks either. Even in solo queue survivor is still very much the power role.
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I think it's very important to clarify something, and please don't just jump at my throat :)
When people say this game is survivor sided, they say this when referring to a high level of play. What I mean by this is not red ranks, as from thousands of hours in this game I would guess that up to 80% of all red rank players (on both sides) would not be there in an ideal MMR system. I don't say this to be mean, I say this because this game has a steep learning curve (allow me to explain). I think that this learning curve is the main reason for the concept of a killer sided game, and it makes sense that this happens. I believe that killer is much easier at the lower levels of play, whereas survivor is more difficult (this is assuming you are actually trying to play optimally, not just being immersed. As you gain experience and climb the rankings, you get to a decent level of survivor. I would define this as someone who isn't scared of the killer, does gens almost always when they aren't getting chased, and have a decent concept of looping fundamentals. These kinds of players exist across all ranks, however the ranking system doesn't always favor this playstyle, as a mistake while looping can set you back.
Once you get to this level, and move up the learning curve to this point, I find that this is where the game becomes balanced to survivor sided. I can't just say one way or the other, as there are so many variables in play that each trial is different (perks, addons, swf/solo q). Before you reach this level, however, it's completely understandable that you would find the game killer sided. Killer is much easier to pick up, as simply following survivors and cutting them off as necessary will catch most survivors you face. When this is the low standard for playing killer, compared to the difficult learning curve for survivor, the game will obviously seem unbalanced for someone who hasn't reached as far up that curve yet.
Again, this is not an attack on anyone. I'm simply saying that survivor takes a much longer time to become a decent player compared to killer, which leads to it seeming like the game is killer-sided, when in reality its just that killer is easier to learn. I should clarify, I don't think killer is easier when both sides are good players, just in terms of learning the role.
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There are 9 meta perks for survivor and the last one was released with David King in 2017 (Dead Hard).
Speaking of bringing new good perks in.
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Go ahead with that line of tought. Survivors queues are absurdly long RN so imagine with more survivor sided decisions. Entlitlement is killing this game.
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Is this high-quality bait or just a rank 18 squealing?
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Found the rank 17 guys!
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The killer doesn't beat a team of solo queue survivors, the survivors beat themselves.
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The game already has tons of luck in it. There's an offering to increase it for god sakes. Getting out of trappers traps, kobeing off of hooks, getting your reverse bear trap off, hatch spawn, who will be the obsession, and overall map strength are all luck. But once killers get a good combo of perks thats when there is too much luck in the game
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What i glean from this is that MMR might solve all our problems (fingers crossed).
I do watch some DBD streamers who are clearly at that highest tier skill level wise...while they dominate in SWF as soon as they go solo their chances of surviving drops drastically. I don't know if MMR can resolve such a glaring disparity.
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Sounds like you are still in the newbie or haven't learn to play well phase. In the early skill levels it seems that killers are OP. In higher skill levels it is clear that survivors have the benefits.
Word of warning - it takes 1 killer to give 4 survivors a game. Lose 1 killer, 4 survivors have to wait in the queue longer. Lose 100 killers, 400 survivors have to wait longer....and so on. Since we have seen an increase in survivor queue times, what do you think is happening?
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Lets me point out if killer was so strong why in the hell are queues terrible for survivor. Nearly every other asymmetrical game has had the power role be abhorrently hard to obtain. Dbd games require 4 people for survivor and one killer yet its killer player base is non existent with 10 min long queue times.
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Can vouch, just did 4 gens, got undying + ruin for my team and they still all threw. Unhooking me right in front of leatherface? Really bro? Thanks for destroying your own team
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That's something you just pulled out of your arse. Seriously, how can you make such stupid stuff up without even a SINGLE piece of evidence to claim such statements but sell it as a fact?
And that statement that most don't want to play her because it takes forver to learn her, you realize that this statement alone contradicts your previous statement? If people don't want to play her (unless they know how to play) then ONLY those that mastered her are left.
So especially in high rank (which is shown in the graph) most players that play nurse actually mastered her because as you said, if they didn't master her, they won't bother playing her. The result? Those graphs actually show the performance of good nurse players.
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