The perfect SWF nerf
Opposite prove thyself, 15% penalty to repairing gens, cleansing speeds and healing for each teamates in the SWF lobby, doesn't affect solo Q's.
Doesn't everyone think this might be the perfect solution?
Go ahead discuss, I'll read it when I get the chance
Comments
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Get rid of object also. Getting sick of seeing it 50000 times in a row.
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I don't mind OOO, making it a different color so they can't hide behind gens and know our every move tho now that should be done too
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Let's not punish people for playing together, shall we?
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So 116s gens, 20.3s totems and, 23.2s healing for 4 man SWF. I barely SWF and I think that's insane. Killer isn't balanced around high times like this.
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Something i've heard from OhTofu is really interesting to me. He put out the notion that the problem with SWF isn't the communication, it's more the fact that you have 3 - 4 good teammates on one team. I obviously think the communication helps but I really do not think that you should be punished for playing with your friends especially if the players aren't even that good to begin with.
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Well it’s a indirect nerf to solo players. If 3 of them are swf and I am solo, I as a solo player have to extend all chases just to compensate a nerf that I didn’t receive but my “team” has. Stay injured even longer because of the action penalty to healing.
What if there’s 2 swf with another 2 swf in the same lobby? Both teams can’t communicate with each other but yet they all get an action penalty.
I don’t understand the obsession of nerfing swf groups for working together and being efficient. Why can’t you just give buffs to killers to be more efficient by giving them tools to end chases quicker and possibly to pressure gens?
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The SWF people are punishing the killer for playing because they(SWF) are going to outperform solo survivors. So it is always alright to punish the killer then? No wonder this game has a killer shortage with that attitude.
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I don't agree with the OP either but communication is more important the worse your teammates are. The better your teammates are the less important communication becomes, since veteran players are generally better at using the information the game provides although it still helps.
OhTofu is right that having 3-4 good teammates is more important and powerful than communication. However, communication can turn decent survivor players into good players and terrible survivors into something slightly useful (better than solo queue survivors). It's not good to just ignore that
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Yeah I agree for the most part. My opinion is that they should buff solo queue and then buff every killer accordingly. Something like having kindred base kit and other things like that.
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I know people on this forum hate SWF (Let's be clear, it's never going anywhere and the game today would die without it).
But you can't nerf SWF this way when many friends that play this game are not any good. Just because the small group of really good SWF have destroyed us at times... we can't HARD nerf.
If you did a 5% penalty to only those grouped up (which can be inconsistent and sloppy gsme design).. I'd say it is worth testing.
The problem is definitely in the objective category. I solo, and any decent group I get can get 2-3 gens peopped during a killers first chase if the looper is even half decent. I do find that to be an immense problem.
When I am killer, it happens to me as well even if I barely commit to chases if the survivors are savy enough to hit split gens or double the right gens.
I do not know the answer and I won't prerend to... but I do know you can't nerf SWF too much in this direction
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its only okay to punish Killer. Got it.
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Instead of punishing people for playing with their friends, maybe buff solo survivor and killers to match them? And maybe learn to look at things in a constructive way rather than the destructive "nerf this and that" way or just leave the game balance suggestions to people who actually consider other peoples fun too.
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I’d rather me and my friends not have an insane slowdown because we want to play together
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Good news, everyone would lobby dodge until they found each other in a match. My friends and I have done it before and we'd do it again because we just want to have some fun; alternatively we'd all just talk to each other and play a different game because that'd be unfun as all hell. If you're gonna nerf SWF do it in a way that doesn't mean we need to hold M1 for even longer please.
Also, instead of nerfing swf how about buffing solos? Then buffing killers accordingly? They said they'd do that about 2-3 years ago and never did.
SWF isn't the big bad boogyman, and a lot of the time it isn't sweat squads. If you keep blaming swf for what could easily be a solo team (I know in pre-game chat someone told all of us to use OoO and at least I was solo, they sent us to Midwich and there were 3 Objects, got accused of being a 4man try hard swf that just wanted to bully and I was like no) then you'll never improve.
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So what happens if it's a 3man + a solo? So that solo player just randomly gets 3 teammates with -45% action speed?
While I personally think mechanical nerfs are solidly in never ever territory when it comes to SWF, if that approach was to be followed the penalties would be way lower than 15%. And even then I really can't see it even being considered seriously by the devs.
There's a reason most discussion surrounds the "close the gap" approach. It's not a perfect solution either (a perfect solution does not exist) but it actually has a non-zero probability of even being considered and explored.
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I dream of the day where people stop whining about SWF and accept that they are not as good at the game as they think they are.
This idea came up multiple times and it is rubbish. This would be enough of an comment, but to go on:
Playing with Friends should NEVER be punished. It is a multiplayer onlinegame, people want to play with their friends.
And what about Solo-Players? They are not affected by the Debuff, but if you play as Solo with a 3 man-SWF or a 2 man-SWF, you will have teammates which are slow on Gens, healing, etc... And I am not talking about those who dont do the Objective, but they are doing it, but slower. So this means that Solos will be affected as well.
The last point is also something against this mentality "SWF also screws over Solos", because it would even enforce this (non-existent) problem.
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I'm of the opinion that the solo-queue experience should be improved by putting stuff like hook counters, chase indicators for non-obsessions, and possibly a radial menu similar to Overwatch with simple phrases that only works within a certain distance of other survivors.
Along with that, buff killer in general so everything gets more evened out.
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Yeah let's keep punishing killers for that
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I think the solution is to just get better at killer. I am sorry if people feel differently but there are very few SWFs that are optimal survivors. In fact 4 optimal solos are just as hard to defeat as 4 man optimal SWFs.
And if you play at red ranks, well you probably face at least some permutation of SWF as is. Are you losing every game? Because not every SWF is seal team 6 running full meta builds.
I'd argue that regular 4 man SWFs are actually overly altruistic, so much so that an experienced killer can use that against them.
If you are the kind of player that blames every loss you have on SWFs, perhaps you need to search deeper within yourself and examine the weaker parts of your game.
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Voice communications allow SWF to have all aura reading perks in addition to 16 other perks. The killer only has four perks to counter this.
Want to play with your friends? Do it without speaking to yourself. As a killer, I don't want to play against cheaters.
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SWF doesn't need to be nerfed.
Solo needs to be buffed. Then buff killers to balance.
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This post reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeks of entitlement. No. You don’t get to punish people for playing together because you’re not good enough to beat them.
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Oh good lord. The counter to SWF has, and always will be, to counter their altruism. Altruism is a SWF's worst enemy because they're all sitting on comms saying, "Save me!". If you know, without a doubt, that you got a SWF there's always some dude running to the hook to save their teammate if they're not already there.
Also stop chasing survivors not on gens if you can't find anyone off the bat or in between hooks. For every survivor that's not on a gen there's most likely three that are. Killer isn't complicated. Stop being a bad killer and blaming everything on communications or perks. Learn to be smart and play effectively.
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Omg. Someone with sense on the forums. Where have you been all this time?
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So what if I'm solo, running the killer around, by that logic, I'd have to run the killer even longer because my 3 team mates, who happens to be SWF, are doing things slower. That just makes solo Q even worse.
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I hate the stupid thoughts of SWF advocates with all of me. While they are quietly playing an assisted version of the game, the killer should stop complaining and outdo himself, be under pressure throughout the game, have to anticipate even more actions than in SoloQ, etc.
What if we just wanna play chill ?
You are just a bunch of selfish people.
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Haha, thanks!😊
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Ye wanna jump in KYF lobby? I'm a rank 8 survivor but with 3 friends on discord u really think u gonna beat us? uff we never lost a single match when all 4 of us played, not one match
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9/10 SWFs you go against are just people who play the game to chill and socialize. Hell, 50% of them will have at least 1 intoxicated person. This would just be a pain to people who want to chill and not really affect the sweat squads who'd be split up of gens and all be good enough at looping that you still wouldn't catch them before gens pop.
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Yeah and punish the people who play with their friends for fun, pog move.
Seriously, when I SWF with, you guessed it, friends, we make it out less than I do in solo because we mess around and sandbag each other, my friend wanted their rank 1 achievement recently so we decided to be sweaty and we couldn't go three minutes without pissing around with each other and getting 4kd again.
There is a lot of over exaggeration in this community about how often people get 4man swf object comms sweat squads and it's really unhealthy for the community, swf is not an issue, it's how SWF can be abused that is the issue!
Seriously...
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Play in the evening, between 9 p.m. and 2 a.m., in the EU region and 80% of matches are 3 to 4 SWF. It's horrible. Especially against Russian SWF ...
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I do play during those times, I'm EU by default. I'm queueing killer right now in fact, I'll make this brief though because I'm loading into a lobby as I type.
It isnt as bad as people make out, sure you get a couple and those unpleasant matches stick out but that doesn't make it the majority!
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jesus christ for each? 15% should be the max applied even for a 4 man, and if it were up That high it should be the co-op repair penalty applied while the solo (in gen repair, obviouslys till only applied to a member of a swf) penalty shouldn't go over 6% or 7& for the 3 or 4 man and duos should never be penalized at all. duos are very, very rarely a trouble even with double duo lobbies. It's some 3 man and 4 man teams where the problem can be. duos, even double duo lobbies, there is only one other person for each to conspire and callout to each other with and if you are columbo you can identify the person from you need to kill or just tunnel one out period and the match gets easy instantly. 15% total combined is pretty harsh, let alone Per Player. That is hella unfair even to the ones that deliberately coordinate to screw with killers or tryhard. Those few Yt channels you may have seen with a guy and a friend in a troll duo, what you don't see are the tons of matches they screw up before cherrypicking the matches they wanna montage.
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I agree that the should have some draw back but not to that extent that would be very oppressive imagine freddy with thanat sloppy dying light ruin I would rather go with this effect
Herd mentality for every person I. The swf they gain a 5% increase action speed on chests searches healing speed (not including the surivor that's downed or hooked) unhooking and exit opening if they are within 24m of each other but if they are out of a 24m range they get a 5% decreased action speed to all of the things said above
if all survivors are in a swf any surivor that is alone for 45s will receive exhaustion of 1s and it will not be removed until within 8m of another surivor if it is a 2 person swf the location of an surivor will be marked with a beacon (like map)
And if it's a 4 person swf they will be afflicted with blindness after being alone for 30s
If they are alone for 60s they may scream revealing their location this effect will cancel after getting within 16m of a surivor
Vigil will do all the effects it dose currently and delay the the timers for these effects by 20s for anyone affected by vigil and 35s for the person that equipped vigil
No mither will make you immune to all of these effects and you start healthy
I think this is an alright change that won't cripple players
(maybe newer players but if the tutorial ever gets updated that shouldn't be an issue)
Thought
(Clarification if you are solo you are immediately immune to all of this if your swf buddy died you are immune to this as wellunless you have another one)
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You can't nerf people playing with friends. If you do that the game will die, I don't get why DBD is the only community that has issues with people playing on comms.
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Let's not punish people who play against people who play together aswell, shall we?
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Because the game is not balanced around it. If we embrace comms then build it into the game itself and balance the game around it's existence. As is, comms is a de facto 5th perk unaccounted for in game design. Like try playing hag, trapper, or jumpscare Mikey against SWF + OOO... and like any perk, some games it makes all the difference some games not. But a killer needs an incredibly thick skin to deal with the BS from SWF calling out totems, coordinating hook bombs, hook blocking, flashlight saves, calling out gens to work on when killer in chase, who has UB and can be left slugged, etc..
Seriously all y'all who say SWF with comms is no big deal, are you all either red rank killers who destroy everyone or survivor mains? I can't rationalize it any other way.
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swf > killer > soloQ
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