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Public Service Announcement: Scratch Mirror Myers
This is a public service announcement for those of you who still don't seem to understand how Spooky Myers works (Scratched Mirror + Boyfriend's Memo). I can see through walls a LONG way. It amazes me that I still run into Red and Purple Rank Survivors who don't seem to understand this. Spooky Myers can see you, pretty much all the time. His trade off is he is slow and can never Tier up. This brings me to the NEXT point:
No, I'm not camping. I can see you. If you don't leave the area, I'm not going to either. Why would I? If I can see two out of three unhooked Survivors within my range, I'm going to angle to get them. I had people who were Red Rank that called me a "Face Camper" when I wasn't even in sight of the hook, simply because I could return to the Hook to intercept them. So, I want to know WHO carried you people into the Red Ranks that you don't understand Spooky. Time to learn.
Comments
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Thank you for clarifying, but what's your point really? Do you simply wanna inform? Pass on a message perhaps? Or got annoyed in a trial because the survivors accused you of what you've counterargued already?
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Red rank survivors, mid-creating a thread about how all Myers players were facecamping nitwits:
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To be honest - Myers is rarely played today, Scratched Mirror is even more rare. I guess you can have 1000 hours on Survivor without running into a Scratched Mirror Myers once.
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I mean if they’re getting to the same rank as you without even knowing or learning about perks etc, I’d say they’re better than you at the game. With knowledge they’ll be even better
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I want to inform. I play a LOT of Spooky Myers. It is my favorite build. I get tired of the salt from "supposed" Red and Purple Ranks that don't seem to know how he works. If I wanted to camp, I'd camp. I don't have any aversion to it. It just boggles my mind that they don't know how this Meme Build works.
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I suppose this is probably true. I play him all the time, and hence this public service announcement. I just don't like being accused of things incorrectly. When I camp, people will know it. I won't mince words about it. I've played enough people here now that they know if there is no one around the hook, I'm going to go look for them. If they are all in my range to see them, I'm going to move in on them. If they head for the hook and I can intercept and grab, I'm going to do it. It is precarious timing, but very gratifying when it works.
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GoodBoyCow-ru
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I enjoy this name.
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Heres the thing. If you put yourself in a position where you will always be able to prevent an unhook, due to your constant knowledge and active positioning, is that not functionally the same as face camping? Im not calling you a camper here, a tier 1 myers trying to face camp would be ridiculous, but Im playing devils advocate a bit. Like sure the nurse isnt face camping, but if she teleports back right before someone can make an attempt, every single time, she might as well be? What is mechanically different from the two situations?
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face camping. is from a time where you could only unhook someone from the front. meaning if a killer stood right in front of the survivor, it was impossible to unhook.
meaning it's literally impossible to face camp anymore.
the difference between camping and what is happening in the match, is that he is not just defending the hook, he's going for the other people.
it's not the killer's fault if the survivor unhooks while he is in range of the hook. and/or the survivor stays near the hooked person. (which, if you do this... shame on you)
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No, it isn't. Face Camping is a very specific thing. The closest thing you could accuse a Spooky Myers of is "Proxy Camping" if that... I am not obligated to ignore you running back to the hook. I'm going to intercept you on the way or at the hook. If none of you are hanging out there, I will leave to go hunt. That is my advice, DO NOT hang around the hook against a Spooky. Make him leave to hunt... and go long around the the outside.
If I am Face Camping or Lurking right by the Hook, you are NEVER going to make that save. However if I'm almost 30 meters away, you have a chance. If I'm even further you have MORE of a chance. Spooky is slow. The best option is to get him into a chase with one person, who loops, while you go for the rescue. But if everyone stays close, but nobody wants to engage and risk getting hit, you are dooming that person on the hook. YOU are doing it, not me.
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Scratched Mirror was fun in 2018, its not anymore.
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Hrm. Come to think of it there was a great game I played earlier on one of the Auto-Wrecker maps. I hooked the Claudette in the basement and left the building heading up the middle. Two other Survivors about 20 meters apart were coming down on my left and right side. They stopped slightly to the front of me when I was about 15-20 meters from the shack. Basically, we could all see one another. So here is the question, am I camping? :)
I would argue, no. At this point we are playing keep away. Neither Survivor would commit, each wanting the other to go in or lead me off. Neither would risk getting close enough to me to really get a chase going. Do you see my point. They didn't leave. They were very obvious, and clearly wanted to give me the one-two punch, only instead of a Generator it was the basement they wanted to get to. I would argue that this was NEVER going to work and it should have been obvious to them. Why would I leave? I could see THREE Survivors, i.e. two in front (off to either side) and one behind me 15-20 meters in the basement on the hook. This left only one unaccounted for.
So, my choices are engage with one of them starting a chase I can't close because they never came close enough to me to encourage it, and allow the other the unhook, or stand there in the open field, the center of the triangle between them. I would gladly have gotten into a chase if one of them was willing to come close enough to make it worthwhile, but nobody in their right mind is going to start a chase with slow Spooky when they have a 15+ meter head start. Somewhere, number four is working Generators. So the longer this stand off goes on, the closer another Generator gets to being done, and the closer the basement person gets to dying. We are playing chicken at this point, i.e. who wants to blink first, their Altruism, or my Generator Pressure.
In this example, I'm not camping (or even Proxy camping). I'm controlling an entire side of the map because they are ALLOWING me to do it. They are staying in my view (not even behind walls) 15-20 meters in front of me while the basement is 15-20 meters behind me in a building. I submit that what they should have done is gone WIDE on both sides so I couldn't keep both in sight. I would have had to commit to one or the other, or blown it off and gone to look for the one I knew was on a Generator somewhere. In this example, it is the Survivors who actually had ALL the power; they just squandered it.
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It is still a blast. I've been challenging myself playing him on larger maps to see if I can get any traction. Since I mostly play Red Ranks (and sometimes some Purple in there too) this is a hard field to till, but very great games.
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You completely ignored the question. Your response was "no", then you simply talked about your play style. The question is, "if someone plays in a way, in which the only time someone attempts an unhook results in you having the same proximity as face camping, how are they functionally different?"
Lets get crazy with it. Lets say you hook someone, and are automatically teleported to 2 feet in front of the hook if anyone gets within 10 meters of it. While your model is not in fact there, is there a functional difference from face camping? The answer to me seems no, as your ability to deny an unhook with 100% assurance remains.
Now to take that idea one step further, if you put yourself in a position that your awareness of everyone's locations prevent them from ever being able to sneak an unhook, and you always return to deny an unhook when someone is trying to make an attempt, you will be able to ALWAYS return to the hook before they are, as killer is faster and you have your intel advantages. Now Im not claiming this is your primary goal or strategy, but you eluded to doing something similar. How would this situation be functionally different to face camping, if you are always able to maintain your closer position to the hook in this way?
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By your logic, any Killer with suitable skills and instincts is camping regardless of where they are on the map. :) I have, many times, crossed the ENTIRE map, hit someone, and returned to the other side to pick someone up in my Stalk and then intercept them. Again, that isn't camping (not even remotely so). I am merely intercepting and ambushing which is how Spooky Myers plays. And no, I didn't ignore your question. You just didn't accept the answer.
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Just wanted to point out that a "Public Service Announcement", often called a PSA for short, is entirely intended to publicly inform people of something. So the title of this thread answers that question.
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Ah, understood.
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But to play Devil's Advocate myself, I'll go into more depth. Hag also has ways to watch someone on the hook while departing, and can (much faster than me in fact) get back to the hook. She even has the luxury of not having to pay attention. A good Trapper can do this too. There are lots of Killers who can get an alert. Demogorgon can plant one of his nasty holes near the hook so he is alerted when someone approaches and teleport back. None of these Killers are "camping" unless we now want the term to literally mean ANYTHING and EVERYTHING other than simply allowing the unhook.
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"if someone plays in a way, in which the only time someone attempts an unhook results in you having the same proximity as face camping, how are they functionally different?"
I would personally point to the issue of Survivors leading and looping a Killer around a hook. In that scenario, you GENERALLY don't blame the Killer. It's not their fault that a teammate lead them to the hook and looped them there. Yes, the Killer could break off, but nobody would reasonably expect them to. Similarly, checking an area around a hook as the Killer is not uncommon in the slightest. If BBQ goes off and the Killer notices that two people are missing, it's pretty common for them to search the area. That isn't proxy camping, that is a fairly sound action based on the available data. Yes, they could go all 40+ meters to get the one or two they saw, but they have good reason to suspect that someone is closer. If found fast enough, that would provide instant pressure and an advantage.
In the case of a Spooky Myers, the same logic is presented. They KNOW someone is close. They are also slower, however, than most Killers. As such, they need to very carefully weigh their actions against the possible counter-actions. That might mean they back off and stay still for a moment, looking to see where the closest Survivor will go, in order to try and create an advantage when the chase starts. Sure, it looks bad to the Survivors that don't know what is going on. However, if they still wish to attempt the unhook, their best option is still to get close enough to engage a chase, and lead the Killer away. That is always the best way of making a risky unhook safer. Unless it's Bubba. Cuz Bubba.
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Much better stated and explained than I did it; thank you.
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Well, I'm not certain about that actually. While I will throw in the odd indoor map when I get them, I have been playing him on the BIG maps to see which I can win on. I'm happy to say I've managed to do pretty well on a number of maps that would surprise you. Most people NEVER assume it is a Spooky when it is an outdoor map, so they tend to hide rather than the more effective counters. I'll often play along and pretend like I'm trying to stalk up. The longer you can go, outdoors, with them thinking you are a standard Myers, the better things tend to go.
You do have to take certain things, however, and the Perks: Play With Your Food and Corrupt Intervention are non-negotiable. I don't normally take NOED, but when I'm "riding the lightning" (that is how I refer to just taking whatever map fate gives me) I will sometimes toss it in. The most common fourth Perk I take is either Ruin, Pop, or Surge.
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Wall hack Myers, Pig, and Wraith are the reason I still regularly use Sole Survivor. Sure teammates dying is bad, but one token is all I need to completely counter (most) of their wallhack add ons. (2 tokens for Myers 32m range one)
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Yep. :)
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I mean surely they question why you’re never hitting tier 3 Evil Within.
Surely?!
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How did I get to red ranks? I have no idea. I didn't want to be here. In fact the depipping bug was the best thing that happened to me because I was a depip machine and had some really fun games.
I'm not competitive, I'm not a tryhard, I play with maybe 1 friend at most. However the game insists that I am in fact a red rank survivor and killer. It's like "Why?"
I don't watch youtuber tutorials, I can't loop for crap, I can't guarantee a decisive strike or great skill check, I'm not great at stealth, I have only a basic amount of general gamesense.
I shouldn't be here at all. I don't even know HOW several killers work let alone their addons. How does Plague work? IDK don't get caught. Why does Pig do that lions roar? She just does. Freddy? ######### that dude.
So thank you for the explanation. I would've never known otherwise. Get me the hell out of tryhard redranks. I don't belong here, I don't deserve it, I don't want it. This is such a weird game. I spent so much time in my life climbing the ranks of games like Overwatch, Street Fighter, Starcraft etc. I looked with excitement and elation as my skill got better alongside my opponents.
This game though? Oh man this game. "######### I ranked up... when's reset again?"
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I'm in the same boat. I've been playing for 4 years and I still don't know how I get into Red Ranks every month. I play a lot of solo queue or with 1 friend. I end up playing with some of the sweatiest, most toxic players and of course, the killer is usually interested in punishing every one and not allowing for any actual gameplay...tunnelled into the ground, slugging, face-camping. People don't save, don't heal, can't run the killer or just sabotage you all together, no matter how much you have done to help them in the game. I was much happier in green and yellow ranks.
As for Spooky Myers, he is my favorite, to play and play against, and a lot of survivors have no clue how to counter him. Also, the new Game map is torture for him. Too big, too bright, too many pallets.
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I see Mikeys nearly every day. His pick rate stats in both red ranks and across all ranks certainly don't indicate a rarity either.
Lets just be honest a lot of survivors are simply potatoes.
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Well if I play it right, they just think they are great at preventing me from stalking up, or they start to assume I'm running Judith's Tombstone (perhaps with the Fragrant Tuft of hair). Is it a little dirty of me to pretend? Perhaps. When I take Lightborne... I always turn away from the flashlights and pretend I don't have it too. That way later I can make it REALLY count.
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They're losers who can't take any accountability for why they lost because it would destroy them.
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Not even joking, but most people I play with against him are just clueless on what to do. They usually kill themselves on hook :/
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I didn't know about this build. Sounds really fun, and challenging.
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I just started trying Spooky Myers. Unfortunately I never have too many map offerings.
2 questions!
1. Should I plan for Spooky Myers even without a map offering?
2. Is Vanity Myers worthwhile? Its only 16m, but tier 2 is faster. Maybe a build like the following;
Corrupt Intervention
PWYF
M&A
NOED
M&A helps you to see survivors before they hear your TR. Im new to Myers and only Rank 15, so bear with me lol
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Fair enough
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Evil Within 1 Myers is honestly my favorite way to play Killer right now. Ambushing Survivors never gets old, and looping becomes barely a thing you need to worry about. On top of that, Survivors get so inefficient when they have no clue what the Killer is up to because he's always undetectable. Its great fun.
What I actually don't get is killer players who try to win by milking EW 3 as much as possible. Sure that can work and EW 3 is strong, but if you want to play that way... doesn't Oni just flat out do that better? Oni doesn't have to stalk a ton to get his insta downs, which is good for him because only stalking for a long time can and will lose you gens.
Honestly, I think the reason so many people put Myers low on tier lists is because they don't use EW1 right or enough.
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I have not seen him this month and if I had to guess, I go against him at max once every two weeks. Probably the second-rarest Killer I go against (with Number 1 being Hag).
Could be region-based tho. (Like I go against Huntress a lot, probably because she is a Russian Character and I play against lot of Russians so I can imagine Myers being more popular in the US)
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The difference between camping and not allowing an unhook is the information the killer has. A camper will lurk near the hook regardless of him knowing if there are survivors near or not. If you leave scratch marks in the vicinity because you wanted to hide to get the unhook you let the killer know you are near so of course the smart play would be to look for you near the hook.
A Spooky Boi knows if there is anyone near so naturally he will position himself in a way to get the jump on you when you go for the save, if he sees you will try to go for it. If he stays around waiting for someone to come then yes, he was camping.
Camping is only when you stick around the hook waiting for survivors when you don't have any info if they are there or not, so no, what OP does is not camping at all since he stated that if there is no one near the hook he goes to hunt the rest.
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While Monitor & Abuse does slightly increase your field of vision, its chief purpose is to decrease the Terror Radius when you are not in a chase, and increase it when you are in one. This is wasted on Spooky Myers because he has no Terror Radius at all. I would actually suggest some sort of regression Perk, such as Ruin, Pop, Surge, or Oppression. When you play on the bigger maps it is harder to maintain Generator Pressure, so a little insurance is a good thing.
Monitor & Abuse is better on what I call Mediocre Myers, i.e. the Vanity Mirror build. If you take M&A and the Dead Rabbit Add-On, you will reduce your Terror Radius to zero when not in a chase. This allows you to get quite close to people before your Red Stain gives you away (or the chase music starts). I'm not a huge fan of the Vanity Mirror because that particular build of Myers attempts to give you the best of both worlds, but really just does nothing well. If the Vanity Mirror allowed Myers to START at 115% and have the limited wall hack immediately, it might be worth the time. But since it does not, I'd rather just start slower but have the information from the start.
Post edited by Moundshroud on2 -
Moreso it's just inform about mirror myers. That last part was an example to prove their point
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Nothing funnier than getting several indoor maps in a row, throwing on a random outdoor offering to break it up, and getting it over Shytt-Myself Meyers.
Purely coincidental but the killer is not happy.
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Okay it is a build granted. This an argument that is agree to disagree on. In my opinion I would call it babysitting. You aren't checking gens. You know you are with in distance for an interception of the hooked. My opinion lazy. You maybe slower but if people got to lower ranks without using that build, they are better. Just as survivors who likes to play ring around the rosie (loopers) aren't any good. Survivor should be able to out smart, hide or dodge, not an in house cheat for circling. Winning that way doesn't seem to me like a real win. You are relying solely on your build not prowess. Again agree to disagree.
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You've got to also realise that the survivors don't know where you are relative to the hook either with jump scare myers. What do you want them to do? You're bringing indoor offerings too right? It's either let the hooked survivor die, or take the free hit on the generator or get yourself in a position where t1 myers can't possibly get a free hit. All really result in a loss if you play t1 myers correctly.
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These reveal addons are a part of the "hidden mechanics" problem. I'm sure many people play this game for hundreds of hours and have never bought Myers and have no idea about scratched mirror.
I had played for hundreds of hours and had no idea Wraith has a reveal addon. The only reason I knew Oni has a reveal addon is because I happen to play Oni a lot.
I've never been thrilled about the hidden mechanic side of this game. It takes a long while to learn what you're up against and we keep adding more and more Killers, perks, addons. I'm not surprised at all.
I couldn't tell you how many times I've watched players try to hide while BBQ just popped. Survivors that try to hide when I'm Legion frenzy.
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That's a good point - it's all meaningless.. I guess the major difference is splitting your attention vs. playing it safe, but in any other game playing it safe is a good idea
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Again, as others have already pointed out, 'camping' or 'babysitting' relies entirely on the information the killer has.
If they're lingering around within range of the hook because they don't know where the other survivors are, that's camping.
If they're staying close because they know another survivor is right there, or even moreso if they can actually see them or their aura, that's not camping/babysitting, that's playing killer. To leave the area is literally giving away the game at that stage. It is wholly within the survivors power to lead the killer away from the hook.
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Unless you're low rank, I wouldn't bother running SM Myers unless you have map offerings, specifically (in this order): Lery's, Hawkins, The Game (though it's a lot more of a challenge with the revamp), and if you're feeling risky Midwich (though I don't bother unless I'm feeling masochistic; too many long rooms with no decent LoS breaking).
At low rank you can get away with it more as the survivors are a bit more green. I've had some good maps on Mother's Dwelling and ToP.
Do not bother with vanity mirror imho. You lose the last minute element of surprise, and you lose the best route planning, for a pointless speed boost. Though I must admit I've only tried it a limited number of times.
Spooky Myers is one of my favourite builds, but only with a map offering.
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It's not ######### spooky Myers, it's jump scare myers ######### lol. Pretty you are proxy camping with scratched mirror. Noed is for baby killers who ######### the bed all game that don't patrol gens. It's not hard to use Jump scare Myers at all.
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Hold W and you'll be fine, unless he gets the opportunity to jump scare you. Scratched mirror isn't so bad, since wraith changes, I haven't been having a good time against x-wraith.
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No need for a PSA. They will find out after complaining about it on the forums.
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Camping for a killer is desperate attempt to get a kill because they suck at the game it's the devs fault for making it an ok option for killers you say there's nothing wrong with it I say there is there is alot wrong with this game that will never get fixed because the devs don't care
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