Trickster talk
This is in no way about his look. I don't want to hear anything about his look as it adds nothing to the real problem.
Just from watching game play as I didn't have the joy of playing the ptb, the Trickster is weak because he's slow and the problem with that is his power. It doesn't warrant such slow speed as it's too weak as a ranged power to hold him high enough.
The second point in my opinion would be his add ons as in my opinion a lot of them are weak or don't add anything to his power and the only worthwhile add on was nerfed.
Like a broken record he needs to be buffed and I hope that's what they've done in the past week.
I want to hear some creative ways to buff him that isn't just movement speed. I don't want hear people just dissing the devs either cause it's pointless and we all get it already.
Comments
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Idk, I’ll probably start him off with corrupt pop endfury and see how it goes Wing after people while holding M2. I doubt it could be that bad.
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Lower his knives' damage requirement to like 4 or something, dude. There's no way to consistently get 7-8 knives on someone who knows what they're doing. It's the same counterplay for Huntress and Deathslinger: simply break line of sight. Or maybe they could make him throw even more rapidly, like making Main Event the basekit throwing speed, and keep the 8-knife requirement to injure. "These reworks would be too strong." There's no reason a 110% killer shouldn't have a strong ability.
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In all honesty, Trickster's base kit felt pretty strong to me. His knives can actually injure and down incredibly quickly while losing less time and distance than either Huntress or Deathslinger in the right circumstances.
If any part of him does still need buffs after the PTB changes happen, I'd say they should look at Main Event. The concept behind a primarily ranged power burst killer is fantastic... but his burst of power was just... eh? Blood Fury, EW3, and Corrupt Purge are all a huge deal when they happen. Main Event just... kinda wasn't. They have made it a bit better though, so we'll see how that turns out.
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I don't think he is going to be a good killer, he needs a massive overhaul of buffs and changes if he is going to be decent.
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The only way to make Trickster good, is by basically making him OP.
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The thing about Trickster is that he's almost overbearing if not for the fact that it's artificially impossible to maintain chase pressure with him.
What he needs is for his single knife-toss to be 100% accurate (it wasn't in the ptb), and for his Main Event to be actuated whenever the Trickster wants instead of having a decay. Also, decreasing the decay on his laceration, or replacing it with a short heal action.
With these changes, a good trickster would be able to always down even the best survivors, however it would take longer the better the survivor is and the survivor would be able to show off a lot of skill and loop knowledge.
Edit: accidentally posted it half-done.
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Hard to get a judgement when BHVR holds him hostage. Had they extended the release one more week then I would have started calling Trickster by Vickster instead...
Ill hold judgement for now, but I have seen lots of suggestions about buffing him by DbD community, BHVR seemed to not care again and decided to piss everyone else off more lol.
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In "less time" than Huntress or Slinger? Slinger can hit you within seconds of him seeing you, and Huntress can if you're a good Huntress. Trickster will hit you 2 or 3 times by the time Deathslinger hits you once, and that's all he needs to do to injure you, Trickster still needs to hit you more to even injure. I think it would be fine if you kept stacks of laceration on a survivor but you don't, so there's no incentive to pepper multiple survivors with them, which would actually give him a strength over Huntress and Slinger.
Maybe I need to play him more when he comes out but I really don't see it. I play a lot of Deathslinger too and I just don't know why I'd ever play Trickster over him.
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Yeah but he looks cool!
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He is sadly going to be a lot weaker huntress or deathslinger. Sad as I love the idea of another projectile killer. But still you never know some people could find a way to make him very effective
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This killer has so many problems.
The basic speed.(4.4 a 4.6)
The speed of when using the skill.(3.92 a 4.0\4.2)
Its main event.(you have to activate it when you want)
These 3 things need to be changed.
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Yes... less time.
It takes Trickster less than 3 seconds to pull out his knives and throw 8 of them. He starts off still moving at 3.68 m/s and if my numbers are right he's still moving at 3.4 m/s after throwing 8 knives. That's actually very quick and really not that much speed lost while doing it. In addition to that, after he's thrown 8 knives there's no mechanics preventing him from continuing to throw them.
Most Huntress players I've watched usually fully charge hatchets before they throw them. Makes sense, you're making an ammo and time investment by throwing one and charged hatchets are much harder for the Survivors to dodge. Here's the thing, fully charging a hatchet also takes 3 seconds and slows Huntress to 3.08 m/s. Also after Huntress lands a hatchet, there's a minimum of 1.25 seconds before she can throw a 2nd one and that'll be an uncharged snap shot so Survivors know they can just run away post hit without worrying about an immediate follow up.
Now for Deathslinger, he can go from seeing you to having you on his spear incredibly quickly. However, at that point Deathslinger hasn't injured you yet. He still has to reel and swing which can take several seconds depending on how long he has to reel you. Then after that he has gotten his injury, but now he has to wipe his weapon and reload before he's really a threat again, all while the Survivor can safely hold W with a 2 second speed boost which he'll need to catch up to. When taken together, all of that is going to take way longer than 3 seconds. Way way longer.
That's why I think Trickster is going to be better than a lot of people are saying. He can be far far more relentless in chase than either of them can be, but as a trade off he needs line of sight on his target the whole time. Now I can't say for sure how that tradeoff will pan out, but I'm excited to see it.
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It takes Trickster less than 3 seconds to pull out his knives and throw 8 of them. He starts off still moving at 3.68 m/s and if my numbers are right he's still moving at 3.4 m/s after throwing 8 knives.
You definetely won't be able to hit 8 knives immediately under normal circumstances.
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It's incredibly easy to stall Trickster's chase by just wiggling back and forth, having distance on his 110 ass... or just understanding that walls are a thing that exist. Once walls start existing, Trickster becomes a 110 M1 Killer.
He's the worst Killer in the game. Bar none. If his knives were that good, Plague would be a high-tier Killer since Vile Purge is pretty much the exact same. But she's not. And she's STRONGER than Trickster.
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Unless you are nearly in lunge distance you can't be that accurate with the knifes and you need 8 of them to land for a single health state, with his recoil on top of that you're not injuring a survivor beyond a tile unless they were a knife or two from injuring that survivor.
He is a ranged killer without snowball potential due to it taking too long to injure survivors which in itself is also a problem, I truly don't see a reason to play him over ANY other killer. The only thing he has is the ability to be pretty unhindered by bodyblocking... kinda but that is only ever a problem at the end of the game if you lose so expecting good use out of that is expecting to lose in the first place.
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well, a good first step would be to make him a 4.6 m/s killer.
after that im not too sure myself tbh.
i like the idea of having ricochet blades in his basekit, but other than that i really dont know.
some suggest forcing survivors to get rid of his blades themselves, however if this was implemented poorly he'd be a literal release Legion 2.0, where he just throws a knife at you any time you vault sthg or drop a pallet until you slowly but surely go down.
in general, we have two options with him:
1) make him a 4.6 m/s killer with a power that is secondary and allows him to get hits easier
2) keep him a 4.4 m/s killer and make a power that is lethal enough for him to rely on
imo the first option would be the easier one out of the two, as it would just require some stat changes and a smaller buff to his power, however it would alsp be the option that, most likely, would leave him in a worse spot than the first.
the second option however would basically require us to rework parts of his basekit, which would not only make it quite a difficult task, but also makes it hard for him to properly distinguish himself from the powerhouses that are Huntress and Deathslinger, whose powers would be VERY similar to his then.
IMO the thing that makes the second option so hard is, that as soon as the lactation meter comes into play, he is immediately worse than Huntress or Slinger. both of these need a single shot to inflic good damage, Trickster needs 8. that means any time Trickster achieves some points on his lactation scale, Huntress and Slinger would already have gotten a full hit. If we buff him to being able to keep up with that, then where is the difference between his power and Slingers? yet if we dont do that, he is hardly worth of being a 4.4 m/s killer.
thats why IMO we should make him 4.6 m/s and have his power be a weaker version of Slinger / Huntress, more of a secondary ability he can use to get hits against survivors in bad positions.
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I do hope he receives more buffs than what they announced on Twitter. The decay on laceration happens too quickly, 110% is pretty bad for how underwhelming his power seems to be, and he has to stack too much laceration for a single health state. I still think he should have a single ricochet base kit as well.
He looks fun to play but if he ends up like Clown where survivors just aren't scared of you when they are halfway decent at playing the game then he's going to be awful to play.
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Here's mylist of buffs that I think would make him good
1 bounce is base
2 trick knives make the knives bounce again and do the additional laceration only if it bounces 2 times
3 one of these 2 things
Laceration takes longer to decay
or survivors have to take 1.7s to remove 1 bar of laceration to their character removing the decay all together at a max of 12s to remove
All of them
4 reduced the recoil effect this one is for console players because I heard some pc players were struggling with it
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When it comes to recoil we'll just have to wait however I doubt it will be a problem. It's only a problem for those who don't play any shooters like cod, rainbow or any game that has recoil.
Like any game it just takes practice and getting use too especially when it comes to something like recoil on console. We're pretty good at managing it. With Huntress amd deathslinger you have to make the perfect shot everytime by leading the shot and aiming properly, Huntress being harder then deathslinger. With Trickster he's more optimal for close range - medium but there is absolutely no point in trying to go far range without guaranteed misses.
I'd rather the devs focus on his power and movement speed then catering to those who aren't use to recoil.
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