How would you nerf spirit
we all know that spirit is a really annoying killer and is in need of a change
one thing I would really want is that they give her own chase music but when she start phasing the chase music changes to be more aggressive to show she is made and gaining on you real fast
give me your change ideas
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Make her phase look like her passive phase. It's still quite tricky to tell what she's doing but at least you have something to work with.
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I would make it so survivors could tell when she is phasing (add an animation or visible change in her appearance when phasing), would remove the "stand still" mindgame and give you information that perhaps some actual consistent counterplay would arise.
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here's the thing isn't it. Survivors want her to give information the exact thing she's not supposed to be giving you. So a nerf will either be so small you won't even notice or its going to put her in the ground
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Make her phase walk like the Dream Transition. By that, I mean have Spirit's husk move to her current location at set intervals during her phase walk. This would actually allow for mindgames on both sides.
Would buff her base duration to 6 seconds to compensate, nerf her add-ons, and make it so that cancelling Phase Walk early has a penalty to it. Perhaps cancelling Phase drains the entirety of the power regardless of how long you spend phasing, or Spirit's post-phase boost is longer depending on how long she stays in the phase.
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That's so true, remember when she had that sound bug? It wasn't anything major but that alone was enough to nerf her hard.
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- Remove passive phasing.
- While phasing, have a dim shadow be visible only on the ground right under her. This will give her some sort of counterplay while also making her still very useful when looping around objects that the survivor can't see around.
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I think they should have a screen indicator to when she is phasing, dbd mobile has this and it makes spirit actually fun to play as and against
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As Scott Jund said: Remember the bug a while back that survivors could occasionally hear her phasing? Bring that back, as a feature.
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However you nerf her, you need to buff her as well. Leaving her with even less to work with isn’t the answer.
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At this point, it’s uncertain whether or not the devs will actually fix her. It’s such a shame because I really love Spirit and would like to play more often like I used to without feeling guilty.
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its not easy to "fix" her
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That's also a good Idea. Honestly with the amount of times she gets used, I wouldn't mind if the nerf has her swap places with hag. They can both be seen once every blue moon for a while.
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a freddy style rework basically and we all know how people feel about that. So where do we start the only way to nerf her is do it in a way where they tear her apart. At least that's if they nerf her in the way people want.
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I actually really like this because it would give her a more paranormal/ghost feel just a walking shadow.
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This stuff here is why killer is so frustrating to play. 4 v 1 killer is supposed to be stronger than any individual person making the team stronger as a group. Yet comms with SWF destroyed balance years ago.
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it would make her give information but only to people who are paying attention. This is how it should it be
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Personally I would nerf some of her broken add-ons. Not gut them or anything but Mother Daughter Ring + Yakuyoke Amulet is so absurd on an already busted killer. I'm talking small numbers changes, nothing drastic.
I won't comment on how to change her base kit because it's too difficult and I don't actually want her to be gutted. I enjoy playing as Spirit from time to time and I don't want her or any killer to be weak. I also don't really like how oppressive she can be though.
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like a real ghost
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There's two things that should be addressed: What the survivor knows when she's phasing and what the Spirit knows when she's phasing.
We already start off with an imbalance. The survivor doesn't know where the Spirit is, because she leaves behind almost no environmental cues. The Spirit, however, knows where the survivor is, because they do leave behind environmental cues. In fact, the survivor can't even know if the Spirit is phasing while in her terror radius. She is, after all, a mind gaming killer. She used to not have a vault animation for a reason.
But that makes playing against Spirit very unfun. So what I suggest is that the phasing emission sound (that wind you get when she's phasing near you) plays regardless of the terror radius, and becomes highly directional, in addition to having its volume correlate to the Spirit's distance from you. If not this, then making her footsteps much louder, or maybe even visual cues like one Wraith would have.
The other half of the problem is that survivor's invisibility isn't that much of an issue for Spirit. They move grass and make noise, from footsteps to breathing to moans of pain. Visual cues are rare enough to probably be left alone, but audio cues should be muffled or distorted a bit, like how noises Wraith hear sound distorted and muffled when he's cloaked. They would muffle and distort not only its directionality to make pinpointing more difficult, but also to make telling distance more difficult. All sounds would let you know is that there's a sound and the general area of where it's in, but the rest is left up to prediction. Same thing with scratch marks; they should probably be thinned out and dimmed when phasing, to make tracking via scratch marks a lot harder.
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I wouldn't nerf her too much, I would give her counterplay. Give her Wraith's cloak invisibility while she phases so survivors can see her while she phases. Lock breathing and grunting sounds to 50% of the usual noises during phasing so Iron Will doesn't counter her and Stridor doesn't come to effect while phasing, but still requiring her to use her brain to find out where they are.
Oh and also it'll remove the standstill mindgame. Sorta. I guess make the glow while she phases more visible.
After her speed boost ends, she gets slowed down a bit for a split second in order to punish her for not lunging at the surv. It won't do much, but it's something I guess.
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Leave Spirit alone please
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Change nothing but her add ons.
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I would do 2 things:
Give survivors a notification when she uses her power, no more standing still and doing nothing.
Make her power work like her passive phase by doing the following:
- Increase the duration of her power to 6 seconds basekit.
- At 1.5, 3, and 4.5 seconds into using her power, she phases back in for .5 seconds. During this time, survivors can see the spirit, and the spirit can see the survivors.
This gives her counterplay. She really isn't overpowered, she is just boring to play against because there really isn't any counterplay against her.
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Make her visible when she’s 2 meters from you.
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When she hits a survivor, her phase is on cool down like legion.
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Give something of a clue as to where she is. The bug Scott talks about depends on sounds, which are completely broken in this game, especially when terror radius is concerned. I think one of the visual cues suggested in this thread would work good combined with a slight buff to her phase duration.
I think passive phasing is also a slight issues if you play 'burst' spirit. Basically no consequence for just using the power in short bursts. Your power returns in no time and the survivor barely has anything they can do. It'd be nice if the Spirit wouldn't immediately attack out of phase, which could encourage different forms of play such as bodyblocking outright.
No one wants her to suck, but it is completely unreasonable to keep such a killer going the way she is. We already have Freddy for low-risk high-reward play even if he isn't all that strong in the end (Just a solo stomper), we don't need a killer that is nearly impossible to predict if used by someone that doesn't suck.
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They should remove her husk and make her completely invisible when she goes into phase. This would make her still powerful to go against but would remove the omega mind game of standing still.
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its balanced, doesnt need a nerf
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Oh no, a Killer that isn't free Survivor wins! Let's nerf her so we can get back to what this game is supposed to be!
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Honestly, I don't know what the obsession is with Spirit. Nurse is just better. And overall, both Killers are hated because the game becomes a SKILL MATCHUP, instead of Survivors being able to hold Shift W and mash Spacebar all the way to victory.
They are the only two Killers in the game with a real counterplay to the pallet/window/loop dynamic. And so, naturally, Survivors wanna gut 'em for it, so we can return to our regularly scheduled program.
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Or, and get this, maybe the reason why they're so hated is because everything survivors have learned about the game involving the one thing that's fun (chases) and the skill they've built up over 100s of hours no longer matters because these killers ignore almost all of it. They don't have "counterplay" to windows, pallets and loops, they just outright counter it entirely. Counterplay suggests there's something that the killer and the survivor can both interact with and play around, like for example how Huntress or Demo can zone survivors at loops, play 50/50s at pallets, or GhostFace activating night shroud to force a survivor to guess at a jungle gym, or whatever other killers do. Spirit and Nurse don't have anything that resembles this, they say "######### you" to all of it.
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Like I said, it becomes a skill matchup. As someone who's not played Survivor for about 4 years and is therefore not versed in the exhaustion perks, the rescue perks, the safety net perks, etc etc (back when all we had was the original 4 Survs)... I always LOVED going against a Nurse, because it was all about the mindgame on both sides. It felt safer for me, because I could just be a smart human being and outplay them. I didn't need hundreds of hours of practice and map knowledge.
You counterplay Nurse & Spirit by predicting how they will play, and how they will try to trick you.
You can't just... hold Shift W Spacebar and win. You have to be a smart player. The smarter player wins when it's Nurse/Spirit versus Survivors.
And I think that's how it SHOULD be.
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Let me also add...
There's a distinct abandonment of the HIDE dynamic. Survivors literally jump out into the open to MAKE SURE you see them, so that they can engage in a chase since it's become SO HEAVILY in their favor these days. They don't even TRY to hide from an incoming Killer. And that's because if a Killer decides to chase, then the other 3 Survs will annihilate the gens before the chased Surv is ever in any real danger.
How many times do people sit on a generator, even with a Killer coming DIRECTLY at them in plain sight, and then only at the VERY LAST MOMENT does that Survivor get off the gen, and initiate Sprint Burst and get to the nearest infinite loop?
This is BAD PLAY by the Survivor. But it's so weighted in their favor, they can not only get away with it, but it's SUPER COMMON.
They do that, instead of preemptively hiding from the Killer, and trying to avoid confrontation.
So, my point in saying all this, is...
Perhaps if it's Nurse or Spirit, maybe PLAY like it's Nurse or Spirit, instead of playing like it's a normie Killer that you can abuse with infinites & whatnot.
Maybe try hiding for once, like Survs used to do 4 years ago.
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she has basically no counterplay how is that balaced
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I wouldn't "nerf" Spirit but instead change her to have more counterplay on the survivor side. Currently, survivors have zero information on where the Spirit is while phasing. Not only that, it's borderline impossible to tell if she really is phasing in a real game. The standstill "mindgame" is probably the cheapest way to get a hit on survivors and requires zero skill to pull off. Why should a killer be rewarded for doing absolutely nothing? What survivors need is more info on where the Spirit actually is. A good fix to this would be adding some sort of directional sound that gives survivors a general idea of where the Spirit is but not enough to know her exact location. It gives both sides actual counterplay and stops Spirit from being a literal guessing game to play as and against which is not only unfun but also unhealthy for the game.
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When she phases she disappears immediately, and that her power does not work with Stridor.
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Glad nobody here is in charge of things. Spirit is fine. If she's getting a 4k every match you play then you need more practice. I'm a Spirit main and the people that give me problems are the good loopers. Trouble with Spirit? Loop better and hope your teammates are working gens and bones.
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I’d completely remove the ability to hear Survivor breathing and grunts, irregardless of Stridor, and rework Father’s Glasses. Literally nothing else. That’s all that needs to be changed.
Edit: Of course something should be offered in exchange. I reckon the phasing sound effect should be removed on her side so Spirit could hear footsteps more clearly since now she can’t hear breathing, and an increase to phasing speed, recharge, and duration back to how it was during her release.
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she has no counterplay apart from pre dropping pallets like a madman how is that "fine"
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just accept scootjund challenge and prove u can loop spirit.
People only talk spirit can be looped but cant prove it. This is already becoming too much to hear. Prove it !
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Make the not so good killers decent and then bring the insanely good ones down
Part of the reason theres alot of spirits is because she's the only one that can rival nurse and others just suck
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Give her a phasing sound but make it so she can phase through things as well. Also give survivors a red light, remove the effect of spinechill if a killer is stealth like ghostface, show the killer a timer for DS and other second chance perks.
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Nerf her stupid Add-ons first. And add that bug from a while back. Or the Otz idea and have brief moments when you see her.
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I had a complicated idea a while back that I'll try to refine:
Remove passive phasing and turn it into an alternate stance called "Active Phasing" that makes her constantly blink in and out of existence but severely lowers her Haunting recharge speed to about 40-60 seconds and doesn't let her activate it/fully recharge it while in this stance. If it's too weak, she can move at 4.6 in this stance.
Yamaoka's Haunting shows a wraith-style shimmer (weaker in intensity that Wraiths), for both her and the survivors. This includes becoming invisible after standing still for a little while. It's duration is increased but her movement speed is decreased, similar to Yakuoke Amulet. This would allow for more genuine mindgames and reward attentiveness.
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Problem is, you can't nerf Spirit without defeating the purpose of her kit. Everybody wants some kind of tell tale when she's phasing and that defeats the purpose of her kit. It's like nerfing Nurse to where she can't blink through objects
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I wouldn't.
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There are some problems about Spirit:
- Have scratch mark & sound for tracking. Because sounds only happens on injured survivors, make them an easy target.
- Survivors have no info about her, when she starts to phase, no tracking on her phase, when she out of phase.
- She gets punishment on failing a phase, powerbar doesnt depleted on short phase make phasing at loops is powerful (because it takes only 1/3 powerbar at best).
My change would be:
- Nerf her ability vs injured survivor: she's no more able to hearing sound.
- Spirit brightness greatly increase when she starts to phase. Giving info to survivor.
- Active phasing cost her 50% powerbar, the other 50% powerbar still give her ability to phase for 5sec. This change is to make her not able to spam phasing at loops.
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