Dear Devs: Are you -still- saying slugging is a-ok?
I just had 7 (seven) matches in a ROW that all went the same: killer's sole approach is to slug at the start of the game and then hook or let bleed out.
Now, I know these were all new players and that they 'learned' this probably from some BNFogwhisperer, but... this has gotten excessive.
I can understand when people defend things like tunneling, slugging and camping when it's rare, but 7 matches in a row... all from different people...
going AFK is bannable because it 'bars people from playing normally'. so with this now getting more common, how is that 'playing normally' (as in people actually get to do their objectives and end with at least 10k points)
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There are several perks that remedy this.
Also I see this in like, what one in every few hundred games if that. X to doubt.
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Several Perks?
There are exactly 3:
- Unbreakable, the obvious one.
- Soul Guard, if the Killer does not have a Hex, this Perk does not do anything. And a Killer who wants to slug from the start and one-hook everyone will not run Hexes.
- No Mither, come on... This has the big "Pick me up"-sign.
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Everything about that first sentence was wrong in nearly every way.
Firstly, using perks to fix playstyles is stupid because it's a very situational, and therefore retroactive, solution. Secondly, only a full team running every anti-slugging perk would really be able to do anything, since Unbreakable is a one-use perk, Soul Guard is Soul Guard and No Mither screams "don't slug me". In fact, that's kind of a big reason that UB is such a poorly designed perk, because it only really works against snowballing, not mass slugging.
And this is an event, it is extremely likely that people are going to do this. Same as me having about 10 killers in 2 days running Franklin's Demise and nearly as many Insidious bubba's.
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"And this is an event, it is extremely likely that people are going to do this. Same as me having about 10 killers in 2 days running Franklin's Demise and nearly as many Insidious bubba's."
The problem is, with the amount of Cakes and the nature of Killer-BPs, a Killer who slugs and onehooks can still get a decent amount of BPs, despite not doing that much during the game.
So it works out for them.
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those saying 'use perks':
I'd like you to read that sentence out loud. Then go and ask yourself how you'd react if someone would tell -you- when playing killer that you can just 'use perks' to counter something that's entirely unpredictable or not something that should leave -you- with solving it.
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And another huge problem is the amount of breathtakingly sweaty survivors who are driving this behaviour. I played 5 killer trials last night and the longest lasted a little over 5 minutes. Why burn 4 cakes if you're just going to slam gens and leave? It makes no sense.
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Which server are you playing on?
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Given that some killers like Oni/Michael are literally designed around slugging(Oni Literally losing their power when they pick up a survivor and Michael has to maximize his limited number of Tier 3 empowerments)...
Also having perks like knockout/deer stalker that empower slugging...
I doubt the devs will ever change it.
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^ This.
I find farming boring, and I don't expect every group to want to farm, but my ability to play on the Switch is very limited and unfortunately I seem to get no groups who will farm. If they remain in LoS long enough to realize I'm friendly, they just hop back on the gen. No, I don't motion at the gen, it's just the only thing they want to do. They don't even seem to want to stun me with pallets, and they certainly don't offer to do hooks. If I hit them, they run to the other side of the map, and I'm too blind to chase them that far.
I'm having a lot of matches where the survivor with the highest amount of base BP is under 11k. That's with escaping. How are so many survivors happy with that??
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european. I'm not saying the issue are russian players, but i think they were all either russian or vpn users...
Counterargument: Michael is not that well designed a killer. he's franchise accurate, but gameplaywise not that well designed. and oni suffers from the same issue as a lot of OG killers: he's balanced by his map, so once outside of sanctum of wrath he either becomes overpowered or underpowered, he's not designed around slugging, he's designed around a map that gives survivors a chance to outwit his power to avoid slugging
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Ehm isn't that already the case?
Killer think the game is going to fast with survivor spreading out on generators. What's the usual answer? Use slowdown perks and apply more pressure or don't play a weak killer.
Slowdown perks are already mandatory at high experience level.
Also another example, threads saying "I have problem finding survivor". Usual answer: Use aura reading perks.
It is already common on both sides to say "Use x perk against y problem".
Edit: To the thread topic: I don't think the devs are either really A-OK with slugging or camping or tunneling but they simply can't do anything real against it without also castrating killer that play normal and have to use those tactics in healthy doses for example during endgame or when a survivor is hook inside a.3 gen and there is no logical incentive to leave the area other than the fun aspect of the opposition.
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they will always say this until killers unite and all just do that because then the game is not fun to play anymore as survivor and the gmae would die, but until that happens yeah its fine.
again its only by the grace of the community that this game exists.
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Self:
Unbreakable, Soul Guard, Tenacity, No Mither
Team oriented:
WGLF, For The People, Buckle Up, any healing speed buff, Autodidact in case of stacked debuffs (it is a great perk against slugging with use of big debuffs).
General play:
Split up and crawl away from others if downed.
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bold of you to assume that so many sluggers actually hook people
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That's interesting, because I am Russian and I am getting normal survivor games wherever we are connected now.
In some thread like this people from NA servers were complaining about the same issues.
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does all of russia go to european servers or are you guys split over european/asian/north american servers? this might be a west russian thing
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You can also try not all getting downed. Unless it's a god-nurse or something you have to make some pretty big mistakes to allow a 4 man slug to happen.
And if that's caused by your solo teamates playing badly, isnt that on them?
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Can easily get 10-15k as survivor in a 5min genrush, pretty good BP/min IMO.
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Well, from west Russia I am clearly getting connected only to Europe, unless q times are too long and I am getting thrown to people with 200 ms ping and blank square nicknames. No idea where people from eastern Russia go.
Pretty sure that most Russian players are from western part too though. Just because 70% of Russians live here, not counting Ukrainians and Belorussians who will be counted as Russians and skew the numbers even more.
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You know what else can stop slugging?
Recovering, and then getting people up from the dying state.
These are literally mechanics in the game designed around the killers ability to down someone, and then leave them there. The perks are just enhancing that mechanic, like every other perk in the game is designed to do, enhance one mechanic or another.
Jesus christ next you guys are going to be complaining that the killer is hooking people.
"Devs, are you really saying it's ok for killers to hooks survivors? Surely this can't be intended!"
Slugging, Camping, Tunneling, these are all mechanics in the game that the killer can choose to take advantage of. There are four survivors, you can counter any of them through sheer gameplay (no perks, perks just enhance your ability to do so and make it easier) if you work together as a team of four. This is an asymmetrical game.
And lemme tell you, survivors do this all the time. Even the best killers who slug and camp can be and are beaten by good survivor teams, even teams that aren't full-SWF.
Some survivors like to rush and lynch the killer to prevent a hook. You know what's a good counter to that tactic? Slugging. You know what's a good counter to slugging? Leaving the area, and not rushing the killer, as that will afford your team the time and opportunities to recover each other. It's about making the right play, don't get salty because you made the wrong play. There are multiple ways to play this game. Unfortunately most survivors only want to play one way, which is lynch the killer with flashlights until they give up and ragequit.
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Are we all going to ignore the fact that this absolutely did not happen? 7 matches in a row? Definitely not.
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it's early morning here and the game is weird. (i know it's very out of the ordinary, but i wouldn't have made the post if not for the massive ######### factor of it. cause. hell, someone slugging at the start usually happens around every 15-30 matches, if one's unlucky. so this was just WHY? HOW?)
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You mean the way killers have to run some form of gen regression, if they want to ensure they've space for mistakes/outplays?
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let people use any strat they want to use to win as long as its not an exploit. let killers play to win and learn how to play against differet strategies, since survivors have different strategies too and will always try to use them and win over the killer.
if you don't know how to play against a slugging killer which is actually rare then learn on how to deal with it, don't come to a forum claiming it's too broken when it rarely works given you have more anti slug perks than what you think, you're working as a team, not solely as individuals when playing surv, so perks to help heal faster(wglf, medkits, even ######### autodidact) help a lot, given tenacity, soulguard, adrenaline, unbreakable, flip flop and power struggle are still a thing.
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Then tell your thoughts on this, gen rushing makes playing killer stressful and hard: just use perks. Keys feel like the survivors cheated to escape and grant unearned escapes: Just use perks.
I mean ruin and franklin's demise exist so those must not be real problems then.
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Slugging is fine. Just move far away from the slug to work on gens and go pick them up when you notice killer is in a chase with someone else (someone got injured, obsession symbols moving, eyes)
The only time slugging is a problem is when everyone is down and the killer is just letting everyone bleed out to bm
And even then it's just 4 minutes. Alt tab and do pushups whenever this happens. If it really occurs as much as you say you'll be ripped in no time
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Franklin's counters keys? Nice fairy tale.
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Ugh... Ehm.... What?
When did I even mention anything about hooking?
All I listed were perks to combat 4 man slug. (4 down then hook or force bleed out).
No perk I mentioned has anything to do with hooking, besides wglf getting some stacks for BP.
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this wasn't meant to be antagonizing. But all 'anti slugging' perks except UB require the killer to hook someone (and the person to get unhooked), or to let people get protection hits in etc.
So yeah, all these perks require that the killer doesn't start out slugging.
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I don't get how you came up to that conclusion.
Could you please do explain me how each of the perks I mentioned require killer to hook anyone to work in a slug situation?
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Ain't that a bad faith question if I ever saw one (seeing you missed the 'etc' bit, on purpose maybe?) ... but fine, I'll humor you:
Unbreakable : One time use, if you get knocked down again, that's it.
Soul Guard: Requires to have been cursed, aka requires a hex totems you're affected by
Tenacity: You crawl faster and recover at the same time. If you have no UB/used it already and no one else can get up, tough luck. So best hope you have then is the killer hooking someone and them unhooking themself
No Mither: Requires that the killer doesn't pick you up. And killers who go for slugging at the start commonly pick up the no mither user and camp them. So, not helpful.
WGLF: Requires acquiring tokens through unhooking, protection hits, etc. not possible without hooking and potential instadowns
For The People: potentially useful, but gives you the broken status for long enough for a killer to go after whom you just picked up and down them again before downing you.
Buckle Up: This one I can give you, but only if you managed to evade the killer for long enough to pick others up
Auto Didact: requires you to get several skillchecks before it becomes useful. a killer out for gamestart slugs won't give you the chance.
and the 'general tip' of spreading out:
only potentially works if someone has UB and FTP or BU AND can get to teammates before the killer can get there.
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Hold up, my slow down perks are to counter gen rushing, my aura perks are to counter stealth, my starstruck agi light born set up is to counter alturistic swf, in what world are perks not used as tools to counter play styles ?.
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Sligging and camping is fine. Until gen times are fixed or something to slow the game down itll be in the game. Until then bring UB or SG.
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Slowdown perks don't counter genrushing, they just slow the game down, info perks don't counter stealth (good stealth players know how to play around all of them, even Whispers), and that last one is irrelevant because you could also just play better.
In all of the above situations, you can actually do something and so can your opponents without ever requiring other perks. The same cannot be said for facecamping, genrushing, mass slugging, or tunneling.
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well, how many playstyles CAN you counter at once with one build?
take for example combo that recently grew in popularity:
corrupt/ruin. unless you have really stubborn survivors, they can use the corrupt duration to find your ruin and then all gen pressure is gone.
let's say you got that combo. let's say you got pop. only works if you hook someone. but everyone's stealthing around and your 4th perk is all ears.
what do you do?
DC?
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Slugging is for killers who can't run chase, pressure gens, or have enough brain cells to juggle or come up with a decent, original build.
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Both of these replies are very silly, you take perks to help you against play styles or situations there are no guarantees.
If "play better" is the answer to play styles then maybe you should play better and not get caught and hit twice to be slugged in the first place.
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I am a Michael main and the only time I have slugged is because survivors got too altruistic. So I don't think Michael was designed to "slug".
The camping Michaels that 99 their T3 just waiting for someone to unhook, sure, I'll give you those, but seeing as that isn't a design choice but rather a player choice, I disagree with that first comment.
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They need to reduce the bleed out timer.
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Wglf too, We'll make it if the person did a recent unhook. Med kits if they have one. Tenacity. Theres all kinds of stuff centered around being slugged.
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