Nemesis zombies are literally worse than ruin undying ( in levels of being annoying)

Maybe something similar to the twins. But the point being is if zombies are near the gen, you can't do much about quickly it in an efficient way, unless you have a pallet nearby, or a flashlight or certain perk mainly head on.

There's plenty of ways to handle zombies. They no longer linger around hooks, and will only be there if the player was just hooked, or if people keep running through the hook area (in which the solution is to stop doing that and lead it away instead of leading it in circles.) With heals, you and the healer can just relocate. The main issue with zombies is gens.

So. Zombie's harassing your gen. The killer is lucky, considering how often they just wander in dead zones doing nothing important. Do you have resources?

-Lead them to a locker and Head On them.

-Blind them with a flashlight.

-Lead them to a pallet and drop it on them.

-Have a teammate get off the gen and lead the zombie away while you repair it.

No resources?

-Play Ring Around the Rosie. Zombies are slow. You can just keep switching to the opposite side of the generator if it's a 4 access point gen and repair while it's catching up.

-Lead the zombie somewhere else, far enough away that it won't pick up on the generator noises and come back. Then return to the gen.

-Just move to a different generator or do a nearby side objective and come back in 20-30 seconds.

That's because you don't see the pressure they cause. Zombies force survivors off of generators, cut off loops, and overall, hinder their abilities. Granted most of it is RNG, but one thing isn't so RNG — survivors who repair a generator for 80 seconds is almost guaranteed to have a zombie push them off. If not, then they are busy with another survivor on a generator. Haven't you noticed a trend that Nemesis players use Ruin for that exact reason? Zombies push survivors off, easy Ruin value for not even being there.

If you want zombies to be more involved in the game, you need to add more counterplay besides consuming valuable resources to temporarily disable them. @Trickstaaaaa gave a perfect example of adding counterplay that's risky, but rewarding if done correctly. Then in turn, we can make zombies better without fear of them being too overwhelming because survivors always have that option to destroy them. Even if skilled survivors get really good at it, they are still wasting time and can mess up, resulting in a hit.

There's only two zombies at any given time so they're really a non-issue for the majority of the game except for Hawkin's and Midwich. Like people have said before there's ways to deal with them, pallets, head on, flashlight, having one person lure it away. The zombies should also stay lethal because well, they're lethal. They aren't going to give you hugs or slap you across the face, they want your brains and by god they're gonna get them. The zombies are already a free sprint burst and infection denial if you play cards right anyway, there's no need to lobotomize them any further given how much they get stuck on geometry too.

They're straight poop literal doodoo butt

Might as well be complaining that furtive chase is OP

You could add 5 zombies, if survivors can juke them and smash them into the ground the literal only time they would be threatening is if nemesis is chasing you.

I will admit I am interested in your parasite variant idea but nemesis already suffers terribly from time inefficiency( 8 free health states is massive), and having to rely on survivors to get your real power is godawful(we already saw this with plague and no corrupt fountains). Also what exactly would make them deadlier? are they faster? smarter? ranged attacks?

The animation lock idea has the same problem as everything else, if nemesis is not around then who cares?

Zombies move at 1 M/S basekit, they are 1/4 of a survivors running speed meaning for every single second holding shift + w it takes a zombie 4 seconds to catch up to you. They also only move in linear lines to survivors, they will never try to take a smarter path or do anything outside of the shortest linear line to noise. It is not hard at all to juke and force them to attack when nemesis is not around. Just draw a diagonal line that barely touches the zombies attack range and run along it, you will probably have a 100% success rate of forcing an attack out and dodging it. Doing it this way even if you 'fail' it will just result in the zombie not attacking you at all.

I think its ridiculous that so many people in this community think that. Anyone who thinks nemesis is a bad killer is probably just bad at killer as far as it sounds. First off, he just feels so fast, i know hes not one of the fastest but hes far from being slow. Second, he has a ranged attack at all, short range at first but its so easy to level up if you're not trash tier at aiming. Third, if you miss the ranged attack somehow at a pallet then you dont just get punished for missing, you still break the pallet and catch up anyway ending a loop. Fourth, if the zombies work well they can camp gens and hooks making it impossible to do gens efficiently or rescues without added risk. Fifth, even if zombies dont get attacks or add pressure they can provide info if you're just a little observant. The second those arms lift I know now where a survivor is without any added perk or ability. Sixth, if you just infect everyone quickly they either now are all vulnerable to whip and zombies or they waste the syringes quickly and since those are limited you get an advantage the second they run out. Hes one of the strongest killers in the game as long as you dont have awful aim and I'm tired of people asking for buffs and thinking hes weak. I dont know the last time I got 3 4ks in a row with any killer without playing cheap. Yet with him my first time playing him I got 8 4ks in a row at rank 1 with no camping, no tunneling, and no slugging.

I like the zombies personally. They could use a buff if anything.

The zombies are not too much for survivors to handle. I've seen how "OP" they are firsthand.

I don't have a problem with the zombies themselves, but I don't enjoy RNG elements to this game. Sure, 80% of the time they don't do anything and cause no problems for you. It's like they don't exist. But that 20% of the time where you're forced off a gen, or they shut down a loop, just by complete chance, is not fun. I would rather go down from being outplayed by the killer, not being unlucky. It's the same logic with Pig's power. Getting it off on the first try is great for you as a survivor, but the worst possible thing for the Pig. It's not really fun for either side, just luck. There is no sense of skill involved with it.

Another quick example is Trapper. I know he sucks and is a terrible killer at the moment, but he's still not fun to verse. At most loops you just have to pray he didn't put a trap to stop it. If he didn't, great, you're looping an M1 killer who does nothing. If not, you go down instantly because he just happened to put a trap there. There are a lot of other factors but that's the basic gist of versing him.

It's why I would really like some sort of Pig trap rework, and for the devs to actually fix the zombie AI so they're not useless most of the time or pressuring survivors off a gen for free while Nemesis is chasing someone else. It's just not fun.

Ruin is a pain in the ass. Zombies are mildly annoying. I’ll take zombies.

Is ruin undying still annoying after the nerf? Zombies are too much RNG to be considered annoying tbh

You're confusing OP and annoying. The zombies are obviously not OP. They are damn annoying though.

Undying Ruin is annoyingly weak. Thats all.

I'm kinda annoyed behavior spent some of nemsis power budget on ai zombies. Imagine if we had got his infamous rocket launcher as a one use payoff when you max out nemsis to tier 3. Or adapted one of his mutations. Made his tier 2 or tier 3 injure on non infected survivors. Obviously they need to change marvins blood because tiering up wise its way to fast.

Zombies have continously disappointed me which is fine I don't think anyone would like to see these zombies actually be good. You could improve the zombie ai but implement the grab sequence anytime the survivor would down so zombies cant down survivors unless they fail a skill check but can pin the survivor. Even then it might just be frustrating anyhow.

I don't agree

Lol

You can easily lure zombies away from gens and then go back to the gen. Once the zombie is far enough away and you have it walking away from the gen, then it will just stay away.

They are largely just good as detection tools for Nemesis, but with the added bonus that they can threaten survivors and force survivors have to spend some time baiting the zombie away.

I had a game where a zombie bugged out and I was able to complete an entire generator in its face. If anything I'd say their AI needs to inprove.

From my experience and perspective on both sides zombies are a minor hinderence especially if the killer aint running max speed and max detection addons they are only somewhat of a threat on indoor maps and completely useless on open maps like red forest you rarely see them and thats without them getting stuck on rocks or trees 90% of the time and good survivors can just easily move around the zombies and juke the hits

I never t-bag but if Nemesis is not near I do t-bag the zombies because..I can.

This I agree with. Nemesis' zombies getting stuck is a problem I rarely have and people worry too much about tentacle hits, which is why they suck with him. he's not top-tier, but he's mid-tier and decent. Y'all are doing it wrong.

What you need to take into consideration is that for every 1 time a zombie puts pressure on a gen there will be a dozen times where the zombies wander in dead zones, get stuck on literally anything, or just not attack a survivor despite them being close enough to touch em. And this combined with the fact that zombies get even worse on bigger maps. Nerfing one of the only situations where zombies are useful would gut nemi.