Stop saying Legion is bad
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He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.
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Can I say he's unfun? Boring? Poorly designed?
Or am I not allowed to want the game to be fun?
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How should he be played?1
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I’ve been using him since he came out, was rank one then their was the reset, I’m already at rank six again, I don’t usually lose, maybe once or twice where I tunneled a survivor I shouldn’t have. Victory doesn’t come to you like with Nurse or Hillbilly, you go to the victory.Blueberry said:He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.
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The way I’ve been using him is with remember me, tunnel the obsession while diverting to other survivors sometimes to slow the game down. The free +30 seconds on exits from your first chase really hurt the survivors, use a mori if you’re not good in chase, mori the obsession then frenzy every chance you can. Susie’s mix tape and stolen sketchbook are god tier for this.KingB said:How should he be played?2 -
Lightweight and urban evasion are complete counters to legion. Get a good distance while he’s stunned, crouton away. As long as you break line of sight, you’re good.Mc_Harty said:@Delfador said:
Sounds fun, great designClearly better then Freddy.
You know, people ######### about the Nightmare but at least he has counterplay.
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@RotBb said:
Lightweight and urban evasion are complete counters to legion. Get a good distance while he’s stunned, crouton away. As long as you break line of sight, you’re good.What's the counterplay against a Legion walking backwards while chasing you?
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Just beat the ######### out of them. If they’re pallet looping, activate frenzy. If they’re running, follow close behind.Mc_Harty said:@RotBb said:
Lightweight and urban evasion are complete counters to legion. Get a good distance while he’s stunned, crouton away. As long as you break line of sight, you’re good.What's the counterplay against a Legion walking backwards while chasing you?
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Mc_Harty said:
@RotBb said:
Lightweight and urban evasion are complete counters to legion. Get a good distance while he’s stunned, crouton away. As long as you break line of sight, you’re good.What's the counterplay against a Legion walking backwards while chasing you?
(Lead him to team mates with flashlights so he's constantly blinded while you heal or chase them)
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Crazy question. Walking backwards, he can't see you, right?Mc_Harty said:@RotBb said:
Lightweight and urban evasion are complete counters to legion. Get a good distance while he’s stunned, crouton away. As long as you break line of sight, you’re good.What's the counterplay against a Legion walking backwards while chasing you?
Or am i missing a killer function?0 -
@Rebel_Raven said:
Crazy question. Walking backwards, he can't see you, right?
Or am i missing a killer function?Yeah its called a blood trail
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The Legion is my favorite killer to play as. However they have a lot of flaws that needs to be dealt with.
1. They move at a speed of 110, and using your power to get across the map punishes you.
2. A injured survivors can take you across the entire map and still make it to the exit gate.
3. You are forced to use your power majority of the time even when you don’t want to. And on top of that you are punished for using it.
4. Once exit gates are open, game over.
Even with all his flaws I still enjoy playing The Legion. I careless about kills. However I don’t like being looped around and force to use my power.
I think the buff that @Janick mention of allowing frenzy to do 3 hits to down a survivor will be good.1 -
I've seen people do 4Ks by now on the highest ranks.
But guess what? Nightmare can do that too.This Killer's just bad in other ways.
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@Mc_Harty said:
@Rebel_Raven said:
Crazy question. Walking backwards, he can't see you, right?
Or am i missing a killer function?Yeah its called a blood trail
LMAO that was great.
Also most legions use bloodhound for just that method. I tried it myself, you have to be really dumb to actually lose the survivor and let them mend themselves.
People think that as long as you win the matches, it is fun to play but it really is not. Even though I win the matches against legion, he is my least favorite killer to play against. I prefer nurse any day.
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@Delfador said:
LMAO that was great.Also most legions use bloodhound for just that method. I tried it myself, you have to be really dumb to actually lose the survivor and let them mend themselves.
People think that as long as you win the matches, it is fun to play but it really is not. Even though I win the matches against legion, he is my least favorite killer to play against. I prefer nurse any day.
Considering how Legions can't rely on scratch marks, bloods all they got really.
And yes, he's least favourite killer to play against also. I'd rather 100 hillbilly matches in a row then Legion.
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Well, he's weaker than most of the killers. I'll explain my reasoning as to why he is weak because you clearly don't see his flaws.RotBb said:He isn’t, he’s good once you can use him, he’s a new playstyle. Nobody is adapting to him like they should, they’re using him like other killers where the killer fits every playstyle. Use him how he should be used and you’ll be fine
Typical Legion Game:
You find a survivor and decide to DW the survivor. Now, you're at a dilemma: Chase the survivor or find nearby survivors with killer instinct.
Scenario #1:
You decided on finding nearby survivors so you can slow down the game. All of the survivors you previously DW'ed except for last survivor you DW'ed will either be finished mending or be in the process of mending. Now that killer instinct expired, all you have now is your 110% movement speed to down the survivor or wait until Frenzy is charged enough to get another stab in (also let's not forget you need to stab the survivor four times to down them). About time you down the survivor, you have wasted more time than what time you wasted for the survivors depending on the chase. This means you're hoping survivors don't do generators to punish you for wasting time which is extremely bad.
Scenario #2:
You decided on chasing the survivor instead of going after multiple survivors. Well this is a equally as worse as scenario #1 as you will waste just as much time. However, this scenario can cause you to get a hook faster and can start momentum early but this is very inefficient because again to down a survivor... "Now that killer instinct expired, all you have now is your 110% movement speed to down the survivor or wait until Frenzy is charged enough to get another stab in (also let's not forget you need to stab the survivor four times to down them)."
Overall, you're at the disadvantage the moment when you click on the Legion.4 -
@Nickenzie said:
RotBb said:He isn’t, he’s good once you can use him, he’s a new playstyle. Nobody is adapting to him like they should, they’re using him like other killers where the killer fits every playstyle. Use him how he should be used and you’ll be fine
Well, he's weaker than most of the killers. I'll explain my reasoning as to why he is weak because you clearly don't see his flaws.
Typical Legion Game:
You find a survivor and decide to DW the survivor. Now, you're at a dilemma: Chase the survivor or find nearby survivors with killer instinct.Scenario #1:
You decided on finding nearby survivors so you can slow down the game. All of the survivors you previously DW'ed except for last survivor you DW'ed will either be finished mending or be in the process of mending. Now that killer instinct expired, all you have now is your 110% movement speed to down the survivor or wait until Frenzy is charged enough to get another stab in (also let's not forget you need to stab the survivor four times to down them). About time you down the survivor, you have wasted more time than what time you wasted for the survivors depending on the chase. This means you're hoping survivors don't do generators to punish you for wasting time which is extremely bad.Scenario #2:
You decided on chasing the survivor instead of going after multiple survivors. Well this is a equally as worse as scenario #1 as you will waste just as much time. However, this scenario can cause you to get a hook faster and can start momentum early but this is very inefficient because again to down a survivor... "Now that killer instinct expired, all you have now is your 110% movement speed to down the survivor or wait until Frenzy is charged enough to get another stab in (also let's not forget you need to stab the survivor four times to down them)."Overall, you're at the disadvantage the moment when you click on the Legion.
Except with Frank's Mixtape. Legion also has no counterplay, the only one being trying to stealth against them, but if the killer is good they will not lose you.
Overall Legion is just bad designed in every aspect, he is unfun to play and unfun to play against.
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Was rank 1 too when he came out and I expected to get stomped on. But I had real fun, and the bad matches I got 2 kills. If you dont count a few losses to well oiled swf, but as in every game, some people will always be better than you, thats life.RotBb said:
I’ve been using him since he came out, was rank one then their was the reset, I’m already at rank six again, I don’t usually lose, maybe once or twice where I tunneled a survivor I shouldn’t have. Victory doesn’t come to you like with Nurse or Hillbilly, you go to the victory.Blueberry said:He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.
I have p3'd them now and are back at rank 5. So I agree with you, because I love them. Just had to change my playstyle completely, and it was fun.
But I play survivor too half the time, and at first, when I faced legion, he/she got wrecked. It was a sure escape for all. But this weekend, I have met a few legions that have got mostly 3k but even 4k. They have shown tactics that I never even thought about when I play Frank.
So maybe, just maybe, the legion is trash for some people, and fun for some. But thats the case for all the killers, only the legion takes a bit more adjusting, and you have to be willing to put the effort in. Legion and spirit are the only ones I play atm, and both were trashed in the ptb.2 -
Doesn’t P3 give you Joey and Susie?AmorePrincess said:
Was rank 1 too when he came out and I expected to get stomped on. But I had real fun, and the bad matches I got 2 kills. If you dont count a few losses to well oiled swf, but as in every game, some people will always be better than you, thats life.RotBb said:
I’ve been using him since he came out, was rank one then their was the reset, I’m already at rank six again, I don’t usually lose, maybe once or twice where I tunneled a survivor I shouldn’t have. Victory doesn’t come to you like with Nurse or Hillbilly, you go to the victory.Blueberry said:He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.
I have p3'd them now and are back at rank 5. So I agree with you, because I love them. Just had to change my playstyle completely, and it was fun.
But I play survivor too half the time, and at first, when I faced legion, he/she got wrecked. It was a sure escape for all. But this weekend, I have met a few legions that have got mostly 3k but even 4k. They have shown tactics that I never even thought about when I play Frank.
So maybe, just maybe, the legion is trash for some people, and fun for some. But thats the case for all the killers, only the legion takes a bit more adjusting, and you have to be willing to put the effort in. Legion and spirit are the only ones I play atm, and both were trashed in the ptb.
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He's not bad, it's just that he's underwhelming compared to others. Even when you play him how you're supposed to, you don't really put that much pressure on the survivors especially if they're all split up. I like him but he's unfun to play against and frustrating to play as. Kinda similar to Freddy in those aspects.
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@Blueberry said:
He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.I agree. Survivors already know how to play against him, and he wasn't powerful in the first place.
All you need to do is spread, only 1 surv per gen, not heal yourself, and the gen rush he get is the most disgusting you will ever face.
Sadly he is the worst killer the devs made, unplayable in high ranks. Freddy is nurse tier compared to him.
With a decent Freddy build you can manage things and have fun. But this killer don't benefit well from any perk, because he lacks power heavily.
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@Irisora said:
@Blueberry said:
He's only good against low ranks or bad survivors. Against good survivors he is trash and quite easily bullied.I agree. Survivors already know how to play against him, and he wasn't powerful in the first place.
All you need to do is spread, only 1 surv per gen, not heal yourself, and the gen rush he get is the most disgusting you will ever face.
Sadly he is the worst killer the devs made, unplayable in high ranks. Freddy is nurse tier compared to him.
With a decent Freddy build you can manage things and have fun. But this killer don't benefit well from any perk, because he lacks power heavily.
What's even more awkward is that his most effective way of downing someone is walking backwards for the Deep Wounds bleed out...a cheese mechanic..lol
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Legion's problem is actually his add-ons.
He has redundancy. And a lot of it.
ie:
He has 2 purples that make him 3 hit in frenzyHe has one add-on that reduces the charge time of his frenzy...
...And another that reduces it's cooldown.
He has a red add-on that's god tier on Wraith, but useless on him. (he has to stun himself to figure out which gen is being worked on/ what the gen's healths are. If you don't know, I'm talking about the Fuming Mix-tape)
Then he has add-ons that lower the frenzy you lose from normal attacks. This one actually has me confused as to "why does this exist?"
This redundancy and otherwise bad add-ons really hurt his viability. If they cleaned them up, and gave him more utility, he would be much more useful.
I do however think he's Grade B. Probably B-. I use him fine at rank 1. Really sweaty try-hard SWF groups will give him a problem. But they are a problem themselves. So argue that point all you want.
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clicking the button * Play survivor* Already makes you win against Legion provided your not a potato.
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You're wrong, he's incredibly bad. Almost all matches that I have against Legion 3 ppl escapes (the other one didn't 'cause or he was tunneled or NOED or Rancor). Also it's so annoying, makes you wasting time mending and makes matches longer and boring. He's not fun, go against him either although beat him is easy and not viable in higher ranks.RotBb said:He isn’t, he’s good once you can use him, he’s a new playstyle. Nobody is adapting to him like they should, they’re using him like other killers where the killer fits every playstyle. Use him how he should be used and you’ll be fine
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I personally don't find Legion as weak as people say them to be. They definitely aren't top tier but "Freddy tier killer"? Nah. (Even Freddy ain't that bad)
I usually run Monitor & Abuse and Stridor as Legion since those perks are very useful for their playstyle.
The way I play them, I stab the first person I see with the power, if I see anyone else after that, I go after them. If not, I stab the first person again.
No matter how the first step went, I kinda "let them go" so that their timer goes a bit lower, and then try to track the Deep Wounded survivor(s) without the power. Stridor makes this quite easy (unless the survivor(s) are running Iron Will), and Monitor and Abuse makes it easier to actually surprise and hit them when you do locate them.
If a Deep Wounded survivor starts to loop me or something, then I just simply use the power and hit them again. At this point, the timer should be so low that any hit, with or without the power should down them.
If you apply pressure with the deep wound properly, you won't get gen rushed either.
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I haven't gotten below a 3K with Legion since I got them. I find it really easy to down survivors, and I like the utility of their power.
The way I play: Find a survivor, frenzy and stab them. Take a quick look around, if there's another survivor nearby (as in an achievable distance), I got for them, stab and repeat. When there are no more survivors nearby, I continue chasing the last survivor I hit in frenzy. I do NOT hit them a second time, as it gives the survivor a speed boost along with my stun. Instead I use my speed to catch up right behind them, and then I leave frenzy, taking the stun while keeping my eye on them. The stun doesn't last long and doesn't disorient too much, so I catch up fairly quickly with my 110% move speed. One regular attack, and they're down.
During this chase (which doesn't actually last too long), the other players have been mending, and not been working on gens. Sure the mending may not have taken too long to finish, but it helps. In the end, I rarely "lose" a chase, unless I decide to change targets along the way, or i I occasionally mess up. I can use my frenzy to end looping, as I simply jump over thrown pallets, take the stun and resume the chase, and I am rarely forced to break pallets, as survivors usually panic when you come flying over those things, and leave the loop.
Another bonus of the Legion, is that survivors rarely bother to heal, as they always expect you to hit them in frenzy. That just further shortens my chases, as I don't hit injured survivors in frenzy, unless I suspect others are nearby, but simply use it to shorten my distance to them. Again, the stun really isn't that bad, and the fact that you can often maintain line of sight, makes catching fairly simple.
Long story short, I use frenzy as a tool and not a weapon, and I have had great success with this. I constantly assess whether I should use frenzy against a survivor based on their health state, their distance from me and whether there might be others around.
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Legion IS bad.
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@RotBb said:
The way I’ve been using him is with remember me, tunnel the obsessionI really like Remember Me on my Freddy, but isn't the necessity of Remember Me a sign that Legion isn't a strong killer? Imho it means that the killer is not strong enough to get kills before all gens are done.
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