Whats up with wraiths being super toxic lately?
Title. Im sure we've all noticed the pretty stark increase in the amount of exceptionally toxic wraiths, hard tunelling, bm'ing repeatedly, face camping, etc etc. Just all around being huge jerks. But why is this? Wraiths used to be one of the chillest killers in this game, before his recent rework. I could always trust a wraith to make sure everybody had fun while still trying their best to win, it was great. But recent wraiths just don't do that, they try REALLY hard to make sure nobody but them has fun and seemingly profit off the misery of others. What happened to wraith players? What made them suddenly so hostile and mean to other players?
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Most wraiths already used to camp and tunnel even before the buff. Not only he's boring to go against, most of their playstyle just makes it a zzzzz fest
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All Freddy mains and Spirit mains switched to Wraith, that's what happened
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Wraiths have always been like that even before the buff. The few killers I couldn't trust to not bm me on hooks were, and still are, wraiths, bubbas, & pigs.
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I've never really seen toxic wraiths. Definitely Trappers, hags, onis, spirits, nurses, freddys, and everything in between. But rarely if ever have I seen a toxic wraith, plague or pig.
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Wraiths are always hard tunneling and bming on hook for no reason, as far as I remember. Nothing new
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Spirit bugged to the point of being almost unplayable. Freddy’s crutch slowdown addons removed. A free easy to play killer finally becomes viable. And here we are now.
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I haven´t noticed a difference in their playstyle. Maybe its a regional thing.
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The wraiths are huge a-holes for sure, with some occasional exceptions. The ones running with the hoodied outfit are usually the worst in my experience.
This is completely true.
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hard agree. The hooded wraiths are actually unbearable, i don't think i've ever seen a wraith that wears that cosmetic thats kindly. I imagine because its incredibly edgy and attracts that crowd. Funnily enough i've noticed tuxedo wraiths are usually pretty classy (sometimes)
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Wraith got buffed a month or so back. He's now incredibly cheap, gets easy hits, suffers no cooldown on any of his powers, and takes almost no skill whatsoever to use. People started figuring that out and now they use and abuse him constantly. Ask a killer main though and you'll hear that it's the survivors' fault, they just need to play better and are salty that they can't "bully him" anymore. "He's fine, he's C-tier".
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I’d put wraith in high B tier probably. He still gets absolutely dominated by windows.
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If you happen to be near one, yes, sometimes. That's just it - I've seen some people say "he's not too bad if you're near windows and loops", and the people who say that in a way that's polite (such as yourself) obviously mean well, but the thing I don't understand is why anyone assumes that the player is always near a good loop or window. If that were the case wouldn't survivors be decimating every killer in this game? There are gens (and totems, and hooks) that are all over the place - in relative dead zones, in corners, etc. - but the argument always boils down to conditional factors that aren't always in the player's control. "Be by windows and loops, always have a flashlight, and always run Spine Chill". People should really have to have a Wraith preparedness kit just to balance out how cheap he is? That tells me that there's a problem with the character's kit.
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Me, who uses that cosmetic because I thought it looks cool
Wait a second-
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I thought I was the only one. They just act so bitter and toxic. Most of the time they hit people on hook and bm with his bell all the time.
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The way I personally see it is that since wraith has to get 2 hits to down. Even if he ambushed you in a bad spot as long as you don’t get grabbed you should have time to make it to something. And (unless he’s using all seeing blood. Which does need a nerf) once he gets that first hit his power does almost nothing for him besides making him catch up to you faster. While yes there certainly will be some situations where the time it takes for him to catch up and uncloak isn’t enough time for you to make it to anything. It’s usually due to either resources being wasted or extremely bad positioning. And while that does admittedly sometimes feel cheap. When you take into consideration that his weakness turns him into an m1 killer with no power I think it balances things out. Is wraith kinda boring? Yeah. Does he need any changes? Besides all seeing blood, I would say no.
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My opinion is that too many people place too much emphasis on the fact that he's an M1 killer. They make it sound as though just because he doesn't have a special attack that can shoot lasers or something he's inherently "weak". I see the same argument used for other killers as well. When was it decided that just because a character doesn't have a long-range instant down power it means that they suck?
Again, I'm not targeting you specifically. These are just arguments I hear from so many people so often. Like the inability to catch up, for example. I've never had trouble catching up with anyone as Wraith, especially since his buff. Take a circular route around the target so they can't see the blur, flank them from about ten feet away, uncloak get the free super lunge hit, then as soon as you're able just cloak again, race right up to them, uncloak, hit them for the down. This has happened literally every time I've ever tried it, though it's certainly worth noting that I don't even like PLAYING as the Wraith. I feel too guilty and I'm sick of the DCs. So I can only rely on my own anecdotal experience.
Honestly, if the speed and / or distance of his post-cloak lunge was reduced, and if his ability to cloak and uncloak silently was removed, I wouldn't have that much of a problem with him. He'd still have his abilities, people just wouldn't be able to exploit them so easily. To me it's obvious that he was given his bell as a tell to let players know when he was uncloaking and thus time to run. Why turn around and remove it? Why also give the guy a massive lunge that can be executed basically the second he phases into view (which also seems faster than it used to be)?
I'm fine with going against just about any killer in this game. I accept my losses and acknowledge my own shortcomings. But when there's a killer who - let's face it, has a very strong chance of doing damage before you even know who you're up against and where they might be - that's just not fun. At all. Wraith may be more "balanced" in terms of what he's like against other killers, or his former self, but he's not balanced in terms of survivor counterplay. That's the problem I have with him.
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He is annoying as can get. But pretty much what you said can be applied to any killer lol.
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Don't worry, i use it too sometimes lol. Not all of us are bad. Stereotypes are mostly second hand
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Silent bell is an entirely different beast than basekit wraith. And I’m not totally against possible changes to it. As for what those changes could be outside of removing it idk. And when it comes to his lunge they could try to see how it feels if instead of the speed of the lunges stacking it just increases the distance. But it would need to be tested before I could say anything for certain. I’m not a person who is like “I will quit this game if they nerf wraith he’s perfect don’t touch him blah blah blah” because I think we both agree wraith can become dull. (Even tho admittedly I main him and love him). Anyway, addons and lunge SPEED could be looked at since I feel some of his addons were only kept in check due to windstorm reliance. But I do still think wraith has a decent enough amount of counterplay if we look at just his basekit.
Post edited by Thr_ust on0 -
In my exp wraiths (and other stealth killers) tend to camp more in low ranks as it works out for them quite often. Expect NOED aswell.
This never really changed since beta. Playstyles or builds can't be toxic tho, intensions are. The only "toxic" thing a killer can do is beating someone on the hook or let them all bleed out on the floor. The entity doesn't like that aswell and most likely you won't rank up, and i agree.
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WHATS UP WITH PLAYERS
WRAITHSBEING SUPER TOXICLATELY?I fixed the title for you.
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Because he has invisibility when he stands still in front of or beside a hook. His power is made for toxicity. Just like Leatherface and Hag are perfect for basement toxicity.
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Face Camping only really happens in low ranks from around rank 20 - rank 13 but overall Wraith is a fun killer to go against if you get a good one. I'm a Wraith main and I don't camp I also go out of my way to not tunnel (unless you sit Self Caring sabotaging your entire team). Also I'm a hooded Wraith and I'm also not toxic the only time I will ever be toxic is if someone t-bags (and then dies in 5 seconds), someone Self Cares or if someone literally sits Urban Evasioning around the map and this is all because I'm a Survivor Main and these things cause me pain to see. Also when I say toxic I mean the occasional head nod and most people don't even care, if you get angry because someone outplayed you when you were doing something bad that's your fault nobody else's.
When it comes to the lunge which everyone complains about please remember that his lunge is literally his power otherwise he's just an M1 killer that can get cheeky hits on people then get obliterated in chase. You want advise on countering the cloak? Flashlights, Pallet Stunning, longer loops and good mind games.
The Silent Bell is an Iridescent Add-On so it's going to be good and it doesn't need nerfing because you can still hear and see the Wraith while cloaked as he makes slight audio cues uncloaking even with Silent Bell and obviously you can see him.
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Man, I'm glad to see someone else notice this- I've been saying it for a hot minute, and I swear I felt like I was the only person who was getting only toxic Wraiths lol. I remember back before Wraith had started getting his more recent changes, there were some chill ones, even if they were rare, but I agree that after his buff it's only gotten worse.
Imho, I think it's a mix of a few things- he's an easy, free Killer who has some really strong add-ons, and a lot of potential for builds that, again, have the potential to shut down chase. (AKA: Hit and Run Wraith- which relies on the lack of communication in a lot of pubs matches to do really well. Mix that with things like Silent Bell and All-Seeing, and he can do really well against pubs.) Mix this with other similar Killers facing nerfs (Stridor being nerfed on Spirit, and Freddy getting his slowdown add-ons and other parts of his kit nerfed), with long-time Wraith players having faced a lot of crap over the years for being one of the weaker Killers in the roster, and people are just using it to be really nasty. (No matter the circumstance- I can't tell you how many times a Wraith will close hatch in my face or hit me on hook because I did the dastardly deed of daring to load into a game of Dead by Daylight. What can I say? Life of crime.)
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Probably just a response to people being super mean to wraiths for absolutely no reason
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Yes
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From my experience Wraith players have always been like that.
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Because he slows down when he starts uncloaking, he can't deal with windows, he can be flashlight burned. He's not Nurse or Spirit. That's why he's overrated.
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He's a decent yet easy killer, and some of the few questionable solo queue players (not all) have no idea how to play against him. Those players tend to play immersed (Wraith is amazing at finding survivors) or make the dumbest mistakes against him. It's kinda like Freddy.
Freddy is still stronger than Wraith, they just moved onto Wraith because he's much easier.
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lol
thanks god no 1 use myers no more !
god how he make our day so sad ;(
only myers main think they would have fun keep getting 4k
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Spirits are more toxic
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Define what you call counterplay.
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I've noticed a lot of Killers just not giving a ######### anymore, and to be honest it was gonna happen at some point. You can only kick someone while they are down so many times till they just stop caring about your fun and your made up rules.
Heck I don't even open the chat anymore, and stopped giving hatch. Too many times have I given hatch, and had some player get upset I gave the hatch to someone else who "didn't deserve it" or gave them the hatch, and that somehow marks me as a bad player.
Survivors should have learned "check yo self before you wreck yo self".
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Well, as a Wraith main, I find it hard to not do anything survivors find frustrating. No, I can’t control that my “proxy camping” range is like 15x bigger than everyone else’s because of my move speed. Relatively, I’m not ignoring a free second down. I can’t control that people are predictable, or that survivors can’t handle un/restealth fake outs and mind games, just like I can’t control getting highly coordinated SWFs that force me to camp so I don’t have a 3 minute game and no kills, but somehow stopping that is camping and tunneling.
At the end of the day, be mad. I’m here for my enjoyment, and I’ve given up playing “fair” because the definition changes literally from game to game.
[edit]
Sometimes the definition change swings wildly, too. Like I've had groups that bring maps complain that I don't use hexes.
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“Chillest killers”? That’s typically survivor lingo for saying “this killer is easy to loop/bully, therefore they’re fun to face”. He needed buffs because he was in a much weaker state than a lot of the cast, fact. Maybe BHVR should have nerfed some add-ons but he definitely needed more power.
Maybe you’re encountering some players who are just savoring their power trip, but those players will probably be like that with any killer - not just Wraith.
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The ability to defend yourself or respond in a reliable manner commensurate to the threat.
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I haven't seen a toxic wraith ever.
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Eh, I kind of enjoy hamming it up as Wraith. I usually do not BM too much as other killers. Plague is the one I go ballistic with. I just love vomiting on survivors. But I embrace Wraith as a nice outlit to vent my frustrstions out on survivors. Plague, I usually throw just to vomit on people... So the energy is kind of different.
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For real.
If Wraith were to be described to someone, y'all perfectly did it.
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I have a theory: all the survivor mains who hate playing against Wraith are using him to face camp and tunnel in the hopes that he’ll get nerfed
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I’m just saying that someone who BMs as Wraith is usually someone who will BM as another character, so it’s not a Wraith problem.
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