What would be the solution to swf that most could agree on?
Buffing solos and killers? How do you buff solo without buffing swf?
Would this ever be possible to achieve?
Please don't suggest debuffing or indicators or straight up deletion of swf. That is not something most will agree on.
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Maybe just add in game voice chat for survivors. That's what VHS is doing.
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Solo just needs some things to bring them closer to swf. Most importantly imo:
Kindred Base. Totem Counter as part of the HUD. Maybe a 50m Bond base. Portrait icons that display what a player is doing at any given time.
In case that ever happens, most killers would obviously need buffs even more than they currently do. I´d suggest to lower basic attack CD by 0.3-0.4 seconds, speeding up vaulting and pallet breaking by 10% and giving a sizeable buff to base regression (could go with some gen-regression perk nerfs).
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I wouldn't use voice chat myself. No disrespect to anyone on this forum (and I mean that, I have no personal grudge against anyone here) but as a whole, this community is not something I'd want coming through my headset every day.
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They need to invest time into better solo player perks, be it for solo survivors or anti swf perks.
Perks like Discordance is a great example of anti swf. Maybe aim at killer perks dedicated to forcing people to stay away from one another. Perks that maybe cause Blindness when near other survivors.
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Which is why the suggestion of built-in voice comms is usually shot down. We all know what this community is capable of, and I'm not in the mood to be called slurs in either language I know them in
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First off, why would solo need a buff?
Most of my gripes against solo has nothing to do with swf "advantages". Nothing to do with coordination.
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Debuff.
Yeah you said not to but be fair, you're knowingly grouping up to get com advantage over solo. While you dont need to be mega military callous its certainly not hard to say "on me" "hex on hill" "hes going middle" easy callous, plus you can call out perks like bamboozle etc. Which as a surprise can be hits and downs if not expected.
Debuff doesnt have to be alot, just a small % to healing and repairing. At most it adds a few seconds to each gen. Everyone is stronger and more efficient on comms, plus you choose your team and know their perks.
Either that or pair an average mmr swf of 1000 vs a 1500 or something, so they verse harder/better killers
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You put comms in this game for Solo que, and it’ll open Pandora’s box….
Roblox…Minecraft…Fortnite….
I’m starting to think the community can’t handle the truth…should’ve been figured out already.
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Yeah I mean I can understand the desire for it, I just don't have the faith that it would work out (for pretty much the exact reason you said). I couldn't stand listening to 13 year-old children shouting slurs and making garbled remarks against the backdrop of overly loud tinny hip-hop music in games that DIDN'T have a super toxic community.
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Honestly, just buff solo queue to SWF level by granting everyone comms, and you'll have free reign to buff Killers to match.
Since SWF won't matter one bit with open comms for Survivors, Killers across the board will be much more viable to get buffs.
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I like the suggestion about info solo buff (like kindred base) since that wouldn't give swf that more of an advantage. And some of the killer buffs feng mentioned.
Not a fan of voice chat. That would probably make me stop playing surv even if I could disable it since I would feel like I am hindrance to the team.
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Get rid of SWF. It's the only solution because it's the only way to assure comms are out of play.
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Iron out MMR so Killers and survivors can be buffed/nerfed accordingly.
the ability for survivor to see each other's perk at pre game lobby (i'm guessing BHVR didnt impliment it because they want to avoid "no mither dodges" or "Meta or dodge" situation)
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Solo q unfortunately will never be as good as swf but we can try to shorten the gap. Buffing solo q by giving them kindred basekit and a totem counter would be a good start.
For killer I feel like some sort of mobility would be an amazing change. Something that will allow the killer to traverse the entire map. Certain killers would probably need adjusted after this but I think overall it would be better.
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When I play with crossplay off I can basically add console teammates as friends and make party chat with them. That wouldn't stop people from using comms.
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As many of u said, reduce the gap solo - SWF would be a first step. Chat comms system and totem counter on HUD could be a start. After that, buff weaker killers.
That't be a start to balance the game. Still, there is one thing should be done about current metagame. If solo is buffed that way, solo players will be able to hand camp tunnel more efficiently. And will maximize gen repair.
Devs have to do something about gen rush and camp tunnel. Those unfun strats can't be the optimal plays if we pretend have a good time in game.
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To buff solo without buffing swf? Add voice chat, basically.
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So you admit to being a cheater?
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Voice comms like in the vast majority of multiplayer games would be great. Just make them optional.
That doesn’t really solve the SWF issue though as this game is designed around a lack of communication. SWF bypass a bunch of the intended game mechanics and you can’t really solve that unless you make it impossible to use comms somehow.
A debuff for SWF is the only viable thing I can think of at the moment.
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Let the killer see who is queued up together (I know you said no indicators but this would really help some killers to avoid a bad time occasionally), and maybe just add an icon wheel for survivors, so it doesn't require a headset as not every teammate will have one. This will allow you to just pull up an icon by your survivor picture possibly saying what you are doing or going to do. This would greatly help with solo queue without buffing SWF. Even some form of kindred as base would greatly help solo without making SWF stronger.
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Cheating how?
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I said what is possible not that I am doing it.
Also do you even know that devs themselves said comms are not cheating?
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Remove it. The game is clearly not balanced around SWFs
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Telling players in the end game screen if there was a SWF or not. Not who was in a SWF, but if there was one and maybe how many.
It's important information for the Killer to know, and can use it to become better at the game or have closure on why the game was so terrible for them.
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make a swf only mode, or only put swf in kyf since people just wanna play with their friends right? Not pubstomping random noobs with their buddies. Game is more balanced around solo more than swf tbh. But that will never happen, survivors mains will get salty and ######### and you can’t loose milking their moms credit card with them $30 dollar new cosmetics they happen to sale almost every day.
what I’m saying is survivor mains is the main source of income, they will never balance the game even if literally no one play killer. They will secretly just add bots lol
Post edited by Mandy on0 -
VHS' win state is killing the killer, if that gives you a frame of reference for how much it has in common with DBD.
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No, they need to stop bandaiding things with perks and actually fix the fundamental problems with the game.
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Horrible solution. Why punish people for wanting to play with friends?
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You can't. People want to play with their friends and they have a right to. We just need to close the gap between solo and SWF so that killers can be buffed appropriately. If there's a new strong killer add-on idea being thrown around by the dev team, they won't implement it if they think SWF can deal with it but solo can't.
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Base Kindred. Debuffing SWF isn't going to help; they'll just run perks/items to counteract the debuff.
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I’ll never understand why so many people have such a boner for removing SWF. Just say you have no friends to play with and leave.
Playing in a SWF doesn’t automatically make you a good player. If you take 4 ‘bad’ players and put them in a party together with mics, they won’t play any better. The only advantage you really have is being able to tell people where totems are etc. That’s it. Me speaking to my friend on mic doesn’t improve my ability to loop the killer / waste their time, repair generators, save people before struggle state etc. They’re all things I learnt by myself by playing the game a lot.
Half the time when I play with my friend we’re not even talking about DBD related things. We play together as a way to hang out / bond. I’m constantly saying “God I wasn’t even concentrating that match” and we’ll still both escape as we’re competent players. Last night I played mostly off mic and guess what? We still escaped the majority of our matches as we don’t need to be on mic to play well / have game sense.
If you take 4 strong survivors and throw them in a SWF without the ability to communicate on mic, they will still be a hard team for the killer to face and 9/10 they’re still going to ‘win’ - like I said earlier, the ability to verbalise things isn’t what makes killers lose matches. I’ve played in solo queues before where I’ve been matched with strong survivors and we all knew how to loop / split up on gens. I know for a fact the killer would have thought we were a SWF. As apparently that’s the only way people can lose nowadays.
The amount of TTV streams I’ve been part of and had the streamer calling my lobby of randoms a ‘SWF’ is hilarious. Let’s face it, if they ever removed the ability to play with friends (which they won’t) people will just find something else to complain about. Some people just can’t accept losing in a game.
If you’re losing against genuine SWF players a lot, it’s probably because individually they’re all good players. They’re not being granted special superpowers by playing on mic. 💁🏻♂️
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perks are band aide fixes, we need base kit buffs/changes to both solo and killer... and this most likely wont happen without having a portion of the community flipping out because they think "their being punished!!!" when the other 2 ways to play are trash compared too SWF.
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We need to give solo more info, but maybe the devs think its bad for the immersion. Like anyone is scared playing dbd after the first hours.
- Survivor should see the loadout of their teammates before the match.
- Totem counter, Base kindred (without killer aura), Survivor status in hud (in chase, on a gen, etc.)
But if we really want to get close to competent swf, you need more drastic things:
- Pinging the killer, gen (with progress), totems, exit. Pings would dissapear after 3 sec.
- perks callout for the entire team (Ruin indicator, sloppy etc), Callouts for every perk added.
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Just a note next to the player's icon would do it for me:
- Repairing a gen
- Healing
- In a chase
- Teabagging
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Bringing coms in game is terrible idea cause gamers will use it to win and coop which is fine, BUT more casual players will end up crying and provoking each other so most of the players will just play muted.
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The devs decide what is/isn't cheating and they have explicitly said this is allowed, so
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Casual mode and ranked mode.
Casual mode = no swf
Ranked mode = no holds barred
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Honestly, I don't want a buff for solo queue, I like the challenge, that's the purpose of the game. What I don't like is the the misery of bloodpoints.
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Duo only in ranked kyr free for all.
Or give killers a movement boost or more % dmg to gens on kicks
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Realistically speaking? Nothing. There's no such thing as buff or nerf that wouldn't hurt solo in the process. Also to the people suggesting making Kindred base kits honestly have no idea what they're talking about. It'll just make SWF twice as efficient since you can have a clear vision on what generators are getting worked on and whatever. Believe it or not but most SWF are not speaking in military comms or have the teamwork to work like they're in one body but Kindred base kit would help that.
Only thing they could do is the killer having an idea how much is in the team and let him be able to change the killer he wants in lobby.
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Kindred (without killer reveal), totem counter, icons what survivor is doing sure, but Bond definetly not.
Bond is not information that is easy to share, so that would be buff for SWF too. You would never bring killer to friends working on gens, protective hits would be easy etc.
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- Quick message system
- Ping system
- Voicechat
Those are the options to close the solo-comms gap. Anyone suggesting stuff that currently even cwf has no access to is just asking for flat survivor buffs that will help swf more than "solo". No UI additions, no permanent aura reading.
Also, Killer basekit compensation for the risen base survivor potential. Im talking stuff all killers have access to: regression, grab mechanics (grab healthy survs for example), better fov, etc...
Killer specific ability changes should be considered for the killer tier gap or tier removal .
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Why punish killers for you wanting to play with your friends?
You can play with your friends all you like in KYF option.
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A real issue here is the vast majority of killers struggle playing fairly against a 3 or 4 man swf. If you buff Solo without buffing killers, Killers are at an even bigger disadvantage. Voice comms must never be allowed in the current state. Only if killers were buffed immensely would i condone VC, and even then its a touchy subject cause maybe someone doesnt want to join, maybe someone doesnt want to talk, maybe someone doesnt want to listen to some sweaty bellend shouting obscenities down the mic because you went down after 30 seconds of looping instead of 35. Which will only fuel disconnections and cause more problems.
Kindred Baseline for everyone, Its not a powerful perk. Maybe change it to just give a notification instead of an aura of the killer when the killer is within 16 meters of the hook.
I would be for debuffing SWF tbf. I know people love it but personally i get bored when im in a 4 stack cause 9 times out of 10 ill survive and have sod all to do all game but press M1 on a gen or M1 on a totem.
For SWF, reduce the number of perk slots per member of the team.
For 2 people, they get 3 perks each
For a 3 man swf, they get 2 perks each
For a 4 man swf they each get 1 perk, or 2 perks and no offering/addon slot.
Id find that a lot better and challenging, and more strategy would go into a 4 stack. Right now u see 4 stacks running the same meta. Well, now each will have to define a role. I know this will never happen, but id have so much fun as a survivor in a 4 stack if it did.
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I know that.
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Just give players a communication menu just like overwatch. It’s simple as hell and doesn’t benefit any swf since they can just call out every action with their voices
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...what?
I'm literally a killer main, and I 100% assure you that most SWFs are chill people trying to have fun playing with each other as survivor. Also, not everyone has 5 people in total.
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Give both sides a dedicated aura perk slot (pick from a small list like BBQ, Bitter Murmur, Bond, Kindred, Better Together). This way solos can slot Bond/Kindred without losing anything else. It will be a slight buff to SWFs but they already use voice chat to locate each other and usually forego it anyway.
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