General Discussions
General Discussions
Wraith = Weak or good?
I feel like he is still weak. I mean it could be because I play him badly but he can still be easy looped (I don't play add-ons or good add-ons on him). I mean mainly base kit. Also that 0.25s shorter speed boost after uncloaking kinda hurt him. I can feel it on short loops as well.
Comments
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He is the second weakest killer in the game after Trickster. Just imagine a killer whose power can just be disabled by a single flashlight.
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Trickster is no longer the worst killer. I wouldn't even say he is bottom tier killer. He is decent now after his many changes.
And I feel like flashlight is not the real problem here for me.
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After the nerf, he is more of a gimmick than an actual killer.
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I wouldn't really call him weak but he isn't really good either.
I'm going to go with geak
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He actually used to be decent, but I just have no idea why they nerfed his base-kit.
I used to main him and he was fun to play, but that nerf and mainly boons destroyed him. He is just not a killer that can commit to every chase.
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That nerf rly hurt him in short to medium loops. Survivors can now make it to the pallet or window before you can unclock and get to them (at least without add-ons). The nerf for base kit was bad move imo.
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Yeah, I understand that add-on nerf, but his lunge was best thing about him and reason to play him.
It's kinda sad that they thought it's good idea to nerf him in same patch where they add perk that is going to be direct counter to his play-style...
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The nerf brought him down from low B tier to mid-high C tier. His already meh chase was obliterated with the old uncloak boost combined with the nerfed uncloak movement speed. With boon totems, hit & run Wraith isn't as good as survivors can just heal themselves at the totem, and Wraith's chase is just horrible now.
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I would kinda understand if it was made in different patches, but it was in same patch.
Perk that counters hit&run and nerf that makes it harder for Wraith to commit...
Someone is really bad at Theory-crafting in DBD Balance team
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I thought Wraith was better before or I was playing him badly because many people were saying he is good now and I even faced Wraiths who did well (with good add-ons usualy). But now I feel like when I play him I am just getting looped like any other M1 killer without power. His power is now usefull only for catching up or map travel (sometimes you can do sneaky attack if they don't expect you). But you can't rly use it in chase most of the time.
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The thing is, Wraith wasn't A-tier or powerful at all, he was decent at best. He was, simply put, a noob stomper.
He still has his outstanding mobility and W meta counter, but he's forced to run most loops an M1 killer.
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He was weak, then good, then they made him weak again. It was good while it lasted.
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Simply put it was probably like this, yes.
For years one of the weakest killers, then for some months decent killer and now again on the weaker side (not bad as he used to be originaly of course but still weaker).
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He's not in a good place right now. He ranks among the lowest of the low currently. Even when he was "a tad bit overpowered" according to BHVR, anyone who actually played the game knew he was mediocre at best.
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This
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Yep. Only good againts weak teams (like any other killer no metter tierlist).
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Not that weak but not a "good" Killer either.
Wraith is now a normal B-Tier Killer and was an solid low A/highB-Tier befor the nerf. He has the advantage of not falling victim to the "holding shift+w"-strat as he just outruns the survivor and he still has some very good add-ons with "The Ghost", the non-directional Bell and speed / action buffs.
He is not on Clowns, Myers or Legions level of "bad" by a long shot and I would still advice new players who start with Killer to play Wraith. However once you go to the higher levels he falls off especialy since the interduction of Cylce of Healing and more people are bringing Med-Kits which counters his most effective hit and run style.
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This killer is … pretty weak on the actual genrush meta with spine chill
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The nerf to his lunge hurt a lot. He used to have a chance to get a hit on some loops, now he's back to the tier of killers that eat wood.
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I feel like that too. Sadly.
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He was good until he got nerfed again...
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Wraith is definitely not in a good place right now, but I feel like the extra lunge was definitely unfair when you take into consideration his buffed movement speed which could then be stacked with windstorm add-ons.
It lowkey shut down certain short/medium loops, and looping is about the only skillful thing a survivor can do. That being said, I think Wraith would benefit more from a decreased cloak/uncloak time, which would probably make cloaking/uncloaking feel less gimmicky and more natural.
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Not weak. Neither good after nerf. He's mediocre somehow.
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I disliked how strong he was for a killer that's braindead easy to play, but then there's something else that's just as easy to play; survivor
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Strong? I quess with some addons combo. But standalone or without powerfull addons I think he was okay at best.
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Pretty underwhelming killer that is even more add on dependant that he was before.
Unless he get really good map, he is just a joke
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Bell go bing bong.
He is a good killer. I usually run yellow windstorm and bone clapper and haven't had much trouble with him. Honestly he is also the easiest to pip on up to iridescent grade (mainly because he gets an easy double pip most games before red grade).
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The best stealth killer but still mediocre
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Yes, because press M1 or M2 to hit a slower survivor is so difficult
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I don’t think Wraith is terrible only because he has good map mobility with stealth, and that alone keeps him out of being trash tier. He’s definitely the weakest good mobility killer though (i.e. Blight, Hillbilly and Freddy all have even better mobility and better chase abilities.) So he’s in the bucket of most killers who are kind of average, he’s weak in a chase but his mobility and stealth mean his initial chases are shorter than average and he can patrol a wider area than average.
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After his nerf, he's back to being a weak Killer
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It depends.
- Low MMR: He's strong. You'll constantly get survivors who don't notice you until you decloak and run away in a straight line.
- Intermediate to High MMR: He's weak-ish. Boons give him a lot of trouble. If survivors loop aggressively you'll spend so much time trying to down people that you'll lose all your gens. Survivors will notice your 'blur' and call it out. He does okay on some maps, but maps with a lot of safe pallets (RPD, The Game) or with a lot of vaults/gyms (Mother's Dwelling, Haddonfield, Badham) he can be miserable.
He's a C-D tier killer. He needs something - if I was balancing him, I'd give him 3 seconds of Undetectable after he decloaks.
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He was a bit too strong before the nerf. Just wasn't fun to play against. He feels fair to play as/against now. I'd say he's balanced.
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Trickster's fun and mid-tier+ and wraith is fun when you're not playing a hardcore swf. I recommend using devour/ other instadown perks.
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Overpowered ≠ Unfun to go against
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He is the TRASHCAN that holds the rest of the garbage KILLERS :)
Try Plague and Bubba they ROCK! ;)
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He’s more than good.
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He was too strong.
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I mean, I played against him fine.
With the introduction of Circle of Healing, hit & run Wraith isn't as effective either.
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he's definitely not fun to play anymore. You have to play the loop game to it's fullest against decent survivors because his speedboost is kinda useless right now. Which means you will lose way too much time to win.
When i play survivor i hate killers who get cheap hits during animations, like Nemesis, Huntress, Trickster, i mean those lose-lose situations (either get the m1 or m2). I find this much more unfun to play against then a m1 killer who can get looped into oblivion.
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Was C tier after buffs but now just bad again.
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Was he?
I can't think of a single tier list that had him higher than 'B' tier.
I'm also a bit tired of 'x is unfun to play against so nerf'. There are plenty of things that are amazingly unfun for the killer to play against which have not and likely will never be nerfed.
Before the nerf he was fine. A good attrition based killer. Boons would have been a strong counter to him.
Now? When you factor in the nerfs to his addons, he's only slightly better than he was before the rework; probably weaker if you factor in the new boon-heavy meta.
Only at perhaps very low MMR. Pinhead was the same (RIP you beautiful spoopy man).
Against survivors that knew what you were doing, you'd still have a rough game. He has vulnerabilities (lightburn) that very few killers have, and now no special tools that aren't ultra easy to counter.
Devour is a must on him right now. The old NOED+NWO works well too. He can even make Starstruck+Agi work sometimes.
The fact that he relies on cheesy gimmick builds is telling.
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I think the gimmicky build thing leans into the storytelling thing we were just talking about on that other discussion.
I think it's cool wraith can act as a blank canvas.
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He...can't though. Not really.
Right now you have to build him either hyper-aggressive or instadown. He's one of the two killers where I don't have a single available spot for an information or 'fun' perk unless I want to get trounced.
He's anti-loop is now nonexistant, meaning that you can somewhat reliably get one hit on survivors and that's it. Boons counter his attrition style so hard that you have to build around them every game, which gets tedious fast.
Essentially, you can't really play him as 'Wraith' anymore. And at that point, you may as well just play Bubba or someone with an instadown built into his kit.
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true.
sorry, I misunderstood your post.
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He's not bad, he has counters. If you patrol gens where survivors don't have access to an easy escape from your (small and short) speed boost, your going to get a hit in and sometimes a down on restealth and catchup if you can block the vaults and pallets. On top of that he's still got good camp, and if he has silent bell he can be really really tricksy.
He isn't top of the pile, and by definition, only one killer can be at a time. But he's definately in a better spot than killers with no speed or viable strategies at all right now.
I feel like players who want people to think they are really good enjoy piling on the "killer is trash at my high MMR" comments, when they probably just stick to playing stronger killers out of habit anyways. If you can win games with him in Gold and Irridescent, which you totally can, he's fine for the general population.
Its probably only the bottom 10% that literally cannot perform his counterplay (Get to something to block his speed boost then loop or W) or the top 10% that consistently play survivors who ALWAYS grasp and successfully pull of his counterplay.
TLDR: He's fine for general population, like most things in this game.
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I disagree. Even the devs stated he was a little OP if I'm remembering correctly. I believe he's perfectly balanced now.
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The devs are the same people that nerfed Billy, the most balanced killer in the game base-kit wise, and constantly nerfed Pig unnecessarily, as well as not even buffing her base-kit because of StAtIsTiCs. Oh and nerfing Twins too. You can't really use the dev's words as an argument.
Wraith wasn't the slightest bit OP. If you got destroyed by Wraith, that's very likely a you problem.
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Disagree. The devs have way more data than us. I'll take their word over yours.
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No point in having data if you don't know how to take the correct course of action.
Example:
"According to the sTaTs, Billy is very balanced and most of the community likes him..."
"Nerf?"
"Nerf."
Like, why?
Same thing goes for Freddy's initial nerf after A WEEK of his release, countless unnecessary Pig nerfs over the years, nerfing Twins, almost nerfing Rat Liver, and it goes on.
See what I mean?
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