Survivors Attitudes Towards Killers.
I've recently begun to notice that some survivors seem to render certain killer players as obnoxious for playing a certain way during the trials i.e camping/tunneling. While I can understand this experience can be upsetting (I've faced it on numerous occasions) I don't see it as a reason to view the killer player as obnoxious though. I've also seen this escalate further to bullying and harassment happening in the end game chat, where unspeakable and awful comments are passed to others as a result of it. In the game (especially in it's currently climate with MMR) killer's must do everything they can to achieve even what is considered "a fair and balanced win" which is a 2K sometimes. One thing survivors need to realize is that the killer is the antagonist, they are supposed to be oppressive and do everything they can in order achieve their objective. As long as they do that within the parameters of the game's rules they can try and achieve their objective in any way they see fit. It is not your call to make. Killer's are not your playthings who are to bend your wishes just so YOU can have fun. They have to have fun as well and if this is how they decide to have fun then so be it. Killer's are players too we must remember. If the way killer's play to accomplish their goals (which is in contrast to yours of course) upsets or contradicts your subjective sense of what you feel entitled to then it may be in your best interest to play something else. This is the way it is.
Comments
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Camping and tunneling (unless at endgame) is basically refusing to play the game and ensuring someone else can't play either.
MMR can't be blamed because if you try it at high MMR you'd be gen rushed and barely scrape a single kill.
If a killer is so bad and skill less that they have to use a tactic that would only punish bad players I have little sympathy.
That said, this is a game. No matter what happens in a game there is no justification for irl threats/insults.
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A killer camping or tunneling at any point in the game is still playing the game.
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camping is basically going afk with extra steps.
tunneling can vaguely ve considered playing the game but on beginner mode.
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then maybe don't tunnel and camp all the time? so many killers camp or tunnel for the wrong reasons then get surprised when a whole team of survivors are bitter towards them in end game chat.. if it was for a good reason then just ignore it, not that hard
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Both are still playing the game.
The killer's job is to kill. Just because you don't like how they chose to kill you is not an issue of the killer not playing the game.
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Face camping is not playing the game. You can literally go afk and make a snack while face camping. The person on the hook isn't playing the game either. They likely had more interaction in the pregame lobby.
I'd rather have a fun game with 0k than play a game where I 4k but barely interacted with anyone else. At that stage i might as well play solitare or minesweeper.
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I normally abide by the survivors rule book and play, as I call it "as if I was running Devour Hope", ie once I hook someone, I just RUN and leave the area.
You would be surprised how many survs holding M1 on some distant gen get totally caught off guard when you bulge in there 20s after a hook.
I normally only start tunneling someone aggressively out of the game, when 2 or 3 gens fly by in quick succession. Also, I normally ignore one survivor all game, as an even distribution of hooks on all of then will benefit you zero. Normally I alternate between two survs and take opportunistic hits and chases, when they present themselves.
I still get called a noob, a crappy camper and thousand other bad and unsavory things.
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Shrug.
I don't camp outside of EOGC and I'll tunnel, but not off hook.
I get exactly the same amount of salt/BM in postgame no matter what I do.
Play Demo? 'Just play normally scrub'.
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I don't think many people would complain if it happens for reasons like you stated. It's the face camping at 5gens with 1 dc which most people have a problem with. At that point playing "normally" would end the game faster and be fairer to all.
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Yeah, I once tried the insidious basement Bubba build, just to see what the fuzz was all about, and it worked, but it was both: boring and totally unsatisfying.
I love playing Bubba, because he is always dangerous and most shenanigans like bodyblocking, running circles around the killer and other cute stuff don't work against him, and he puts the fear and respect for the killer back into the game, but it saddens and grieves me that so many claim that you can't win with him if you don't camp.
Tinkerer Bubba is the best thing on the world: sneak up to a ripe gen and then scare two survivors off it who were THAT close to popping it. Awesome sauce :)
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Theres nothing killers can do that survivors wont find something to complain about.
If you win playing fair they will call you tunneler and camper or say something else to try to hurt you. If you lose they will insult your abilitity to play this game and tell you to uninstall.
So lets face it nothing you do is going to please some survivors, so just play how you want to play the game. If you have fun thats what matters. As long as you dont cheat or insult other people.
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When survivors rush gens its considered an effective way to play the game.
When the killer does the same with his objective, its considered being bad.
Weird, huh?
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Face camping is quite a bit different from regular camping.
Camping is usually done when the killer has good reason to know someone is coming, usually they see or hear someone and instead of wandering off pretending to be deaf and blind they stick around. Same with how frequently tunneling is less refusing to play and more refusing to ignore bad or selfish or greedy plays from survivors.
Its like how plenty of killers always insist they lost because of unfair mmr and unfair swf when they really just got outplayed. Survivors aren't any different, just more numerous and so it's easier to create truth via consensus.
Are there examples of people acting in the way genuinely being complained about? Absolutely. Is it anywhere near as common as the forums want you to think? Absolutely not. It's usually just an excuse for bad plays. Regardless of which side making it
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Can you guys stop telling others that camping and tunneling are needed to play the game as killer? Thats soo far away from the truth and every second thread someone is shouting out this nonsense. Neither of this is necessary to have a good game as killer. Its so damn frustrating to see new players acknowledging as a given and playing like jerks. As survivor there is nothing more frustrating than having to play against people like that. Its a damn game, so behave like that and dont make it even worse with your nonsense.
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You should see these people when they get stuck in Jail playing Monopoly or get their turn skipped in UNO!
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I read all your posts on this thread, but this is the easiest one to respond to:
- Camping and tunneling is playing the game, no matter how poorly you wish to frame it
- You are underestimating how effective camping can be, even at high MMRs. All a killer has to do is make the appropriate bet "Are these altruistic solos, or an efficient SWF?" and it's not a hard bet to make, you know within the first 90 seconds what kind of team you're up against
- If the killer is so bad and skilless, like you'd like to frame, then the onus is on the punished survivors to get better and reach high MMR like you incorrectly noted earlier - this is an asymmetrical game and you do not get to dictate how the other side plays. Especially if they're playing to win, within the confines of the TOS
- We absolutely agree on your last point. Neither side should be acting like a 7 year old brat behind a veil of anonymity
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This post made no sense once the post i replied to got deleted.
So now it's me saying peanut butter.
Peanut butter.
Post edited by cantelope on6 -
The only one I can think of is that the survivors are seen en route or just swarming the hook.
What other ones are there?
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When the offerings are shown and there are several Altruisms revealed. That means they want saves and they will be coming for unhooks. Why chase when the prey comes to you?
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as someone how plays both Survivor and Killer, I dont blame killers for camping and tunneling but when you bring Ruin/Undying and sometimes with Pop only to have your totems broken within 2min of the game and for that reason you start camping thats where my issue resides. That is half of the killers who are doing that recently.
Killers dont need to stack gen slow downs to have fun, I main spirit with Corrupt/Deadlock/Grim/thrilling as a build Corrupt being the real only slow down i still have fun and still 3-4k no ruin pop.
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"I don't need slowdown" your Build:
3 slowdown perks and a pseudo slowdown/info perk...
Literally every single perk you have blocks generators.
You're not making a good case here.
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The type of players who cry about camping and feel the need to hurl abuse in post game are generally people who don't like PVP games and are playing more for a PVE CO-OP experience. They're not a fan when the AI starts behaving "unfairly"
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Want to do a challenge as killer (so i am a bit chill) and everytime i hit a surv they run away and i didn´t go after them. Got 0k.
If you don´t get the down as killer, they heal and all the time is wasted.
Played against a Wraith who tunneld me out as first. He got a 4k.
Face camping also only works with Bubba against a good group - against most other killers they often manage the unhook with a double rescue body block tactic.
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Take out Grim Embrace for NWO and it's literally one of the best meta builds.
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If the survivors know you're afk, and you go make that delicious snack, then yeah the survivors will get their teammates off the hook
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There are times you will need to face camp, like when you don't see BBQ aura on any of the survivors, you might assume they are somewhere around the hook waiting for you to leave.
There are times to tunnel as well, sometimes you want the weakest link gone from the game, because anyone can hold M1, or you might want to just slug them to keep up pressure so someone has to come get them, either way, these are both valid and allowed tactics
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This is one of the most slowdown builds I have ever seen.
Each of your perks blocks gen. How is that not a slow-down stacking?
Corrupt + Deadlock is really strong combination for lazy killers who doesn't like to care about gens. It's used a lot in tournaments, but that because of how fast those games are there.
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This isn't "the way it is" but the way you see it- aka your opinion. Others might have different opininions. Anyone is free to play whatever they want to play. If someone wants to complain they're free to complain. If someone wants to criticize a behaviour or playstyle they're as free to criticize it as the other person is to play in any way they like. Critique isn't insulting. Insults are not okay. If someone gets upset playing dbd it is their problem and still their decision to play it and get upset as much as they want to. We're not that person so it's not our decision what they should play. We sure can recommend other games but even then it is up to that person to decide.
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I always refer to what my friend says, and I'm appalled. He thinks a killer is "desperate" or "braindead" or "tunnels" if they go for him.
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Nope.
If you don't want to be camped or tunneled, run. Use your perks. Maybe even develop some skills to evade a killer. Lots of survivors do these things, it's still playing. There are lots of games where playing badly or making a poor decision can put you out. This is one of those games.
I never camp unless it's a good strategy, but when it is, I'm definitely playing. Sometimes it doesn't work and I have to drop that strategy. I never expect the survivors to help my strategies win, I expect them to try to thwart me. "You thwarted me, that's not playing," is something I've never said.
It's crazy to me that you actually expect the killer to help you get the maximum playtime. Maybe you should play a game where there's no killer?
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Expecting the killer to make the game easier for you kinda sounds like beginner mode. I mean, kinda exactly.
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Who is asking the killer to play "easier"? Nobody is asking for free escapes or to not play the game. Leaving a hook and going for somebody else, stopping them from doing gens, etc. isnt going "easier". Its playing the game.
I'm just grateful BHVR have said they'd address this as its one of the most boring things in this game.
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They said that like 4 years ago mate. Also you don't get to tell people how to play their own game they own.
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im fine with camping and tunneling as long as its done for a strategic reason. If you start camping at 5 gens with no survivor nearby, you're just being a dick, if you go out of your way to tunnel in a way that actually puts you in a disadvantage, you're just being a dick. Regardless however bullying and harassments is not okay and just bring them to a lower level than the killer.
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You really believe them when they can't even deal with their hacker and ddos problem now?
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Camping is griefing. That's why DBD is the only game where camping in any form is actively promoted by it's parent company(outside of like ACTUAL camping, with a fire and hotdogs or smores). Somehow people equate camping to "tbagging and flashlight clicking", but I don't see how either of those prevent the killer from playing the game. They're not even close to related. If anything both of those actions help the killer as you're not gaining distance while doing it.
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Then stop asking for killer nerfs.
Anyone who is at decent ranks knows at some point you need to tunnel or camp someone if you want to have even a slight chance at winning. There is a point where it stops being outplayed and just boils down to raw numbers where the killer automatically loses.
You can't go for 16 hooks and share hook states between survivors if they are decent.
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"It's not griefing when I do things to upset people but it is when my opponent tries to win" lol
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They are both dumb ######### the other team doesn't like so if one gets punished why not the other both are a problem and it doesn't matter cause both issues can easily stall the game.
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It becomes more and more necessary the higher your mmr goes. You simply can't go for 12 hooks vs a good coordinated survivor team. Gens go to quick and maps are to big and safe to do that. At mid skill level camping and tunneling is not necessary thats why it's actually fun.
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I don't get it either.
Sign up to game where you could be eliminated, get upset when you are eliminated ugh.
Its not only survivors, lots of players take it too seriously on both sides, you'll probably see it more as killer though than playing survivor.
There is an un-written collection of expectations that a lot of players have and when the game doesn't meet those expectations they blame the oponent usually as abusively and childishly as possible.
In the age of streaming every sore loser can have an online platform to spread this kind of hate and players get conditioned overtime to the same behaviour and expectations. There a heaps of bad sports live streaming their bad attitude daily. I'd be embarrassed if I behaved like that on camera but these people do and some people watch and condone it.
There is nothing wrong with camping, tunneling, mori's, keys, flashlights, button mashing, gestures etc etc they are all game mechanics that are valid play.
Now some of them are mechanically a lil busted and need some reworking here and there and that's a valid conversation. Most people aren't here for a valid conversation though, they are here to say I hate X, punish everyone who does X, only scummy players do X, its toxic etc etc etc which is largely BS.
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Even Scott has a video detailing how camping and tunneling is rarely the best idea. Yes there are circumstances where the situation calls for it but its never a good idea to go into the match with the mentality "I need to camp at 5 gens to win"
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Lol...i needed this chuckle. No need for slowdown then admit your build of slowdown perks. Slowdown is more than regressing gens. Sliwdown is slowing survivors gen repair....corrupt blocks gens (slows down gen repair) deadlock (blocks gens slowing repair) grim/thrilling are same boat. Not to mention you are using a top 4 killer on top of that. Good joke...hopefully your joking.
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If you like the person or not is besides the point. He outlined clearly the reasoning behind everything he said - which is more than you've been able to do.
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(speaking for myself)
I don’t have an issue with Killers camping/tunneling, however it doesn’t mean that I enjoy it. Its a waste of waiting in a lobby just to be camped/tunneled out of a game 2-3 mins in.
The Killers who do it and BM though will always bother me because its like… “cool, you’re killing me as you should, but why be a douche about it?”
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That's where I'm at with it. I'm fine with people using whatever tactics to win, so long as they aren't dicks while they do it. Tunnel me out, sure, but why hit me on the hook?
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Bro, all I can say is if you care about what survivors think... You are going to have a BAD time.
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Right.
& sadly, this is majority of Killers lately that I face. Idk if they’ve had previous bad games & want to take it out on others but its such a toxic cycle to be in. Having a few previous bad games is not an excuse to be *BLEEP* and take it out on others. If you ask me, its quite a childish way to deal with your frustrations. Unfortunately, this will never change though. Just gonna have to learn to tolerate it.
edit: the forums didn’t censor my curse word so I did it myself because I really would prefer NOT to be jailed atm.
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Corrupt + Deadlock is one of the strongest slowdowns combos and better than Ruin + Pop. Spirit is the 3rd best killer in the game...
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