Would it hurt if Killers could see hook states per person too?
Tunnelling is the easier option than spreading it out. Especially when everyone decides to look the same.
Comments
-
Why would this make killers not tunnel? If anything I would think it would encourage it even more.
9 -
It would promote more camping and tunneling when you can still keep a mental note of those survivors instead
6 -
Would have no negative effect with camping or tunneling. If your camped or tunneled then the killer isn't switching targets anyway.
It would help killers that actually go for chases and against teams that run the same outfits.
40 -
They are talking about when all 4 decides to look the exact same and you end up downing the same survivor twice because they all look the same.
3 -
It wouldn’t hurt anything, but seems unnecessary to me. Math isn’t that hard, counting to 12 (max) is pretty well known information.
If you indeed wish to tunnel someone out to make things easier, but you’re worried about “everyone looking the same”, then dodge lobbies where they look the same!! lol
Very very rarely do I get survivors playing VS me or with me as duplicate characters, doesn’t really seem like an issue to me.
0 -
Because the game doesn't have enough things to keep track of without memorising who's been downed how many times as well.
But sure, accidentally killing someone when BPS or whatever's been played really feels great. /s
7 -
Killers can remember hook states of all survivors. Survivirs cant. And some cant even read them now
4 -
I mean you could make a mental note of it and say it out loud before you hook them. So you could say "Ok this is Neas first hook" or "I've hooked Elodie twice now", etc.
0 -
I'm not sure adding mnemonic devices is really contributing much to the gameplay, that's all. It's just unnecessary withholding of information and probably leads to more unintentional mistaken-for-tunnelling than anything.
And you don't even need all that much weirdness to get two Dwights or two Claudettes or two Megs in a team or something.
6 -
Good question, to bad the people who have that opinion can never seem to explain their reasoning for maintaining that opinion. All I am saiyan is that even flat earthers explain why they feel the way they do. Technically a tier above the "this will encourage tunneling" crowd, if we look at it objectively.
3 -
I posed a question and your response was to be defensive and not even attempt to answer it, well done.
0 -
I don't care if it encourages tunneling. It's a qol change that killer has needed for some time now. I'm tired of losing games where I death hooked everybody but killed nobody because I couldn't see the hook states that they could.
0 -
We shouldn't have to dodge lobbies because multiple people put on the same cosmetic and there's no hook states shown.
0 -
It's the opposite. Survivors can see what hooks everyone's on because it's part of their UI, but killer has to guess or remember because they just get the 1 thing which doesn't tell you who's been hooked.
1 -
I second this. If you tunnel, you go for the surv that just got unhooked, if you camp, you don't even move away from the hook.
I had a few times hook someone, who was on death hook, on accident, because I just didn't notice that they had entered the second hook stage or I just lost count because I tried to hook everyone evenly.
While I understand the anti tunnel arguments, in the end I think showing the hook stages to killers will help survivors more then it will hurt them: campers gonna camp, tunnelers gonna tunnel, but nice killers would benefit from it.
7 -
Actually, I was wrong, the truth is... I would tunnel if only I could tell who I already hooked. That is the only thing stopping me, I watch them on hook, and then... Poof. They disappear. If only I could tell their hook stage to continue my tunnel, but the magical barrier prevents my powers from activating and I have never tunneled before despite an immense desire to be one of the cool kids.
7 -
Many killers seem to think tunneling is the only way you can 4k (I'm not really gonna comment on if tunneling is good/bad that's a different topic) but struggle to keep track of hook states so sometimes don't despite wanting to so if the game does it for them some will definitely use it for that purpose.
As for the topic as a whole personally I think keeping track of hook states is part of a killer's skill and dislike any type of handholding mechanics like I feel that would be if it was implemented.
0 -
No.
People can just remember who's dead on hook or what hook states they are at. And if someone wants to tunnel and camp they will, and in the current state that playstyle is more beneficial even if the less fun.
All hiding the numbers does is split the difference between killers and survivors more.
Instead of survivors having to remember to play better/smarter they gave them a visual clue. Prime example of holding the survivors hands when it wasnt needed, this just helps people be more lazy for one side while forgetting the other.
5 -
God i wish this was a thing.
Games tend to flow in eachother for me so i have a real hard time just keeping a mental tab on it.
The argument that it helps tunneling is straight up non-sensical. If you tunnel that means you focus on one person. It really doesn't matter if that's showed or not as you litterally never let the person out of your view.
Some here says it helps camping too which is just completly wrong. It's already shown which stage someone is when they are on the hook.
There is zero reason not to show it to the killer.
3 -
Idk I play stoned af so I have a lot of trouble remembering who is on what hook, I don't like tunneling so feels bad when I kill someone I thought for sure wasn't on death hook
4 -
Me and my raisin for a brain disagrees that you can just remember where everyone's at all the time XD
1 -
Saying stuff out loud to yourself promotes memory functions ... the same way writing them down or repeating them several times would
0 -
I see no reason why as a Killer I should not be able to see the hook counter.
The forum myth is "It will just increase tunnelling!"
I call bullcrap. Right now tunneling takes place mostly in one of two situations. The weak link you come across out in the open (Opportunity tunnel), or the "You ticked me off so I am gonna make sure you die no matter what" (Deliberate Tunnel).
Neither of these scenarios are based on information from the HUD.
What a hook state counter WOULD have helped with is me not accidentally screwing over the Steve I killed last week because I got him mixed up and ruined the pity farm I was giving the team after they got screwed over by a DC.
2 -
I never understood the argument that a killer player should not be able to see the hook states. The devs and community say it would encourage tunneling, but do you really think killer players are literally so stupid as to not be able to count to 3 normally in their head? At that point your argument is more likely "Well we don't want them to target a SPECIFIC survivor if MULTIPLE survivors look the same" because thats the only real information that would be gained by having the hook states for killer in all reality.
In fact, since I entirely quit killing survivors, it would be really helpful to not accidentally kill them when they go 2nd while I'm not paying attention.
2 -
I don't think that has anything to do with my objection, which is that it doesn't really contribute to gameplay to start using memory tricks. Whether that be mnemonic devices or talking to yourself (which I'm not going to do because that's a bad thing to the time I play).
1 -
Actually I agree with this entirely :)
0 -
Ok cool but still no.
0 -
Yes it would hurt, we don’t want it, period
0 -
Made me laugh, as sad as it is.
When they first implemented this I thought hey at least now if someone who hasnt been hooked yet and I'm on dead hook, they'll know and take a hit for me, but nope, they still don't take aggro.
2 -
It would hurt how, and who doesn't want it? Who is this "we" you're speaking for? Come on, don't claim to speak for everyone when you're immediately contradicted in the thread itself.
Not having it just adds a weird asymmetrical hassle that probably gets more people killed than it prevents. It'd be nice to have. <_>
6 -
You could keep a running tally and jot them down. It does help and it does contribute to gameplay because you are using all of your senses available along with your memory to help you develop a strategy or strengthen your abilities as a player. Helps you rely less on visual stimulus and strengthens your mind...
0 -
You don't want it. But the community is more then you alone
There are zero real downsides to it. Make it toggle able so then you won't have to deal with it
6 -
By that logic playing whilst having tennis balls shot in the face every ten seconds would also improve gameplay, but I'm not going to be rushing for a pitching machine.
That's a real stretch of "contributing to gameplay" or developing a strategy. <_>
3 -
Yes. That would promote camping and tunnelling which is already frequent enough in game as it is.
0 -
At what point in camping and tunnelling do you benefit from a counter telling you who you've hooked? It's the one person you're following the entire time. Especially with camping.
Sure, in the event that you have identical people and they've been unhooked and healed and you lost track, it MIGHT be used to find that one person again by hitting everyone until the right one dings. But that's a very specific situation for tunnelling only AND relies on sheer single-minded desire to not down anybody else.
By this logic, seeing hookstates of hooked survivors is promoting camping. And bleed out timers are promoting slugging. Even though all of those would keep happening without change even if the entire UI was deleted.
4 -
Please explain to me like i'm 5 how it would promote tunneling.
And you're really going to have to bend the fabric of reality to explain how on earth it promotes camping.
5 -
I am doing it all the time in solo. Kinda sad that I expect the same from teammates but usually they just keep doing that gen while watching me getting rekt on HUD
1 -
Yeap. If I havent been hooked yet and someone is on their last hook and being chased I try my best to take a hit. Bond has been amazing to help me notice situations like that, but as amazing as showing me useless people as well.
2 -
I see no reason why Killer's need this information. It wouldn't help, or hurt, anything. 🤷
As an aside: Killers who decide to camp and and/or tunnel already know who they hooked. Either they are on the hook already or they are the most recent survivor unhooked. It's not like a tunneler isn't like "I don't know who I just hooked" when they'd be chasing them already.
2 -
I have a really hard time remembering this information, especially when i played a lot of games in a row as they tend to blur together in my mind.
Having this QoL would help a lot for me tbh.
If i want a chill game i can go for 8 hooks before killing someone without worrying if the base skin meg 1 was on dead hook or base skin meg 2 was.
Also would allow me to put someone on death hook early and then leave them be untill the game starts going to hard in the survivors favour.
Will it make the biggest difference in the world? No it wouldn't. But it would be a nice QoL change for something that works exactly the same for both sides and only one got a QoL change for
1 -
I've always had my own internal rule of "multiple BPS equals no one dies". I still play normally, I just don't death hook.
99% of the time, this is no issue as I'm going in knowing I need to remember who was and wasn't hooked twice but if the game has hit 10-15 minute mark and it's been a while...
It absolutely sucks for me as a killer when I accidentally kill someone there (and it's good for my BP, I can't imagine what that poor survivor thinks seeing me let everyone go EXCEPT for them). If a killer is going to camp/tunnel, they have to remember one person's state and go after them only. Having a UI isn't going to make them somehow better at camping or tunneling.
I suppose ultimately it's not the biggest deal in the world but as a killer who tries to play "fairly", it sucks when I inadvertently take someone out asap because I'm expected to remember everything I've done in the match.
Post edited by tippy2k2 on4 -
I always track the hook states on a piece of paper when playing killer.
1 -
i have no idea why the devs think it would encourage tunneling. if you're tunneling, then you already know someone's hook state lmfaoo. because, yknow, you're TUNNELING. that's what tunneling means. you're focusing on one single person and killing them.
but who knows what the devs' definition of "tunneling" is. by their reasoning, it's probably just seeing someone on deathhook and switching to them instead of someone on freshhook or second. good stuff guys.
yes, it should be a thing.
5 -
No, it's like seeing the health bar of your opponent on any game.
Seeing the hook stage as survivor can be crucial on some case, body-blocking, risking a sabotage play, trading hooks.
1 -
Nope. Never understood the argument that it would encourage tunneling. If I want to tunnel someone I just need to keep tab of that single person hook states, but if I want to play "fair" and spread the hooks sometimes it's incredibly hard, especially when there's two or more of the same survivors.
3 -
All I care about are my BBQ stacks and that info is already displayed. Everything after that is gravy.
Look at the hud when you hook to see which person it was.
0 -
I don't think it would change much really. Most experienced killers know to keep a mental note on whos been hooked and how many times. So with this in mind, it doesn't make anything better or worse. It would make it slightly more convenient to tunnel. But it wouldn't be the sole reason for it either. And for any other aspect of the game it'd probably just be nice to have a reminder in case you forget.
1 -
all this would realistically do is help newer Killer players by telling them who has been hooked how many times so they have an easier time deciding who to go for based on that information.
one crucial thing everyone who thinks this would "encourage tunneling" seems to forget is, that us Killers do have brains. We are able to remember who is on death hook and who isnt, so a change like this would quite literally change nothing for experienced players.
0 -
I don't think that's a matter of being an experienced Killer, so much as just having good memory. Maybe getting really attentive to skins/names in the lobby is sort-of-a-skill but that's not really a game-limited one.
And you still see streamers who play this all the time and are talking about who they've hooked lose track occasionally. So, neither experience nor making it easier is going to avoid slipups every now and then.
1 -
There's no downside to killers being able to see the number of hooks each survivor has had. It's such an odd decision to hide that information from killers under the pretense that it could encourage tunneling.
If a killer wants to tunnel, they're going to do so regardless of what they see on their HUD.
3
