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Dead Hard for distance.
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Lets also not forget dead hard turns trappers power on him. Put a beartrap on a pallet so they are forced to drop it? Nope they E through the beartrap and now trapper lost all that distance. He can run the loop again but most of the time after the survivor Es the trap they hold W so its on the survivor to make that mistake.
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Dead Hard needs to provide some distance since just having I-Frames would do nothing. A killer swings through you, but is still on top of you. You're going down unless you are right next to a pallet.
I think it would be pretty hard to straight nerf Dead Hard, because the issue is that both dodging a swing and squeezing out a bit of extra distance provide the same value. Dead Harding a swing near nothing is just going to get you downed so dodging a swing still needs a pallet or vault like dead harding for distance does.
Meaning Dead Hard needs to be changed in a way that it gives less distance when not dodging a hit and more distance when dodging a hit.
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Yes - It's a direct reference to the following 'bad-faith' statement:
"No one who wants it nerfed can articulate why they want it nerfed."
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I mean a rework i saw floating around was to have deadhard give you a speedboost like any exhaustion perk. When the killers hit phases through the invincibility frames. But that sounds difficult to code and idk how well it'd work in practice.
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There's a challenge for killer's whiffing swings near you. Don't need to code it for passing through you with i-frames.
Reduce the distance by half and add an extra effect that if the killer swings near you while you are dashing (and maybe a second afterwards) then you get a sprint burst.
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Hatchet go brrrrr?
I'd rather they removed the iframe and kept the distance, yay you dashed to that window now eat a hatchet in the back as you vault.
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No offense taken.
Dead Hard is different from a free health state. When you are hit and lose a health state, you get a 2 or 3 second speed boost and have maneuverability during that speed boost. When you exaggerate, the people on the other-side of the argument see this as an exaggeration and tend to ignore the argument because they feel as if you really don't have anything backing your statements since you resorted to exaggerating.
Alright, no exaggerating. Dead Hard is an Exhaustion Perk able to give you free, controllable distance on command with no drawbacks.
Sort of. Lithe, Balanced Landing and Sprint Burst can also be activated by specific player input. Sprint Burst is exactly like Dead Hard in this aspect because it requires you to press a button (The shift button) just like Dead Hard (The active button). However, I don't see how this is a problem in the first place, different perks are activated differently. Just because 2 of the exhaustion perks require an activation key doesn't make them better or worse than other perks. It only makes them different.
Lithe is probably some of the best balanced Exhaustion Perks in the game. It require player interaction and decision making. Use the speed boost but give up a tile or continue looping and give up the speed boost. Sprint Burst is more similar to Lithe in that regard.
Different is good. What's not good is having a Perk with no interaction or decision making being better than a Perk that does something similar.
This is an opinion, there's really no way to measure this. For me, Sprint Burst and Overcome and much less risky and much higher rewards because they cannot be baited out or missed. They always work.
Dead Hard can't be baited out. I know it's hard for you to believe but trust me, it's easy to use it properly so you don't get baited.
I believe you are saying that if a survivor makes a mistake during a chase, they have the option to use Dead Hard. I agree. Yes a survivor would have 1 chance to correct a mistake made in a chase. It doesn't render mind-games useless, because the survivor still needs to use Dead Hard, so your mind-game draws out a Dead Hard.
It did render the mindgame useless. You would've downed them, now you gotta start a whole nother chase with them.
I just don't understood this argument. No exhaustion perk use for distance is able to be countered.
There's a whole difference between Dead Hard distance and the distance of other Exhaustion Perks. Most of them either deny chase or end chase, Dead Hard extends chases by 30 seconds minimum.
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Distance is the issue that pops up the most. The way I see it, most survivors that use it for distance already know how many loops they can get out of a tile and where safe areas are if they need to reach them. Take away DH and they will simply throw the pallet sooner and switch back to SB for that initial distance to a strong tile.
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It's not hard to do the impossible, as long as you're a Demogorgon main of course
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Wait for survs changing dh for sb and you won’t see any trapper again
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"This post, and other posts like it on this threat, is the reason Dead Hard isn't going to be nerfed."
I mean, OP is alleging that the devs have already signaled that they don't like DH for distance and are looking into the perk. I don't know if that's true, but between this bit and what OP alleges, one of those two pieces of information is definitely incorrect.
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A perk that gives you complete immunity to any hit and is still able to give you distance to a pallet or loop. It's insanely pathetic to continue the way it is, it's literally a third health state.
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19:08
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For sure - People switching to a perk that doesn't shut down any of his prior set-up will surely be the death of our beloved Trapper.
T_T
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These arguments make more sense to me. The only one that kind of bothers me is the...
Alright, no exaggerating. Dead Hard is an Exhaustion Perk able to give you free, controllable distance on command with no drawbacks.
When I see this, I think that a survivor does have to be injured to be able to use it. It might be me being nitpicky.
Dead Hard can't be baited out. I know it's hard for you to believe but trust me, it's easy to use it properly so you don't get baited.
I'll trust you on this because I'm sure I don't play killer on the same level as you since I split up between survivor and killer. So I'm assuming I'm going against survivors who don't use it as good.
I don't know if this is really a problem since other exhaustion perks would be similar with skilled survivors. In this, I mean a skilled survivor would be just as hard to bait out a Sprint Burst as a Dead Hard. I'm not even sure having the ability to be baited out is enough to matter in the grand scheme of things.
There's a whole difference between Dead Hard distance and the distance of other Exhaustion Perks. Most of them either deny chase or end chase, Dead Hard extends chases by 30 seconds minimum
I think your last two arguments come down the same thing, the argument above. If the developers listened to the forums, I think this would be the best argument for getting Dead Hard nerfed. If it's actually extending chases an additional 30 seconds or so, compared to the other exhaustion perks, then I would definitely say it needs a nerf, as a developer.
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Ayup, altho it's definetly not as common as it used to be, but the fact that it still happens is really annoying.
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Agree. The issue with the perk is the distance, not the iframe.
The iframe has counter play and can be baited out.
However the DH for distance when used correctly has no counter play. You basically just greed every single loop and DH if they call your bluff. Puts you in a win/win situation with nothing you can do as killer other than eat the extra time waste.
I'd also say Exhaustions current design in general is problematic as well, but I suppose that's another topic.
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Just delete DH already, problem solved.
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And it covers way less distance than Sprint Burst.
The perk is absolutely fine, it is supposed to help in a chase. It is almost like saying survivors are not supposed to run, evade, or dodge the killer.
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sprint burst
(Here I go with the headers again...)
Ok sure, Dead Hard gives less distance than Sprint burst, however, Dead Hard can be activated whenever you want to. If Sprint Burst was an activatable perk it would beat Dead Hard easily.
that other thing you said
There is a reason Dead Hard is so hated by killers, and it's the same reason NoED is hated by survivors. It's cheap, allows you to reap so much while sowing basically nothing, and can't necessarily be outplayed. (And don't even tell me how you expect anyone that isn't a 3-4 man SWF to get all totems done before all totems) You can't do anything to prevent Dead Hard.
free distance
Dead Hard also lets you take so many more risks because, well, see above. Feel free to try to loop that car again, because Dead Hard will let you. People can be so much riskier, and while it doesn't reward bad gameplay, it completely mitigates the downside of bad gameplay.
should looping be a thing?
Yes*
*But there should be a risk. Dead Hard completely removes that risk.
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Exactly.
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There is a huge cost to Dead Hard being activatable: less distance. There is a lot of risk to dead hard, as killers can bait it out (most of the time) or a 1-shot killer like Myers totally makes it void. Sprint Burst wins in both scenarios.
Why are we saying free distance instead of earned distance? You earned the perk, it should help you.
I don't see how Dead Hard is comparable to NOED. NOED makes you stronger for losing the entire game. Survivors don't have strong perks like killer perks.
Look how Parental Guidance compares to the new activatable Ruin perk with tinkerer built-in.
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Yes, exposed beats Dead Hard, but Myers and Ghosty aren't gonna be problems that much, but Dead Hard for distance means that baiting the Dead Hard is pointless.
And that less distance is nothing because it's often enough to get to that pallet or vault.
Getting the perk is not something done in a trial, and something the killer has no control over.
The perk should help you, just not render the killer completely pointless until you press "E"
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It is still no different than Sprint Burst. Sprint Burst avoids or delays hit like Dead Hard does.
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But Sprint Burst only prevents the first hit, say your caught at a gen, with a Pallet nearby. Sprint Burst will be wasted because you need to run to the pallet, but you would have made it Sprint Burst or not. Use Dead hard when it's convienient.
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What if you couldn't arrive to the pallet without the Sprint? There's even a chance Dead Hard wouldn't give enough distance, making Sprint Burst stronger.
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Then you can take the hit because you have dead hard, or, if you're injured you can Dead Hard for that distance and make it to that pallet, that's one scenario
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But if you are injured and used Dead Hard, it wouldn't give you enough distance.
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In a very Niche scenario like that, than yes, it would be worse.
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the perk used to work liek that and u could react to that now you can not, u die even with the "fix" u still die cause you can not "react" to the hit.
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NOED makes you stronger for losing the entire game.
Ah I love this incredible fallacy. You could be on 8 hooks, 90% pallets broken and still have NOED. "Lost all game" with 3 perks.
The activation conditions for NOED isn't "losing all game" but just the game progressing until all gens are done.
Did the killer earn NOED with anything? No, not in its current form hence why i for example proposed getting stack when hooking survivor and for each stack you get an instadown hit on your M1 or something like that.
And at the topic, you still don't get the difference between a SB at the beginning of the chase when the killer has the choice to abandon it instantly and hope to find the same survivor when still exhausted versus wasting over a minute in a chase only to be denied a hit and looped for another 30 seconds by an ON DEMAND perk.
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The I frames erase mistakes when the killer outplays you.
The distance erases mistakes/overestimation of your own looping capability, but also allows for greedy looping when DH is used by good survivors who don't overestimate their own looping capability but simply take the extra distance of Dead Hard into account.
Both are problems.
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They are. The question is what one is the lesser of two evils?
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Why choose between 2 evils? Why can't both be addressed?
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If you think dead hard distance is trash then you're either trash with the perk or you're a new player. Dead hard is fine as it is, just use it better. I'm a killer main and survivors still manage to get me with it even when I bait it out.
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Just make it so dead hard to give speed boost when you properly "dodge" hits with I-frame.
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Did you read two words and make the rest of the post up in your head or what?
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That just makes no sense. It's easier to either address the distance or the i-frames. Remove the i-frames or cut the distance by half. If even this is too much, then reduce the distance by 20~30% and replace the i-frames by a micro endurance, so at least they have to mend.
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i have a headache now.
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Killer mains: “Blight is too hard to play and Nurse is even harder”
Also killer mains: “ I keep sWiNiNg at the survivor who runs straight towards me all the time but I keep missing cause of that stupid deadhard perk and then they just vault the window DeRp”
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