MMR and Gen Rushing is unfair and it's the reason no one wants to play killer anymore

Options
SS007
SS007 Member Posts: 168

I literally only found swf matches and god tier looping survivors. I had a chance before the tests but now suddenly everyone is max MMR, gens are being rushed before I can hook someone even that I'm new I'm getting matched with impossible to catch survivors ? my matches since today were too difficult mostly 4 escape or 1 kill I'm not having any fun at all sadly just everyone teabaging at the exit gates over and over.

So a 100 hours killer main like myself I keep getting matched against thousands of hours survivors and especially swf players which makes the game x10 more difficult, I had too many big maps that 3 gens pop way too quickly before I down 1 survivors ? ######### ! I'm new I'm bad I'm trying to learn the game and killers so why is the game matching me with such elite players? they know where every pallet is located even with blood lust 3 it's too difficult every map has tons and tons of pallets and when you suffer chasing 1 survivor when you finally down them and hook you only have 1 gen left no one ever wants to interact with me they basically just want to rush gens and whenever I find one of them they're god tier loopers I have literally no chance everyone is constantly healed up thanks to boons and dead hard denies me every down.

Everyone spawns next to a gen and everyone is equipping tool boxes, I can't pip up at all I'm constantly getting -1 every match for the whole night played tons of matches with no chance of me winning, what's the point of pressuring gens if you can't end a chase because you're matched with god tier survivors ? they communicate your location so you're busy chasing one that you can't down wasting your time against 20 pallet and everyone else is doing gens, during mmr test I had a chance against normal survivors they make mistakes they also can't find gens easily and perks were okay but all my matches I'm only going against 4 perks DH , IW , UB , DS with someone of them using boons .

Even losing tons of games I'm not getting matched with similar skill survivors why gens are flying in 3 minutes, high mmr is toxic, stressful and sweaty this game doesn't reward you for improving it traps you into mmr hell a prey for 8000 hour survivors I never seen a game so unfair in it's matchmaking please remove mmr or balance it into matching normal survivors with you instead of automatically getting matched against Global Elite equivalent of DBD survivors.

«1

Comments

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    I mean these are fun ways to play the game some times but if you're goal is to reach rank 1 for the bloodpoint bonuses ect you won't gain any pip if you play that way.

  • Shaped
    Shaped Member Posts: 5,869
    Options

    That is why I let people go often. I know it is not a "healthy" solution but I adapt. I only go for 4k if people are toxic.

  • VirtuaTyKing
    VirtuaTyKing Member Posts: 452
    edited April 2022
    Options

    I level 3 bloodlust these so called god tier loopers and they get quicker too so you don't gain much ground. No doubt some are amazing but a lot of them are hackers. Comm squads are not fair and should be camped IMO If you do hook them. It's funny when all of a sudden you stop camping and they crap themselves.

  • hiken
    hiken Member Posts: 1,188
    Options

    u can alwqays play mega easy mode and win with no effort wich is equal to play nurse.

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Sadly the only solution is not to play the game which shows from all the comments that everyone is suffering :/

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Nurse is difficult and speaking of nurse why the other killers ain't as good as her ? so if you want to win you need to main a boring killer like nurse and suffer through 500 hours to just learn her properly

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Thank you for the valuable information :) I currently main ghost face and I'm trying to learn huntress I tried blight but I only won like 20% of the matches I played with him , I did well with nurse but then she became difficult for me probably because pro survivors can easily juke her , I bought most of the dlc's so I have decent perks , I didn't enjoy pyramid head he is too difficult can be easily dodged , oni isn't my cup of tea , slinger is too weak and slow but yeah I think I'm doing well mostly with Ghost Face because I'm used to stealth in other video games.

    But as I said and you said too the system pooped itself because there isn't much killer players so me hitting red ranks even that I'm new doomed my mmr and the game only sacrifices me for the fun of high skill survivors so trying to learn a new killer is ridiculous because pro survivors will destroy and bully you because you can't play that killer perfectly.

  • Sluzzy
    Sluzzy Member Posts: 3,130
    Options

    You are the killer and it's really your job to prevent the genrushing through pressuring the gens. Killer is the easiest it has ever been.

  • ElleGreen
    ElleGreen Member Posts: 1,063
    Options

    maybe you are just playing badly watch killer videos on youtube try to get better at early game :)

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    I'm not playing badly I had easy 4k's in match making tests I'm decent enough I checked some profiles and player and I'm getting too much twitch streamers the overall playtime of these are by thousands so why I'm not playing against fellow new survivors ?

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options
  • ElleGreen
    ElleGreen Member Posts: 1,063
    Options

    mmr does suck though vhs and the quarry come out soon maybe take a dbd break also evil dead

  • ThatOneDemoPlayer
    ThatOneDemoPlayer Member Posts: 5,623
    Options

    Gen-Rushing doesn't exist, the Survivors are just doing their objective as efficiently as possible. If you're having trouble with that, start tunneling and camping and generally playing as efficiently as you can

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options
  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Yeah I just want to hit rank 1 both in survivor and killer at least once or twice then I won't care that much anymore gold is good enough for bp rewards

  • ThatOneDemoPlayer
    ThatOneDemoPlayer Member Posts: 5,623
    Options

    If you're interested in pips, then just go for the 12 Hooks and ignore the outcome of a match. If you're complaining about efficiency but don't play efficiently yourself, you don't really have a reason to complain

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,832
    Options

    I don't think I've ever reached Iri 1 as survivor. I struggled even to hit gold during the months I tried. Teammates are too inconsistent. Killer was rather easy to reach Iri 1 on, really, I didn't have to rely on teammates to pip, but it wasn't fun. One million BP for Iri 1 is nice, but then I spend it and it seems like I unlock so little for all that effort, so... yeah, it only took two months for the ridiculous grind and the stress of pipping to burn me out and convince me the grade rewards aren't worth it.

    That's just me, though. With all sincerity, I hope you're able to get more out of grade rewards than I did.

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    12 hooks ? How would you do that if you're struggling to hook 1 or 2 survivors ? Gens will get rushed too quickly they will deny you the 12 hooks everyone would escape before that with this meta and matchmaking.

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Thank you for your amazing comments I appreciate it I wish everyone commented In such polite way

  • ThatOneDemoPlayer
    ThatOneDemoPlayer Member Posts: 5,623
    Options

    I'm saying you should go for the 12 Hooks if you're interested in Pips. If you don't care about Pips, you would tunnel and camp. If you want Pips but don't like how fast gens are going, play Nurse or Blight, I guess?

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Let me explain my point you start playing as a new killer Main you I prove slowly till your mmr skyrockets in 100 hours only then you're trapped because there isn't an equal amount of killers and survivors the game decides that you're high enough to play against max mmr survivors but you're barely new compared to them so you're just trying to figure out chasing methods and practicing killers but in every match you face max mmr survivors that gen rush and loop effectively and watching famous streams playing DBD even pro killers are struggling so I literally have no chance.

    The game is certainly survivor sided especially when they main survivor for thousands of hours killers can't compete.

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Well that's the problem you just confirmed that the game is not balanced and unfair if you don't play nurse or blight right ? I played the ######### out of them but they're too difficult I can't even down survivors with blight ability I don't want to play the dark souls version of killers to win.. All killers should be equally balanced and rewarding plus nurse is boring I don't enjoy her at all why would I torture myself playing her.

  • ThatOneDemoPlayer
    ThatOneDemoPlayer Member Posts: 5,623
    Options

    The game isn't balanced if you're not playing efficiently, against Survivors that are playing efficiently

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    But is it my problem to get matched against efficient survivors that practiced the game for thousands of hours when I'm barely 100 hours into it?

  • ThatOneDemoPlayer
    ThatOneDemoPlayer Member Posts: 5,623
    Options

    No, that isn't your problem, it's the fault of our lovely Skill-Based Match Making System

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,832
    edited April 2022
    Options

    Np :)

    Besides the normal "get better" or "play Nurse/Blight" suggestions, there are a few other things that might help you pip while also avoiding high-MMR hell. These are how I got to Iri 1 as killer. If you already know this stuff, I apologize; you mentioned being new. (I also apologize that you got sucked into this game. It is extremely punishing for new players, and honestly I'm not sure it actually gets better once you gain experience.)

    One thing to keep in mind is that every killer has their own somewhat-separate MMR. So, if you want to lower your MMR, you have to do it with the killer you'll be playing as. Memeing with Pig to get easier matches as Doctor won't work very well.

    I'm sure you noticed that you can depip within a grade but can't depip to a lower grade. So, each time you make it to the next grade, go for a bunch of matches without killing anyone. Killing and killing alone is what raises MMR. Your grade is completely separate and unrelated to your MMR. All that stuff you do to pip, all those hooks you get, those are irrelevant to matchmaking, so feel free to continue practicing and getting better even when you're not killing. Try to enjoy those matches, throw seriousness out the window if you need to and remind yourself it's just a game.

    If you're getting matches with experienced survivors despite letting everyone go for many matches in a row, then it's just not your day. Whenever the queue gets long, it starts throwing basically anyone together regardless of skill level to get them into a match. Your MMR becomes pretty much irrelevant when that happens. Unfortunately, this may be the main problem you're running into, and there's no getting around it except playing on different days or at different times of the day.

    Yeah, that's cheesing the system, but I see nothing wrong with it when the system is bad in so many ways. The better solution would be for BHVR to improve their skill-based matchmaking system and fix emblems/pipping, but that could be a long time away if it ever even happens, and it's not something we the players have any control over, so in the meantime there's cheesing it.


    No one asked, but if you're curious, I reached Iri 1 as Nemesis on PS4 with cross-play on in the North America region (I think East coast?). I used the perks Lightborn, Beast of Prey, BBQ, and either Distressing or Starstruck (Starstruck is good for ensuring you get hooks, but it can hurt the Chaser emblem). No add-ons. In case it's not obvious, that's not a good build. If you equip actually useful perks, you'll make it easier on yourself. Most killers should run at least one gen slowdown perk.

    If you don't care about pipping and just want to have fun, then letting survivors go is your best bet to getting better matches. I've had times where I killed one survivor and suddenly my matches were filled with people running the meta. Pipping and having fun in the game shouldn't be mutually exclusive, but in my opinion they unfortunately are.

    Like you mentioned, BHVR is testing new matchmaking systems, so if you had good matches before but aren't having good matches now it's hopefully just temporary. BHVR's skill-based matchmaking has been unpopular since the day it released, so I'm kind of glad to see they're working on it but also every time BHVR touches anything I get worried they'll make things worse. All we can do is wait and see, really, and give them feedback when they do these tests.

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Thank you for the information I have one question bI didn't understand if I don't kill anyone but hook everyone as much as I can I can pip ? The only problem is that they will finish gens quickly and no more hooks. And yeah I agree with you in many aspects I really hope these tests help them decide what's better for the game, I personally shared my feedback daily too :).

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    And I appreciate that you acknowledge how the game is not fair and all the issues unlike many that say play blight or nurse or similar solutions.

  • sulaiman
    sulaiman Member Posts: 3,214
    Options

    I had approches with the Doctor with Noed, Starstruck, Bloodwarden, Iron Grip. You wait till they finished the gens, blast away, down one, open the gate, trigger blood warden, kill the rest. Only problem is that often too few hooks are around the gate. Puts the game right at a position when you are in power. If it doesn´t work, it doesnt last long. If it works, you just got the fun part of the match.

  • malloymk
    malloymk Member Posts: 1,542
    Options

    Umm, you're not just entitled to easy wins. This goes for survivors too.

    Sure you can be annoyed when you get rekt, but sometimes the other side is just better than you. Sometimes the map RNG comes in to play.

    But ultimately you can only do your best and hope that you come out on top. This mentality that survivors should do gens slowly, just for your ease of game play is just the definition of entitlement.

  • DrDeepwound
    DrDeepwound Member Posts: 2,557
    edited April 2022
    Options

    rank 1 was meaningless years ago and meaningless now. Once you get the achivement, fun and BP are the only reason to play the game imo. Ranks measure time played not skill, theres some really good kilers who only have a few hours per week to play ;)

  • Starrseed
    Starrseed Member Posts: 1,755
    Options

    Sure easiest it has ever been. Killer suffer from bad balincing bad map balance unfair swf advantages but hey its super easy.

    I still don't know if you are

    A. A fkn troll

    Or

    B. You really think what you say is real

    In case of B I'm sorry for you if even half of the stuff you say here would get into the game you could enjoy your "perfect" game for roughly a month and the you'll have a q simulation because no killers are left

  • Sluzzy
    Sluzzy Member Posts: 3,130
    Options

    The argument can also be turned around, where majority of survivors lose because of bad balancing. A casual team shouldn't have to deal with an overpowered Blight for example. Majority of survivors are unable to overcome all the slowdown perks killers use, and exposed perks like OP starstruck and even Devour Hope can win a killer a game.

    But I think killers want every match to be ez without having to put much effort into it.

  • MilManson
    MilManson Member Posts: 939
    edited April 2022
    Options

    You say that like the typical survivor main that's never actually played the killer.

    Dead hard.

    Boons.

    Oppressive DS.

    Gen speeds.

    Huge maps.

    Medkits.

    Repair kits.

    Oh and let's not forget how every map is filled with infinites, god pallets into a jungle gym, into another pallet loop and into another jungle gym.

    They need to reduce the amount of hook stages to kill survivors to two, 3 per survivor is too much now when gens can be done in mere minutes.

    I just tunnel people to death now because playing fair gives you no kills and the survivors a free escape.

  • MilManson
    MilManson Member Posts: 939
    Options

    Oh and mori should become baseline.

  • Sluzzy
    Sluzzy Member Posts: 3,130
    Options

    None of those are strong. DS is literally the most counterable perk in the game. If you find it oppressive it means you are a compulsive tunneler. Dead Hard can be baited. Maps are actually too small because high mobility killers with oppressive meta builds are too overpowered for normal teams to have a chance at winning.

    How can a medkit be too strong in a survivor horror game? I'm sorry to break this news to you but if you are losing to medkits, it means you are losing a lot of chases. It is the killer's fault if they are healing.

    The game actually holds the hand for the killer when chases are too long: vaults are blocked when the survivor repeatedly outplays a killer. Bloodlust, a free mechanic to help killers, makes you move faster when you take too long to outplay a survivor.

    Tunneling needs a nerf too. There is actually no counterplay to be tunneled. The game says you lost although the killer decided to make it a 1v1.

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,832
    Options

    The requirements for pipping change as you get to higher grades, getting more and more difficult. When you're in the Ash levels, you can probably pip without killing anyone. By the time you get to Iri, pipping requires kills.

    But, my recommendation is that each time you reach a new grade (for example, going from Silver III to Silver II) you should play a few games where you don't try to pip. You cannot depip from Silver II back to Silver III, so there's no reason not to take a breather. Go for some matches without killing anyone and let your MMR go down. MMR is based solely on kills and has nothing to do with pips or grades. If you keep your MMR low, then hopefully you'll get survivors who are slower on gens and that alone will make pipping so much easier.

    Reading this thread, I saw you understand the basics of how to pip (like that camping penalizes you), but if you have any questions about the specifics of the emblem system then feel free to ask. The emblem system has been unintuitive since before I started playing back in 2018. For example, a lot of people don't realize that playing a killer with a one-hit down can make pipping more difficult: Plague, Bubba, Ghostface, Myers, etc. hurt their own Chaser emblem by using their power. If you've ever wondered why a Trapper hits someone who's already stuck in a trap, it's because otherwise he doesn't get points for winning a chase. Legion, meanwhile, is basically guaranteed to get an iridescent Chaser emblem if he stabs people in feral frenzy, because each stab counts as winning a chase. (Legion suffers in the Malicious emblem, though, which penalizes killers when survivors heal, and I'm pretty sure Legion gets punished twice over because of the Deep Wound state. The Malicious emblem is the one I personally find most difficult to deal with; getting 4 kills is basically what's going to get it to gold or iri so it's like the annoying twin of the Devout emblem.)

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    I also said that I always check their streams they're usually like prestige level 10+ minimum

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Thank you for explaining and yeah the emblem system is weird I had matches before that I did really good ram around the map like a maniac did tons of chases and hooks and kills but didn't pip at all it I agree killers like nurse don't pip easily.

  • eaebree
    eaebree Member Posts: 288
    Options

    Game should not be balanced around people wanting to win all the time and have easy games adapt and git gud end of story

  • gentacle
    gentacle Member Posts: 260
    Options

    Let's add 2-3 generators extra for the survivors to do, would solve everything as I hear they love to hold m1 and prove thyself exists ;)

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,832
    Options

    Yeah, you can be good at killing with a certain killer but not good at pipping with the same killer. It's one of those things that takes emblem knowledge and experimentation. It's a numbers game with needing a certain number of hooks and a certain number of won chases. And of course the Gatekeeper emblem, which benefits from gens going slowly, which is part of why inefficient survivors are so valuable when trying to pip.

    This goes towards why I found getting to Iri 1 to not be worth the trouble. Pipping requires dragging out the match to get hooks and win chases while also preventing gens from getting done, which becomes a micro-managing nightmare if survivors are halfway decent. I also had too many matches where someone died on their first hook or disconnected, and then I had to inflate my Chaser emblem by slugging the remaining survivors at least once each before killing them to make sure I minimized the number of points that one survivor cost me. It would happen multiple times in a row, which led to me being quite annoyed that I had to kill to avoid depipping but probably couldn't pip up so I was just increasing my MMR while my grade stagnated and the matches went on for what felt like an eternity. Someone dying early damns the remaining survivors in terms of escaping, but it also damns the killer in terms of pipping. It was a huge relief if I managed to squeeze a pip out of a match with an early death/disconnect.

    Nurse is a weird one due to her slow speed. Survivors are constantly gaining enough distance during chases that the game no longer actually considers them to be in a chase, which means the Nurse lost that chase. Then she gets closer and it starts a new chase, and the cycle continues until the survivor goes down or the Nurse focuses on someone else. If you're not a god-tier Nurse getting constant immediate downs, you're probably going to struggle with pipping. (I don't know for sure, though, because Nurse is practically impossible to play on console. I haven't played her since she had that power bar added to her Blinks.)

  • SS007
    SS007 Member Posts: 168
    Options

    Adding to that nurse is a nightmare in most of the indoor maps if you're not good enough or good enough at predicting so during her cooldowns survivors can through multiple rooms and that's it you lost track and takes forever to find them again with her slow speed and I agree with everything you said I had similar experience when I used to win some games too quickly you'd need to leave survivors escape so you gain more points it's a very inconsistent system sadly too difficult in high mmr where everyone is efficient as you said.

  • MrsGhostface
    MrsGhostface Member Posts: 987
    Options

    I swear these modern killers would have uninstalled if they were playing before 2021. As you said, easiest it has ever been.