Reducing the Grind
Am I the only player that realizes their attempt at grind reduction actually is making you grind 150 levels for every character instead of 40?
That is the OPPOSITE of grind reduction.
Comments
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Um, that's not how it works.
Think of it being the exact same as it is now. Except, when you prestige, all your characters unlock the teachable perks automatically if they don't have it. Forever.
And if you already have perks unlocked on those characters for other characters you HAVEN'T prestiged, they still keep them, provided you wait until the rework where you KEEP everything upon prestiging.
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So its around 5 million BP per character to get all their perks at T3 for everyone else.
Where as before it was 1.3 million BP to unlock the perks, and depending on how many perks you don't have unlocked could be another 3-4 million to unlock the perks you want.
How much exactly does this reduce the grind?
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Wrong. We asked for grind reduction.
That is NOT reduction, that is an increase of 150-40=110
Simple math.
We offered MANY solutions that were acceptable and they used none of the players' ideas, coming up with a way that will make people have to grind more than ever before in order to reach that relief.
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You had to get a character to level 40 to make their perks available to be found in other blood webs by chance.
Now when you get a character to 50 and prestige them, every other character automatically learns the level 1 version of all three of that prestige’d characters perks instantly.
Then you can just grab the level 2 and 3 versions of these perks when ever you level the character you want to play.
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That isn't in question. The most popular grind relief suggestion was to unlock teachables immediately.
My favorite suggestion was to get rid of tier one and tier two perks completely.
They chose to go with a method that will make players have to level 110 more levels per character to even get that grind reduction.
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Except instead of grinding 6 Bloodweb for Tier3 of 2 perks. For other ~30 characters.
Now you only grind 2 Bloodweb, which mean you reduce 120 Bloodweb. And thats only 2 perks
I still prefer removing Tier instead.
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So here is the question for all those people that believe this is grind reduction.
Scenario: A new player starts after this is out.
Question: How many levels do they have to get to have all perks on one character?
Answer: Still exactly the same. NOTHING HAS OR WILL HAVE CHANGED. For survivors that means 31 x 40 levels. Plus you still have to level the character you want to actively play until they get all perks, or you have to level ALL characters to prestige 3 (that's 31 x 150) to get all perks. That is an insane amount of time that ONLY people who invest 40+ hours a week for years can achieve.
There is no grind reduction in this. Nothing has changed.
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Old Method:
I can level Nemesis to 40 to get Lethal Pursuer.
I then want that perk on Dredge. I can level him to 50 without it showing up. I could level him to 50, without any perks I really want showing up.
New Method:
I can prestige Nemesis once.
Every other killer now knows Level 1 of Lethal Pursuer as well as his other two teachables, immediately. I can then just level up my perks as I level my new Dredge. I don’t have to worry about Bloodweb Roulette giving me a perk I want or not.
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Grinds reduced because prestiging is now an automated system with no loss. Even if you ignore grabbing teachables and just leveling up a character you passively earn those perks on every other character anyway.
Sure you grind more in the short term, but in the long term grind is massively reduced
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The grind is literally reduced with the new prestige system.
I would've considered just not losing perks/items/add ons/offerings a decent change to reduce grind, but what we're getting is ten times better lol. How does what we're getting not reduce the grind.
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I hope you are the only one who thinks the grind reduction somehow made the grind worse.
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It only helps people trying to max everything. If you aren't then it doesn't do much.
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It's more of a consultation prize for the unlucky few.
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Old System: Get a Character to level 40 to have a chance of finding their perks in the bloodweb of other characters.
New System: Get a Character to level 50 and now all other characters current and future automatically learn the level 1 tier of that leveled characters perks. They have it. You can equip it and use it.
That does *a lot*.
No more are you leveling bloodwebs praying for Entity RNG to give you the perks you want. You've already got them. Leveling up the character you want to play, *which you'd be doing anyway for items, add ons, and offerings* will just unlock the higher tiers which is a lot easier than hoping for that one perk that just isn't showing up.
You don't need to P3 someone to get the Tier 3 of their perks unlocked.
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I'm liking the sound of the new prestige system. I remember p3ing my trapper and it took me till like lvl 90 for the bloodweb to unlock ruin. This was back when Pig came out. The roster has nearly doubled since then. If I prestige a killer I will flat out have their perks unlocked for all killers. Less rng.
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Apparently there are a lot of people that don't understand the word REDUCTION. It means less. If you add more work, more grind, you are not reducing the grind.
To be clear I am NOT saying that this move is a bad change. It is an excellent change that should have been included from the beginning of the game. What I am saying is that this is not going to save any one that hasn't already prestige-3'd every single one of their characters ANY time at all. It will cost you more time to get this relief, which means a reward for ADDED grind, NOT A GRIND REDUCTION! Also, a quick word for those that might think they can gain some sort of advantage, I suggest that you DO NOT go out and grind prestige-3 right now. After this change you won't lose your items, right now you still lose everything when you prestige your characters.
So, back to the point. A new player will still have the same exact grind ahead of them in order to play this game. They will not have less grind at all. If you think they will have less grind then you are confused by the hype, which was the entire point of wording this change in this way. I believe something like this was the pitch, 'Let's make the player base think that they are getting something for grind reduction while we are actually going to reward them for more grinding than most of them ever finished before. While we're at it, let's unlock unlimited grind for those who are addicted to grinding and their reward will be that they can brag about being the best at grinding!' I can't wait to laugh at the players that brag, "I'm prestige-4 on killer/survivor!"
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I think Kisfenkin is missing a few key components of this
Once you get a perk on the blood web, its there forever, no need to get it again after each Prestige.
Once you P1 - ALL survivors get it automatically - not on their future bloodweb where you then have to get it to actually use it.
This is a huge reduction. If you have all survivors - its 150 levels to give those 3 perks to every survivor at tier 3
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I understand entirely how it works.
I have all characters at level 40 or higher. In the current system I can level a new character to 40 and then level a main character 12 levels and I will be done. Total levels required = 52
In order to use the new system at all you have to level 110 more levels. Total levels required = 150.
How is this so difficult to understand. OH, I get it, you are one of those people that ONLY use four perks on every single character. Okay, now let me explain in terms of META PERKS!
You leveled those four characters to 40 to unlock those four perks. Now you have to level them 440 more levels to get access to the grind relief.
440 MORE LEVELS. NOW DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT 440 is not a reduction of grind? What happens when an old perk becomes META? Now you have to grind another 110 levels. What happens when a new character has a meta perk? You have to grind 150 levels to get these rewards.
This is not a reduction. Not even a little bit. What will now happen is that we will see even more amazing perks on new characters that everyone will want to grind prestige-3 for, then they will be nerfed into oblivion. Don't think they use this strategy to sell? I have one thing to say to that, Mettle of Man.
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It’s grind reduction because all your future characters also instantly get all the perks you’ve already unlocked by Prestiging. For example, say I’ve already Prestiged all my characters today, and I buy Dredge tomorrow. Dredge will IMMEDIATELY have all the perks except his own teachables and generics. I don’t have to touch his bloodweb at all and he’ll have about 70 perks in his inventory.
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I think the point here ìs that if u want the guaranteed tier 3 perks on all characters ud hafta P3 every single character. Sure, u could P1 characters and technically have the t1 perk versions on all other characters.....but the later upgrades would still be RNG. They might take 200 levels to pop up on another character. So really, to get the most out of it, ud be forced to grind EVERYTHING to P3. Thats still a massive time sink that MOST people are not gonna have the time for. So in the end it does very little for new or casual players. That means it will do little to nothing when it comes to growing the playerbase... and thats one of the biggest issues facing DBD. Over the years ive tried to get at least 15 different people into this game and not a single one of em stuck around. I dont think this change will do anything to fix that.
That said, i think the change is interesting and im looking forward to it....but i dont think its gonna make the grind feel any better. Just different.
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No, it seems you do NOT understand how it works, and what a great reduction it actually is when you want to P3+AllPerks every character (which is commonly done for the killer grind):
CURRENT SYSTEM:
You have all killer maxed out (P3 Max perks), and a new killer gets released. You have to P3 this new killer, get him all the perks from all the other killers, AND level all the other killers for the new killers perks:
A) Leveling from 1 to 50 roughly takes 1.5-1.6 million BP. So to get to P3-50, its about 6.0-6.4 million BP.
B) You will have reached about 60 perk tiers (~ 20 tier 3 perks) on level 50. We are currently at 279 perk tiers (or 93 perks). So to max out the perks, you will have to get another 219 perk tiers, or 110 bloodwebs if the entity never srews you (by eating up your second perk). One bloodweb takes 50k if you spend BP wisely, so its 110*50k BP = 5.5 MIllion BP to max out the perks on the new killer.
C) We currently have 27 killlers, so when a new one gets released, all that 27 need to get the new perks. So 9 per tierks / 5 bloodwebs for each of the 27 killers: 27 * 5 * 50k BP = 140 * 50k BP = 7 million BP
So all in all, to be very optimistic, you need 18.5 (6+5.5+7) million BP to P3-maxPerk every killer when the new one drops. And with every new killer, that grind gets even worse (for B and C, A does not change). Imagine how much BP you would have to spend for B and C with 50 or 100 killers ...
NEW SYSTEM:
You have to level a new killer to P3-1 to unlock it's teachables for every other killer. You do not have to grind at all for the teachables of all the other killer, you just get them bc theay are already P3. You do not have to level the other killers bc they will get the teachables "for free":
A) The same grind as before, so 6.0 million BP.
B) You only have to grind for common perks, all others you will et via prestiging. There are 12 (+1 after next update) common perks for all killers, so 36 perk tiers totally you have to grind. Since you no longer lose perks after prestiging, you will have maxed out all the perks when still in P1. So no additional grind for maxing out at all.
C) No longer required, you will get the perks automatically after P3 the new killer.
So all in all, it's just the 6 million BP to get all perks maxed out for all killers. SInce it's not even necessary to reach P3-50 at all, you can evn stop at P3-1, so only 4.5 million BP. And the best of it, that amount does NOT INCREASE with more and more characters (killers) being added. Even if we had 500 killers already, adding another one would still only cost you this 4.5 million to get all perks again.
THATS the reduction we are talking about! As I've laid out, with the next killer to come you need about 18.5 mio BP to max that one and every other killer out again. With the new proclaimed system, its only 4.5 miliion NP, so just 25% of it.
Yes, you might have to level more in your situation (just having 3-4 charcters maxed out), but thats a laughable compared to the endeavour of maxing out all available characters.
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