Dead Hard Experiment
I did an experiment around DH because I saw Otz do something like it, out of 50 games with Trickster, 148/200 had DH, opinions please.
Comments
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I do main Trickster just for the hell of it, so I’m good at him which means lots of 3ks. So yes I am high MMR
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Err, we been knew, dead hard is a popular and certainly necessary perk with the current state of the game.
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idk about necessary
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Imo it is, many people think the same. Some don’t.
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It is I played games without perks to get achiement and killer got 4K every single game but with dh I would extended most chases and at least survived few of those games.
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This doesn't mean it's necessary. From your comment, it seems you believe that dead hard making the difference between winning and losing games makes it necessary, though all it seems to me is that you're not good enough to loop without it as a crutch. This doesn't mean it's necessary, it means you rely on it too much.
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All my teammates had dh but they went lot sooner down than me so I did what I could but that distance was just needed in these mstches and agains't nurse or blight it's only good counter.
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Once again, this doesn't make it necessary. If the problem is that there's killers so strong, the devs should try and fix that to make it fair for everyone. Not everyone wants to play Blight or Nurse every game, nor does every killer want to face 4 dead hards every match. If dead hard is the only counter to these killers, they shouldn't punish all other killers. They also shouldn't punish survivors for going against these killers either.
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The way you worded those posts makes it seem like you and you alone are the sole reason your team loses or wins any game depending on if you have DH or not. It's either that or you are saying that without 4 DH's no Survivor team has a chance at winning.
Both of those are simply wrong.
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For actually good survivors? nah. Now people that only win because of the 2 minutes their overall team buys with dead hard for distance.... yes.
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Yeah I get bad teammates all the time. Someone has to make up for it
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It depends really. Against some anti-loop killers (which are more and more frequent) it's necessary if you wanna loop for more than 30 seconds (considering the killer is decently good).
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My opinion.. if you find so many dh, and dh is a third heal state and you have a lot of 3k with trickster... killers are op
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I'm just glad that DH (like most meta perks) is getting reworked. Far too many players use it for distance instead of it's actual intended purpose.
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In it's current state it's not necessary....if your using it for the IFrames that's fine but if your using it to gain distance to extend loops then that's not fine and that's the reason the Devs are looking at nerfing it tbh.
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Its not necessary at all. You can run a killer long enough to waste their time and buy your teammates plenty of time without it. If you end up using it early because you were caught in a deadzone or the killer outplayed you then..... oh well? Too bad? You should get hit.
For inexperienced players it reinforces bad habits, and for good players its completely unnecessary and just helps reinforce the usage of generator slowdown perks.
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It is a popular perk that works as a chase extender. Aka what it is meant for.
If there was another perk that also worked during close-up chases rather than to gain long distances you would see it used as well.
We need more perks like DH because otherwise the meta turns to playing it extremely safe and holding W. Which can be unfun.
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No, we don't need more Perks that let the Survivor 1v1 the Killer
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If you are getting 3ks on average, doesn't that mean that even with Dead Hard, survivors need buffs?
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If we're going by the devs' logic, no, Trickster is fine. Nurse and Trickster are the only Killers with a kill rate below 50%.
If we're going by a normal player's logic, still no, Trickster never has been a good Killer, and probably never will be.
His chases take too long if Survivors ShiftW/use tiles with high walls, and he has no mobility or any way to pressure Survivors other than being situationally oppressive if Survivors are unlucky and get found in a Dead-Zone
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It depends. If the developers are taking the 50% kill rate across all levels of play (which is the data the developers gave us), then you are right. However, if the developers are breaking the kill rate down by skill-level (which the developers have not given us), then you wouldn't be right.
I would hope the developers break it down by skill level, then make adjustments, but I don't know.
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Uh, no. Trickster has a ranged power so he’s a hard counter to DH, I don’t hit them I plunge knives into there back and DH is always used just to avoid one knife, but this is about how much DH is used, not how good I am at the game. Survivors get a buff every 3 months, via perks, so no need to buff survivors.
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I truly hope the show us kill rates at high MMR, it wouldn't surprise me to see the majority of Killers under the 50% mark
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Yeah that’s why survivors go down immediately after dead Harding. Totally unfair 1v1. 🙄
I get it you don’t like the perk. That’s not a reason to say it is 1v1ing a killer. Maybe YOU are the one who feels that way because you can’t manage. So learn to manage.
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Lets make a fictional perk, lets call it Boon: Steady Feet, this perk allows you to use your exhaustion perk twice, and decreases exhaustion 50% faster. Sounds OP right? Well that’s what DH is like, a perk that extends chases by 40 years, so is I used Balanced Landing Twice I would be able to extend the chase by at least 1-2 minutes.
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DH can be used to save yourself by dashing to a window or pallet, you cant just bait it, you can’t manage a survivor that has a perk that allows them to save themselves by getting to a pallet faster.
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Continue to exaggerate and see if the devs take you serious.
Because those of us who play killer and know how to deal with it, don’t.
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I’m not exaggerating it at all, I main killer, so I know how to deal with DH, but you can’t deflect the fact that most survivors don’t go down after using DH because they use it to get to a window or pallet without dying, try to deflect that point
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No need to make your inability to play the game well that obvious
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Also the devs in the anniversary stream said that DH takes up too much of the meta, so they plan on reworking or nerfing it. THE DEVS DIRECTLY SAID THAT DH IS TOO OVER POWERED AND WILL BE NERFED.
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Funniest shite I’ve ever read
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Oh I think it’s the other way around. See, the difference is I see all perspectives of how a perk works.
The downsides, it’s weaknesses, it’s strengths, it’s counters. I take all of it into consideration to form my opinion.
Dead Harding to a pallet (aka what you keep repeating on the daily) isn’t an issue for me because that scenario isn’t always on display or the only one I see when I play against it.
I also see people who Dead Hard because they were found in a bad spot. I also see people who think they had enough distance on me that they wouldn’t get hit through a vault. I also see people who quite frankly should have brought any other exhaustion perk and it would have served them better.
You however seem to have matches where a survivor is just dashing on loop and to a pallet, because it sounds like you are unable to deal with it.
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The devs never said it’s overpowered. This just goes to show how bias you really are.
They said it is used a lot. That doesn’t mean it’s OP.
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They could've used different colors, lol, spine chill and IW are literally the same colors
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We need to take in everything else, map RNG, what perks Trickster was using, what add ons etc, we can't gather EVERYTHING from one simple table
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I will continually say it: DH is nowhere near as ridiculously OP as people make out.
- Most baby survivors don't even have it (unless they play David)
- Mid-tier survivors use it quite often but will literally use it just to dodge a hit (the point of the perk). They more than often still go down mere seconds after using it, particularly when they panic DH.
- Sure, seasoned survivors really know how to use it at the exact right moment and usually manage to extend their chases. However, these are the minority and I don't believe any killer mains that say they repeatedly go against high MMR survivors who know how to impeccably use DH every single time. I say this as someone who 50/50's both sides - I more than often see survivors do goofy things like DH into a rock or a wall or something. It makes me whiff and then they go down like 3 seconds later. 😂
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The last time I've seen a survivor dead hard into a wall was actual months ago.
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They are almost definitely showing us the kill rates across all levels of play, just look at the kill rates for the Nurse. The Nurse would have the highest kill rate of all the killers at high MMR.
However, I do hope the developers are balancing across all levels of play and aren't take the over stats as a way to balance everything.
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^This Exactly.
Can you imagine how awful it will be for Killers when they have 4 Sprint Bursts in a lobby being used by the best players of the game.
The killers think Sprint Burst isn't bad, until they have a 100% reliable exhaustion perk used by the best survivor players.
I really honestly think that Killers are confusing how good Dead Hard is with how well expert survivor players use Dead Hard. The same thing will happen with Sprint Burst when suddenly expert survivor players are using it.
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fair enough, but they say that the perk makes the meta stale, and meta perks are the best perks. And you don’t have to come off like a piece of crap, you could’ve just said, “I disagree, DH is a fair and balanced perk.” But you had to say,” learn to manage better” and then you said Im super bias, and other rude things to people. Again, this experiment wasn’t about how OP DH is, it’s about how many people use it.
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As a killer main, who wins most games, I see survivors dash to pallets and windows most of the time, not run into me to avoid the hit
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I mean if dbd had only nurse in the game, yep dead hard is needed.
Btw your post shows exactly how survivors are addicted to using dead hard.
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Thank
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I don't use dead hard and i do perfectly fine
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Experiment or observation?
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A closer equivalent to dead hard would be a killer perk that lets you press a button after a survivor successfully dodges an attack which causes them to take damage anyway.
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So if you're a killer main - DH isn't that much of a problem then if you win most games? 🤔
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Ah yes, all killer are op because trickster, the killer that ignores dh THE EASIEST with his knives, isn't too bothered by the perk next to nurse and blight.
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I would call those "stats" just as subjective as the rest on this forum.
I threw my games for more than a year, so my MMR should've been rock bottom at the end and even then many survivor used dead hard more often to reach a pallet or a window than to dodge a hit.
And you might call my experience also subjective but i wouldn't believe yours more than mine and simply end at agree to disagree.
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Experiment
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