Why is BT getting buffed in the meta perk nerf?
BT needs to be weaker if it's going to get a nerf. What you posted as a preliminary change makes it stronger than it is now.
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The devs said they wanted kill rates to go up so they made more free endgame escape perks and made NOED easy to find ::shrugs::
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It is kind of weird that they buffed a perk that was already S+ tier, meta, and arguable in the top 3 best perks in the game.
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the only nerfed perk about the survivor's meta was decisive strike, everything else is the same or even BUFFED (dead hard in some cases and borrowed time)
Post edited by Tostapane on8 -
Because they want people to stop using meta perks.
Wait...
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Dbd devs : Lets make a survivor meta perk basekit, and also buff that same meta perk.
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no one will use BT anyway, there's one, waaaay longer "bt" after unhook, aka OTR
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Yeah. Everyone is gonna replace BT for OTR.
But let's wait till the release, when it'll be nerfed to the ground instead of just being balanced.
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That is not correct. DH, SC, SC, IW - these perks got absolutely destroyed and will almost completely disappear. Only Self Care with Botany Knowledge will remain to be used - and is "better" than before if you used them together.
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DH wasn't nerfed... They literally reworked that perk (in a lazy way I might add since it's essentially a styptic agent on demand for 1 second)... It's stronger in some situations and worse in others, but overall it wasn't nerfed to the ground as you said. Selfcare didn't deserve to being nerfed so much (at least bothany was buffed to compensate and if you run both you won't waste too much time healing). spine chill was a bit overnerfed (still it deserves some nerfs since that perk completely countered stealth killers) and iron will needed to be nerfed since this perk alone was enough to completely counter spirit's power, without mentioning that it was nerfed also to put on the same spot with stridor (and still it was nerfed less than stridor)
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IW might of been over nerfed too....imo it should of been lowered to 80-90% so survivors could still stealth a bit but Stridor could be useful again and the can't use while exhausted makes so feasible sense.
DS was a good choice but PTB will tell if 3 sec is too much of a Nerf or not.... personally 4 sec might of been better since you lose 1 sec to the animation.
DH is now will take skill to use and not oh no I made a mistake I'll hit E to gain some ground to that pallet.
But like IW some other etf why they do that was Ruin losing its regression and is disabled after 1 kill....if they made it a regular perk then all that is fine but it's a Hex...it's supposed to be stronger than normal perks.
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You kidding right?
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no because i'm right... adrenaline? same as before. dead hard? reworked, stronger in some situations, worse in others. prove thyself? same. BT? BUFFED. unbrekable? same as before. IW? slightly nerfed. you even gain new meta perks like off the records and overzealous
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Dont forget about off the record.
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Iron Will wasn't a slight nerf it was a solid nerf. Spine Chill got nerfed so bad it makes Premonition look good, Self Care is essentially worthless on it's own now.
Yeah Off The Record sounds bad on paper, if they add the same effect that DS has about it deactivating after gens powered it's not as crazy as it sounds.
Overzealous got buffed yeah? They have to incentivise gen perks for survivors now since they are increasing the charges of gens. That's probably also why Prove Thyself wasn't touched.
Unbreakable isn't an OP perk anyway it does nothing unless you get slugged.
Adrenaline is still strong yes but i never thought of it as meta.
Borrowed Time buff does seem odd i'll admit not sure exactly what they were thinking.
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overall this huge perk rework will favour survivors due to the nerfs that slowdown perks received, yes even if the gens now takes 90 seconds instead of 80... this won't affect much low and mid mmr, but it's overkill for people who play in high mmr that will be utterly forced to use the same 2 killers in order to have a chance
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Don't tunnel. Simple as that. Off The Record, don't tunnel. Seems everyone is only complaining because they just can't tunnel people out anymore after these changes.
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since when selfcare is meta? maybe among solo survivors since you normally can't trust of other players (i had people running away from me, crouching in a corner without doing nothing instead of healing me while the killer was to the other side of the map... i wish i was joking about this) and a simple medkit will be better under all the aspects
iron will didn't received the stridor treatment tho, so in my book was slightly nerfed in comparison
spine chill isn't really a meta perk but it was nerfed for good reasons (still i would also give a buff in other area since they essentially erased everything useful from that perk)
genspeed doesn't needed any kind of buff or nerfs imo, to simply put survivors needed some new objective to do (m1 on a gen for 90 second is boring and not so much interactive), so creating those perks were a mistake from the beginning
unbrekable is op... i lost the count for how many matches turned from a complete victory in a draw or defeat for that perk... slugging is one of the strongest tactics that killers have at their disposal and this perk essencially deny the effectiviness of that tactic... this alone is extremely worth it to be taken into account
usually i didn't found many adrenaline users, but recently i found at least 2 of them in every match for some strange reason
bt well, nothing to say about it, you were perplexed too about this...
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Alternatively, just do grab.
It's weaker than DS in that matter.
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According to the stats Self Care is meta, yeah most people who run it do that and they are the least team oriented players who use it.
Yeah fair point, but i still think stridor and iron will are both pretty useless to use.
It was nerfed for good reasons but as it stands they massacred it, im sure it wont stay this way after ptb.
There needs to be a perk to counter slugging im sorry but if there was no perk then literally every match would be a slugfest cause there is nothing stopping you.
That is odd, i wont be suprised if the new meta ends up like adrenaline, prove thyself, unbreakable, exhaustion perk.
How it feels to me survivor perk wise is that they tried to remove alot of the chase perks to try get more variety, like no one is going to run dead hard, iron will, spine chill and resilience anymore.
EDIT:
Also Adrenaline to me is exactly how i view NOED, you play through 5 gens with 3 perks and get a nice reward.
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What's wrong with picking perks that happen to counter certain killers when Survivor players don't actually have any idea which Killer they are going to play against? NEVER have I seen anyone but Stealth Killer mains complain about Spine Chill. Just deal with it, just like Survivors have to 'just deal' with dumb stuff like Devour Hope. Blah blah, Stealthies aren't top tier. BUT some people simply are specifically weak to these killers, based on their playstyle. Thus they may be running SC just to counter their own weakness and not because it's some meta crutch.
My weakness is Hag, but I'm not going to run certain stuff every game just to ensure I can counter her every time. Some of those perks you named may have specific counters to a specific Killer, but how that is a bad thing in the grand scheme of things when there are so many perks and Killer combos? Would love that to be explained.
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Imagine if we made it so survivors cant tunnel generators. DBD would have been a far better balanced game if you could only work a generator so far and then you needed to collect a part to continue.
There is no killer perk that reduces gen efficiency by 25% so tunneling is the only answer. Technically you can have temporary effects but they go away because people aren't dumb.
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It will actually be quite a bit worse then before when used together because of how the game does percentages; they're not a flat increase but based on the number. Some math if anyone is curious with "CaS" standing for charges a second.
16/c for a full heal with 1/CaS being normal healing speed. Current self care is at 50% speed which is .5/CaS. Botany adds 33% of that (not to) .5 which is ~.666/CaS. This makes current botany with Self Care take approximately 24 seconds.
New self care will be .35/CaS with botany adding 50 percent of that (again not to) which is .525/CaS. This means the new combo will take ~30.5 seconds to heal.
It's about a 6 second nerf from what the combo was. Someone feel free to double check my math but it should check out.
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What's wrong? Try to play a match with spirit aganist 4 IW users who know what they are doing, then come back to tell your experience... You'll quickly see what's wrong when certain perks can literally nullify the killer's power...
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I think the idea is that, with the base kit Endurance/Haste, Borrowed Time pick rate is expected to decrease because it's not as necessary to have anymore. It still has plenty of value and it's stacking with the base kit does make it a buff overall, but the hope is now it's not something you have to bring, but rather something that's nice to have if you do need it. A perk, if you will.
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Iron Will on its own is not a problem. It is the only skill in the game that allows you to "get away" from the killer during a chase because otherwise they can hear you from extremely far away. Imagine if you were a wounded claudette and were running around on a map with no walls being chased by a blindfolded killer (who was looking at the ground so no chase would start). Without IW they would easily be able to follow you even if they literally can't see.
Without Iron Will you can't really misdirect in chases. In short the devs think Iron WIll is making DH stronger. This is marginally correct but really it's more like 80% that DH is way too strong and the rest is that IW can help them in a chase to waste a few seconds.
I assume you are talking about IW nullifying Spirit in a chase. She can still just listen for footsteps (and look for grass moving). Almost nobody bothers to listen for footsteps.
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the devs said that this was also and “prevent camping and tunneling update”. Borrowed time isn’t an OP perk and the new update to “baseline borrowed time for 5 seconds” can be easily waited out. Why keep complaining about something that’s useful to healthy gameplay..
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i just played a match yesterday where I was using lucky break against an oni. He kept losing me and finding me literally seconds later because of my blood orb trail. Plus the doctor can do the same thing with his huge blast/making tier 3 survivors scream automatically. Im sure you’re not against that though right? Only the survivor side is the one that’s wrong?
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First you are a bit confused. I am not talking about the "Freebie" where everyone gets 5 seconds of endurance. That by the way is a HUGE direct buff to survivors because it guarantees the chase from an unhook will last +5 seconds.
Look at what BT does right now and compare what BT will do after the changes. Look at say Iron Will and Spine Chill pre/post changes. See a difference? BT becomes a stronger perk and IW/SC were completely gutted and nerfed.
BT will become even more meta than it is right now because 15 seconds of 7% speed will have a massive effect on preventing tunneling.
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Why would adrenaline get nerfed when they didn’t need the actual effect of NOED? BT was actually nerfed by 2 seconds but they added a baseline BT. This update was also to “prevent camping and tunneling” so why would they need something that prevents that? The only reason why somebody would want it nerfed is because you camp and tunnel. And why would they need unbreakable? It’s not an OP perk, it’s the only real perk to prevent slugging. Otherwise you sit there on the ground for 3 minutes. Plus it’s only used 1 time a match. That seems pretty balanced to me
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Lucky Break doesn't work against Oni because of the blood orb mechanic. Does it work against every other killer in the game? Yes it does. Lucky Break fails vs doctor because you can get hit by his blast or scream because you are in stage three.
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Adrenaline was already made into a usable perk years ago (by buffing the speed and making it so the heal can happen even if you just got off a hook). It's a good perk not a "broken" or over used one.
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"jUsT DoN'T TuNnEl, It's sO SiMpLe"
Some people are more disconnected from DBD than any dev...they don't know that survivors can bodyblock the killer with BT and it will be easier with the +7% speed boost.
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Oh yeah, completely busted.
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DH was mainly used for distance.
With new DH if you fake a swing, as you should be doing like with current DH, they'll use it and then you can down them faster than you can right now.
DH overall has been nerfed if you know how to play around it. 1 second is nothing and most survivors don't time current DH right for the i-frames to matter anyways.
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some of you people that say this are just so ridiculous. If somebody is literally body blocking you in a doorway either wait the couple seconds for BT to expire and down them and tunnel them if they want to act like that. Or just hit them to proc BT and chase them again and kill them. Or if it’s end game just wait out BT and down them and you get a free kill with new update. It’s like you guys love to complain. How about instead of complain about a healthy perk you start making threads complaining about killers who camp and tunnel which caused this game to bring in a perk like borrowed time instead?
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Actually, BT & Dead hard got buffed. There are videos and streamears explaining the dead hard situation. So good job devs, pretty good job so far; but let's nerf POP cuz OP.
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Mini BT gives you 5x7 = 35% more distance/opportunity if killer wants to wait it out. If they swing you get 1.8*50 = 90% on top of that. That's 125% more distance.
BT theory:
7×15 = 105% more distance or over twice as far as you could previously go at vanilla speeds if killer wants to wait it out
Assuming you get hit/attempted to get tunneled out:
105% + (1.8 * 50) = 195%
Total possible distance gain compared to old BT is almost tripled.
Post edited by Raccoon on0 -
spine chill, iron will, and decisive were all stomped into the ground levels of nerf. No one will use them anymore. Off the record will render borrowed time obsolete and irrelevant too...so who cares about that 3 second duration buff and slight speed boost.
Dead hard may be better, may be worse, the ptb will tell the tale. All the baseline changes to killer have me deeply concerned, ngl.
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Footstep sounds are straight up muted at least half the time thanks to bugs
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How about we wait till ptb to see how dead hard is cause they said it’s no more distance. We don’t even know what the perk will look like?
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um? You do know BT gets canceled if they touch exit gates? And also DS doesn’t work in endgame anymore and Noed is still strong it’s just not annoying to deal with anymore?
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yeah your right it’s not like they just gutted decisive strike, iron will, self care and spine chill and buffed the ######### out of killers.
but gerr devs bad only care about survivors amiright
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How is NOED still strong? It will get you one down and then it's gone. Not even a gtd kill. That's not worth it to go an entire game with 3 perks
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I believe that SC & BK together heal at the same speed as current SC. So BK & SC together also got nerfed. And don't forget the 12.5% extra gen speed repair time.
Not to mention all the global buffs Killers got. 10% faster attacks, Faster Blood Lust, 2.5% Gen Damage on Kick, 10% faster destroying pallets.
Survivors have been nerfed 4 patches in a row and still killer-players want them nerfed more.
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Because one. That one down should equal a kill if you played very good. If you down one person and they don’t die and it gets cleansed that’s a sign you did very bad plain and simple. I’m not a Noed fan myself cause it just rewards bad plays it should be used to secure kills in the end
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It's still probably going to get used less despite the buff. In a vacuum yeah, the perk is stronger, but when you consider the off the record, base kit BT, and DH nerf, it will still most likely get used less.
For one off the record will inevitably be a popular perk, which will remove the need to have someone with BT save you. Moreover, you get 5 seconds of endurance even without BT, so it's not the end of the world if you get unhooked without either perk. If you are running sprint burst, that will guarantee your 5 seconds will get you to safety, which you will be more likely to do since DH is getting nerfed.
The base kit changes and the presence of other strong perk choices that accomplish the same goal but selfishly instead of altruistically will kill the need to have BT on all the time.
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Self care and botany knowledge is not stronger than before.
The old self care botany knowledge would heal you in 24 seconds (16/.5×1.33)
The new one heals you in 32 seconds, just 2 seconds faster than the old perk on its own (16/.35×1.5)
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Current BT lasts 12 seconds, and you run at 4 m/s. 48 meters.
New BT lasts 15 seconds, and you run at 4.28 m/s. 64.2 meters. That's 33% more distance.
Old BT when you get hit gives you 6 m/s for 2 seconds and 4 m/s for 1 second while the killer is blade wiping. That's 16 meters.
New BT when you get hit gives you either 6.28 or 6.42 m/s (depends on how the stacking works) for 1.8 seconds and 4.07 m/s for .9 seconds while the killer is blade wiping. Even in the more favorable case of 6.42 m/s that is 15.219 meters. Less distance than a successful BT hit before. Although depending on how early that hit is you may hold on to the 7% speed boost for some time after the hit which could be valuable to you.
Post edited by SkeletalElite on2 -
BT was not nerfed, perhaps you read it wrong. It actually "extends" the 5 second endurance effect and movespeed bonus by 10 seconds. So 15 seconds. Which is why I find it quite strange how they claim DS gives a free escape in the endgame and gut it, when BT will now do exactly the same thing. OtR is even worse but I hope they change their mind on this one and just make it blood pools, scratch marks, aura and grunts of pain removed for the duration.
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Because you are still able to Camp.
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