There is a quite misunderstanding of the term "being toxic".
Hello, I see some people on a forum clearly misunderstanding of what is "Toxic behaviour" in this game.
They accuse in game tactics like: tunneling or camping, flashlight clicks or T-bags after a pallet stun or in the exit gates, killer shacking his head after downing a survivor, etc... As a toxic behaviour. Which is to me, is completely wrong.
According to Google (I'm sorry for that):
Being toxic in a video game means - having a bad attitude or behaviour towards other players which hurts the community or the game itself.
So what exactly should be considered as "toxic" in Dead by daylight, and what's not...?
(It's all IMO)
Let's start with toxic, because mostly it's any behaviour or attitude which is braking the basic rules of this game, such is:
- Holding someone hostage.
- Playing with "third party program" (cheats), using broken or unfixed mechanic of the game for your advantage. (bug exploits)
- Playing against your team. (Working with killer, sandbags)
- Insults and threats towards the person judging by the way they played the game. (End-game chat, or other)
To me, If you spot at least one of these 4 points, you can safely say - you're being toxic, or you were toxic.
Now let's go to "Misunderstanding" part or what considered as NOT toxic:
- T-bags and F-clicks.
- Camping and tunneling.
- Playing "scummy" or unfair. (according to survivors)
- Waiting for killer at the exit gates.
- Camping the hatch.
- Shaking the head after downing a survivor. (As a killer ofc...)
- Hitting survivors on hooks.
There is 1 thing I don't know about... It's "suiciding on hooks" or DC-ing from the matches... Is this considered as toxic or not? (I think it's for you to decide)
If someone don't agree with me or have different opinion, you're very welcome to discuss it here.=)
Comments
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I appreciate your effort to break down the behaviors of players, but I don't agree with all your points.
In your post, you put the definition of toxicity ("having a bad attitude or behaviour towards other players which hurts the community or the game itself"), and then in your 4 toxic points you reworked the definition as "any behavior or attitude breaking the rules of the game".
In my opinion (which might be wrong), excessive teabags or clicks, hitting on hook/nodding, can be considered toxic according to the definition you looked up. They're all behavior executed specifically with the intention to irritate or insult the other player, which (at least in my books) counts as "having a bad attitude towards other players".
Now, I personally am not that bothered by teabags and I've had honestly lovely chats with people who clicked or teabagged during the game. But I won't argue with someone who feels hurt or humiliated by such behaviors, which were done with this very purpose, if they call that toxic.
(Please do not take offense to this comment : I'm simply giving my thoughts on the subject, I don't mean to undermine or reduce what you're saying)
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I added "Hitting survivors on hooks" in not toxic.=) Thank you, I completely forgot about it.=)
Don't even think about any "offense" by your comment, you're completely free to express your thoughts!
I appreciate your opinion. =)
So you think any behaviour or acts to irritate or insult the other player should be considered as toxic behaviour?=)
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Happy to have reminded you of it then haha !
I might be a silly emotional person, but I tend to try and remember that all players involved in the game are actual people who express themselves through their actions. I remember that when I have fun with a friendly bunch, and I remember that when I see people visibly trying to hurt my feelings.
You can generally tell if a player's intention is to insult you. There's layers to it all. A Wraith dinging his bell a couple of times in celebration after a down is cute. Him spending all 4 minutes of bleeding you out bing bonging above you is toxic. A survivor tea bagging a couple of times to take chase is good. A survivor tea bagging at the gate to humiliate you is toxic.
In my opinion, acts that are visibly made to insult the player are as toxic as hurtful endgame chat (which often can follow). They're made with the intention to hurt, sometimes to make DC. It fits the definition of toxicity that you found on Google, though it does not fit the definition you wrote afterwards.
That's how I see toxicity in the game, but I get that people can have different opinions about it :)
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See the problem is "bad" behaviour is subjective.
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The only things that are toxic are things meant to be toxic. Hitting on hook? Well, is it because it’s a new player who thinks it will make the sacrifice faster? Not toxic. Is it someone doing it to try and piss off the hooked survivor? Toxic. Etc etc. Intent matters.
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Exactly. Intent is everything.
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This is just my opinion but -
I think in general this gaming community is very ..soft. People get offended by every little thing the killer or survivor does. This game doesn't even hold a candle to truly toxic games, one of them being Valo for example.
I get it, some people get irritated by teabags or flashlight clicking, etc. But to be bothered by in-game mechanics? To the point where you either rage or throw the game going for 1 select person & camping them once you finally get them.
I don't really agree with most of this community's regard to toxicity. People love to exaggerate and come to the forums blasting this 'toxicity' but unless specific situations have occurred (like end-game insults, or in-game sabotage, etc) I don't really think its as bad as many other more competitive games.
Try going on Valorant as a brand new player, see the difference lol.
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I remember I created once a post about being hold hostage as a Hag on a Garden of Joy map. What I'm trying to say...
The only moments when I got really angry and mad in this game, are the moments when I'm facing subtle cheaters or people that want to waste as much of my time as possible, want to waste my effort I put into this match, and people who's not playing the game, they just here to make you feel angry to the point that you don't wanna play.
To me, the exact intent of "hurting" the person behind the monitor is exactly what I see as a "toxic behaviour". And thankfully, they're all bannable.=)
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You want to know real toxicity
This guy
The rest is nothing
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To each their own :)
If toxicity is hurting the other person, then each player has their own limit as to what "hurts" them, and therefore their own definition of toxicity. Any objective definition of toxicity will then be interpreted, like we're all doing on this post.
I'm glad you've got a tough skin, keeping a clear head during games is essential and you must manage it well ! ^^
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I agree.=)
But not everyone are getting angry because of T-bags or F-clicks, or when they getting hit on the hook.
You can't be even more accurate.=)
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I agree with you mostly. I don't think a killer camping or tunneling is toxic, it's unfun, but is a legitimate way to win the game. Hitting on hook and shaking head is just BM.
BM is more objective I feel but I think it can have some place in a game and now it is not punished currently. It's psychological warfare.
Same with survivors tbagging and flashclicks. It's meant to annoy you, it's meant to test your mental fortitude, it's a mind game. And I think if it keeps a killer occupied and making bad decisions cause they are tilted it is also a legitimate strategy. They simply lost the mental game. You just need to be good at the technical stuff to excuse goading imo.
I think it's BM when the levels are imbalanced though. Like say. If it's a SFW vs an inexperienced killer it's pretty pathetic and the other way around.
I think DC and suicides are hard to categorize, they are indirectly helping the killer, which according to you is a toxic behavior so they are by association I guess?
I think it's alright to get frustrated as long as after 5 mins you're over it, those behaviors are meant to bother you while gaming and make you lose your patience. Imagine how weird it was to find out killers consider bodyblocking a hit for your teammate toxic when it's simply a strategic choice like camping or tunneling.
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Toxic is when they don't let you win.
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Toxic is just rude stuff. You have the definitions reversed, somehow.
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I always saw toxic stuff as things you do for the sole purpose to annoy somebody
Camping and tunneling i don't see as toxic cause most of the time the purpose of it is to win the game
T-bagging and hitting on hook i do see as toxic cause it doesn't achieve anything other then trying to annoy the other person. Heck in most cases it even hurts what you are trying to achieve
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Toxic behavior in DbD can be defined as disrespect towards other players. If a survivor teabagged another survivor instead of healing him up, that is disrespect. If a survivor teabagged another survivor while the second survivor gets a mori from a killer, that is disrespect. When survivors stand in the exit and teabag, that is disrespect. If survivors teabag the killer before starting an escape, that is disrespect and provocation. This, by the way, was spread by a notorious DbD streamer known for his toxicity. The way he commented on his toxic behavior completed the picture. The comments in the after-game chat also prove it. The people who teabagged before are wishing you, and I quote, AIDS or cancer or some other fate in the chat. I have experienced it myself.
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Can you explain why T-Bags are not toxic?
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The things you say are not toxic, most definitely are… are they not bad behavior towards others? Your very own google definition of toxic?
Most survivors always want to bully/antagonize killers in the name of “fun.” It is toxic, they know exactly what they’re doing. And tbh I think you know all the things you listed as “not toxic,” are just that. You’re just trying to play off words to defend it, but your definition and list of not toxic behavior contradicts itself. In my humble little opinion.
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I thought it was ungentlemanly conduct intended to intentionally insult, not necessary to the progress of the game in the role you play.
I also believe that if an opponent has committed an act that is TOXIC first, then toxic acts in response are also excluded.
By my definition, camping, tunneling, slugging, waiting on the gate in preparation to defend an ally, etc. are not toxic.
What is toxic is the act of attacking a survivor on the hook, slugging when it is clearly safe to hook, nodding, confining a survivor when it is impossible to initiate a collapse, t-bagging, spam-clicking flashlights, spamming lockers and windows with We believe this applies to noise spamming and the like. This is still a partial list.
On a case-by-case basis, there is a difference in meaning between being offended as a result of playing and playing with the assumption that you will offend your opponents.
That is my opinion.
sry my poor english
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Well, being toxic is when people act very rude and disrespectful just for the sake of being disrespectful... being annoyed or not by it, doesn't really mean something stops being toxic. As an example, a survivor t-bagging me has no effect, yet it is toxic. Why? Because their intention is to disrespect me... it's not toxic by the reaction I have but the intention the person has in mind. And yes, we are unable to read the mind of the other player but, we can somehow pinpoint when a survivor or killer tries to be toxic.
As an example, if a killer lets you almost bled out and then gets you to the exit gates just to finally down you... or when a killer knows where the hatch is, you're the last survivor and the killer let you reach the hatch just to close it in your face or mori you, then yeah, it is toxic and also, a waste of my time, I get that many people playing the game are a bunch of kids/ teens, but some people might have done a hard challenge and don't have enough time so they try to move on as fast as they can and someone griefing, or making the game last longer just to annoy another player can be considered toxic.
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Well, I totally the opposite.=)
I don't get offended by T-bags, or being hit on a hook, to me it's just a simple game things that don't affect the match at all.=)
But if this person, purposely wasting my time, telling really bad stuff at the end-game chat, or using cheats, or using bugs to somehow hold me hostage or getting advantage, I'm actually feel like this person "attacking" me as a person through the monitor, if you got what I'm trying to tell.=)
To me, this is exactly what toxicity in dbd means. Not T-bags or etc.
Also, don't pay too much attention to what I've searched from Google.
If a player getting angry at who T-bags, I think this is their personal matter. I don't find T-bags or nodding toxic.
They're not hurt your gameplay, the match still goes on.
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How long have you been playing killer? I think that’s great if those things truly don’t bother you at all, must make the game a lot less stressful.
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Tilting an opponent has always been good strategy. If people think in game actions are toxic than they're really trying to be triggered. Once a game has been decided, poor manners are indeed toxic.
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IMO 'Toxic' is when BM, insults or tactic go beyond the bounds of the game. Flashlight clicking and T-bagging could arguably be seen as greifing, especially at the exit gate but since it doesn't effect into the next match or outside the game its not really toxic.
Slugging all for survivors to bleed out instead of hooking them, that crosses into toxic though since in wasting their time you DO effect the next match and whatever they were going to do since you are delaying the end of the match.
Insults like 'Oh gotta use your EZ crutch perks!' or other trash talk is whatever but when you bring people's real lives into it like 'I hope you get sick.' or 'Your family doesn't love you' over a ######### computer game thats pretty toxic.
Imo 'griefing back' when someone griefs you, thats perfectly fine. Survivor t-bags so you smack them on hook a few times? Perfectly fine. Survivor T-Bags you so you call them cancer and insult their family? NOT ok.
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