This update is super problematic
What if someone is on a pallet, what should u do? Let someone get the save? Chase them so they can do it again? And remember the guy on the pallet will already be up if u are not playing blight, nurse or a fast chase killer, which is going lead to even more nurses blight and so on. And what if they have sould guard, they can get endurance and take a hit for the guy being chased? This is absurdly problematic, and if u are playing any killer that benefits from slow balling now they are pretty much dead. Twins, oni etc. And if u want to make a comeback on a team, forget it, now u can't. This is the super bs. Hopping it doesn't make to live game on this state. Just allow the killer to have a yellow memento Mori and that's it.
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Pretty sure the reason for base kit unbreakable is because they wanted to change the moris rather than address slugging.
Don't get me wrong, slugging solution is good but the whole mori thing is just complete nonsense.
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It also seems like they want to address the incredibly boring games where the second to last survivor is slugged for 3 minutes and 50 seconds before finally being hooked.
They're getting rid of hook, camp, tunnel, camp, tunnel, mori.
Slugging is boring. They're nerfing it in general and specifically eliminating especially boring edge cases (like the killer standing over the last survivor for 4 minutes just to be a dick). This update reduces toxicity and will even speed up queue times.
IMO they're addressing MANY different things and I think it's great.
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You guys brought this update upon yourselves.
Post edited by Gcarrara on24 -
whats stopping you from chasing the survivor whos threatning the pallet save?
Do you not realize how long 45 seconds really is?
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Good because now they have to buff these killers Oni is too weak and shoukd start with his power. They probably will still increase the timer but im fine with it if Oni getw buffed.
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22 seconds with unbreakable - which is a meta perk anyway, so it will be used.
So tell me how you plan to down someone with 2 healthstates in 22 seconds?
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Fake pickup take the free injure state and then pickup for real. If they were close enough to pallet save they were close enough to get a free injury with most killers. If they get the rescue they permanently lost a map resource if you kick it. If the guy is close enough for a Soul Guard bodyblock the person was looping around the downed person's pallet, which means swing through the pallet. They don't want to drop it since they want to get the rescue. Snowballing can still easily occur with people on hook, chasing a would be rescuer, then downing them before the next person can reach the hook in time. You can then punish a 59s save attempt and get an extra hook state and go back to pick up the person you downed. Letting them rescue the 2nd staged Survivor.
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Yeah but its main use became basekit, its most likely gonna be like when BT had its effects become basekit its usage dropped quite a bit
Also if theyre going down directly under a pallet, 9/10 they could of simply dropped the pallet. Not to mention that for Unbreakable to actually have an effect here, some one else has to be around.
Its super situational, this really aint gonna be a problem
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Are survivors not picking up their teammates now? People keep bringing this situation up and I feel like I'm losing my mind. Yes, you have to chase the person lurking around the pallet. And typically someone comes to pick their teammate off the ground. So that person either uses the full 45 seconds, has Unbreakable, or a teammate picks them up.
The only thing changing now is the potential for a 45 second self pick up and multiple Unbreakables by the same person under a pallet in the match. Even if someone is intentionally going down at pallets, that should work once on you in the match before you catch on to it.
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They'll do anything to avoid nerfing exposed nurse lol
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45 seconds is half a generator and 1 full self-care. But, 45 seconds is also absolutely nothing if the team around you is swarming the one survivor down in an attempt to pick him up? Mettle of Man is going to be godlike in this update as a perfect distraction perk. Honestly, if you think 45 seconds isn't detrimental, you have never been in a situation where 45 seconds can make or break your game.
It should be 90 seconds or they should leave it alone.
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How so?
Keep in mind that some killers are designed around slugging (Twins).
Also - schadenfreude is not a good emotion.
Post edited by Gcarrara on5 -
Look, twins is an outlier plain and simple, twins is also in need of a rework. Maybe if killers weren't constantly slugging for 4k's this wouldn't of needed to happen. But killers brought this change on themselves.
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even if the slugging solution was good (which... it's way to short to be a solution), it would still be hell for killers trying to get a flock of sabo squad swf's to get away from the dude on the ground.
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The tunneling camping and solo Q problems are definitely bigger than one or two slugging killers in 15 games.. I would have preferred solo Q changes instead of this.
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'Constantly'.
Yeah.
You're massively exaggerating.
I play about as much survivor as I do killer, and aside from tactical slugging (someone's on a pallet and there's another survivor nearby, or survivors are abusing spots/techniques that make them impossible to hook), I almost never see it.
You get the occasional griefer using Knockout, but that's vanishingly rare. I see more survivors abusing map geometry to go down and clip through to make themselves impossible to pick up.
I guess you resent the people who play killer, rather than the role itself? Otherwise I'm not seeing why you are so bitter here. Because the way this game works - both in terms of seemingly unfixable bugs and exploits and scenarios like above is not the fault of killers. Mostly they are just trying to counter what survivors are doing.
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I think basekit unbreakable is fine. Especially in a world where every survivor slugged equals an automatic game ender. It’s obvious that without it killers wouldn’t bother hooking.
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Killers needing to snowball should not be a thing in the first place imo.
If a killer character needs to snowball to "win" in general, then there's something wrong with that killer that warrants buffs or a rework to that killer character.
You dont start a nerfing survivor campaign when the killer in question is probably flawed to begin with.
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nah, it's definitely constantly
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BT didn't get dropped just because it's basekit.
BT got dropped because Off The Record is better.
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meh i actually look forward to this update as a killer main myself. it seems more interesting than horrid to me. that or i just cant find it in me to care.
Post edited by Gcarrara on1 -
yeah and OTR is the most ran perk right?
right?
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b-b-bro just split pressure!!!! Abandon strong loops!! Find the weak link! Umm...you got .2 seconds off survivor sprint burst, all we got was 2 meta perks basekit, entitled much??
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If unbreakable wasn't a thing.
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It won't be so funny when we see hordes of Nurses just seeing how fast they can down everyone. Because that's gonna happen, and we're gonna see 60 second matches.
I don't think this update is neither surv or killer sided, but I don't like it at first blush.
Post edited by Gcarrara on4 -
Neither was BT before the patch. What's your point?
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Neither is OTR
And even then I can count on one hand the amount of times I've seen OTR actually make a difference. BT on the other hand? Saved countless people before it was made base-kit.
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yeah being meta for years vs a few months will do that.
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Brother you'd see BT in effect basically every game, and even when it wasn't in game it had an effect of making killers waiting out.
OTR on the other hand? Most people go out of their way to get it activated which is time spent not on gens and even if they do end up escaping chase they still need to mend, which is more time spent not on gens. Does it have its moments? Yes. Which is pretty much what Unbreakable will be.
Basically useless the majority of the time, but when its effects kick in it can mean the difference between some one dying and getting away
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It's NEVER going to be 45 seconds. Unbreakable is already a META perk. It will be used in every build ever because you would be stupid not to bring it. 22 seconds.
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Wdym go out of their way? They do the same thing they did with BT, run into the killer on purpose and body block.
I see OTR a lot idk why you aren't.
Killer can't wait out 80 seconds so they hit you and give you a speed boost, which is better than letting them wait it out.
BT made you mend too so I don't see your point there.
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You really think they won't go through with this, considering all the positive changes that killers got in the past? I am really not sure that would be a smart move, unless survivors are getting buffs in different areas with the next update as well.
It seems fine. 45 seconds is more than enough time to find any nearby survivor and chase them away, so you can either pick the downed survivor up, or just go for the other survivor if you think they might be an easy down.
The buffed Unbreakeable is going to problematic though. Being able to always pick yourself up within 22,5 seconds is going to be mad broken. It should just keep it's 35% increased recovery speed values.
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This! No one else is to blame. It's a good change.
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Yeah it's so good when someone can proc the basekit BT and I lose the Endurance from OTR as well due to deep wounds. Super fun and useful effects. Honestly it does more to annoy me when I run aura builds on killer rather than anti-tunnel effects since the 80s lasts forever when you are snowballing and they still did a conspicuous action.
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I think you misunderstood, (s)he was referring to slugging for 4k, so slugging the third to search for the last survivor, to deny even the small chance of escaping through hatch / gate. There are MANY killers playing in such a way nowadays, it's like their lifes depend on that 4k. Or as if allowing hatch to spawn would be an insta-win for the last survivor. I would guess, in my recent games that got to the point where a killer got to choose between hooking or slugging for 4k, 4 out of 5 were slugging for 4k. Really not "massively exaggerated" in my experience.
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Its so weird cuz I remember the whole idea was “cinematic moris prevents survivor photobombing or poor camera angles due to environmental props” when thats like the entire fun of moris. A dev must of got like photobombed during their ghostface mori and lost their mind about it
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If the team is swarming the pallet to force a self-pick up nobody is fixing gens for 45 seconds, the game is effectively stalled for both sides.
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What you seem to not understand is that killers doing the 4K casually, or Killers doing 4k Streaks will still do it.
And guess what ? Yes. It will last even longer. If the survivors don't give up and the killer can't find the last 2 in 45 seconds, just repeat the process.
Welcome to 30 minutes match meta.
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Ok what about Michael and oni hmmm their power drains while carrying and hooking survivors
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Yep and expect more nurses because this update basically says hey go play nurse and if you're not good with her don't worry you will eventually look at how we nerfed these other killers you probably played
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I think you just like the word "problematic".
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yeah, its a meta perk because it allows you to pick yourself up
that main use is becoming basekit, its more than likely gonna be like BT where its usage drops because of it
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You can loop a killer for 70 seconds and still have an extra hit. You can go get healed come back and body block twice without going down. Killers can't afford to wait it out. Its just better than BT.
You're getting hit early because of OTR, killers can't wait it out, so they just hit you ASAP to get it over with. You're still benefitting from it.
That's like saying old DS is bad because the killer left you on the floor. Just because you didn't use the effect directly doesn't mean it's not really good.
Just because sometimes you get hit early doesn't mean much. That's like saying Unbreakable is bad because sometimes they don't slug.
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I bet old DH doesn't seem so bad now. 🤣
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Oh. But why is that a problem?
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It's super boring / unfun, since there's (nearly) no interaction between the players anymore. And thus it's just a waste of time. If the last survivor plays it sneaky, it's effectively waiting 4 mins for the slug to bleed out without any progress to the game. You could be half way through your next match in that time.
Sure you could say, the last surv should just give up, but why should they? The surv will get 7k BP for an escape, that is a massive amount. The killer on the other hand will get a few hundred BP more for the 4k, really not that much of a difference. So when considering time efficiency BP-vise, killers shouldn't really slug for 4k (esp since BBQ does not give any stacks anymore). Just hooking the second-to-last and race for hatch/gate gets them more, even if they "lose" the race.
But like I said, so many killers are so obsessed with their 4k, that they go at incredible lengths to make sure they get all. Even with the hatch spawning, they would prob. still get the last one more often than not. But even that slight risk of "losing" is too much. I really don't understand that sort of thinking. And I'm a killer main myself.
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If you were looping the killer for 70s the Survivors were winning that match with or without OTR. If you go get healed and come back for the double bodyblock you wasted 2 people in false chase for up to 79s, 16s from your ally healing you, and only have 2 people on gens. The circumstances where that is better than sitting on gens are little to none. Basically it is only better when 2 people are on the final gen with only 2 slots, You have 1 hook state and the chased Survivor has 2, and you know the Survivor doesn't have Adrenaline, and the killer doesn't have NOED.
That very much is NOT like old DS, because it forced a slug instead of a pickup. You still got value, and if you had UB you can pick yourself up without a teammate rescuing you. Old DS didn't get 0 value because another perk or feature got value, and it often allowed another perk to get value with it.
Sometimes you get hit early - Skilled enough Killers almost exclusively swing when they can't hear you when they plan on tunneling so often you never get OTR endurance value. That isn't sometimes, that is most of the time.
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