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Unbreakable basekit even outside the "Hope Is Not Lost" phase?
If yes that's sounds insane.
The first time I've read about it, I thought it was done in order to give a chance to survivors during that phase : any survivor on the ground could stand up and force the killer to make a choice between hooking and keep chasing.
However, if it's also base-kit outside of that phase, it means the killer will not be able to use that mean of pressure to try to slow survivors down (by forcing someone sitting on a gen to go for a heal or risk having two downs). That option goes from rolling a dice to a sure loss.
I don't see that change as such a huge boost for killer. I see how it may be used to get the last survivor lingering in the exit, but not much more. (For the reading-challenged : I'm not saying it's not a boost, just nowhere as interesting as a free Unbreakable)
I thought I would start playing again to try that change but right now, I'm not so sure.
Comments
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You are correct, it's a basekit feature that's always active. Thankfully this is an early preview that is not coming with the next live update so there is plenty chance for feedback and change.
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I imagine veteran players are having boon ptb flashbacks and the real old players are having mettle ptb flashbacks. Bhvrs track record of introducing then reacting later really doesn’t instill any confidence
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True, but this is the first time they are doing PTB for an early preview for something that is not coming out with the next live update.
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I suppose, but i don't expect anything more than number tweaking like “unbreakable down from 100% to 75% recovery speed” or something inconsequential such as that.
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And yet they already devoted all the manpower and resources into making the idea and incorporating it into a playable state. Its almost guaranteed to go live in some capacity at this point, unless it ends up being so bad they can't just throw reactive numbers adjustments at it.
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An old anti-camping mechanic from years ago (four? more?) never made it into live because too easy to exploit.
Here I'm hoping the current version will not make it even into the PTB.
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OLD BHVR actually had the guts to discard bad features - current BHVR is suffering from a harrrd sunk cost fallacy imho. I doubt we'll see this system changed to be..decent at least. Maybe we will,but BHVR has earned my distrust.
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CoH was the best example. It had so many issues conceptually that it has still broken aspects of the game to this day just by existing, and it even entered the PTB in a hilariously powerful state. All they did was keep throwing small numbers adjustments at it while ignoring the blatant issues that it was (and pretty much still is) the only boon that does not require the killer to be anywhere near it, while also proving a benefit so strong and universal that it singlehandedly ruins the concepts of boons themselves for many people. They created another nurse tier outlier and saw(and still see) absolutely no issues with that.
Oops, I said "saw" and "nurse tier." I take no responsibility for any future pig nerfs that may or may not be caused by this post.
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Nerf pig give her an overheat mechanic on her chainsaw and make her refill at lockers.
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I was going to make a post about how locker resupplying her traps might be neat, but i don't want to monkey paw any horrible reworks into reality.
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she needs find her traps scattered around the map like glyphs. Thats the only way pig will be balanced
edit: Had an even better idea, every time she downs someone she has to measure and readjust the size of the bear trap to fit on that specific survivors head then after that they cant be hooked or downed again until they get the trap off and cuz that would be tunneling and tunneling makes me sad :(
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Let's call a spade a spade: the old anti-camping mechanic didn't make it into live, because the solution was flawed. It had a flaw that could have been corrected, but nobody at BHVR ever fixed the flaw.
After 6 years of fixing most of the game issues with perks ... entering: the Bandaid as a Perk aka "Reassurance".
And btw. it didn't really help, that most of the discussions about fixing the camping issue were shut down by people parroting the good old sentence "has been tried and abused" (without mentioning that it could have been fixed).
Anyway, that's off topic, yet it had to be said.
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Waiting for pig to need to pick up her traps around the map and go through a 8 second set up animation. Only 1 trap carriable on hand by default. Going into ambush lowers your speed to 76%
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Glad you said it, but reassurance is a bad example. It's actually going to play very nicely with this new basekit change in its current state, you'll be able to bumrush the hook with it, even leading the killer to it midchase, and get downed on purpose to create lose/lose situations right in the killer's face, and won't even need to waste the formerly single use self recover to do it. Yet another extremely horrible play that'll suddenly be made a good one because of exploitable oversights.
Playing well at dbd means being as efficient as possible, on both sides. Being as efficient as possible means both knowing how to take every advantage possible to do so, but also knowing how to prevent your opponent from doing the same. You could argue that this situation would be pointless because "two survivors arent on gens now," but one has frozen the hook timer of the other, and they have created an inevitible self recovery right next to the hooked survivor: You either need to pick them up and tell everyone to go for the save while you walk them to a hook, or just sit there and wait so you can handle the situation thats been dropped in your lap. Or just leave and let them get what they want for free with no repercussions for a play that would have otherwise completely thrown the match.
Good survivors find these things all the time, because its part of what makes them good survivors. Just like good killers tend to be good killers because they find and/or recognize very advantageous tools for themselves while maximizing denying the tools of survivors. Thats why exploitation potential is extremely important, but unfortunately BHVR don't understand how to prevent exploitation without just nerfing things into the ground instead.
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How could have it been fixed? I don't recall a viable solution.
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They need to just scrap this whole idea. They probably spent a decent amount of time on it already, but it is a bad idea that will massively affect the game balance in a negative way. Base kit UB is not worth this new mechanic. This new mechanic is very situational and brings no where near the amount of value base kit unlimited BT will bring to higher skill survivor players. No more slugging to force pick up so survivors get off gens for a few seconds. No more punishing greedy or bad plays. Not worth it. BHVR has made some great changes recently, but this ain't it.
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I'm having busted boilover unbreakable flashbacks
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I don't know why that is such a common myth, but there was no mettle of men ptb, the Devs leaked the perks with a console update accidently and added the Chapter soon after.
As for examples that never made it to live: Legion changes (downing an injured surv in 3 instead of 4 of I remembere correctly) and Selfcare changes (you heal yourself faster, but at the cost of a very reduced healing speed when you heal others.)
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i didn’t know that it was a common myth i just knew old mettle of man was a game ruining perk that was warned by players shouldnt come to live. I assumed it was a ptb but ive not been around that long.
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"Common" might be an overstatement but I've seen people using it as an example for a bad ptb decision before.
If I remember correctly, the leaks made Ash's perks available in kyf on one of the consoles (or maybe all, not sure anymore, it was definitely not available on PC), so people could try it and of course from the description alone many people had doubts about it, so you are a certainly right about that.
I've heard the theory before that BHVR kept powerful survivor perks on purpose to increase sales on survivor only chapters, I don't want to be a conspiracy theorist, but I wouldn't be surpised, so I think that is an extra dimension to keep in mind when looking at bhvr's decisions about MoM or the boons.
Post edited by SunaIIanu on1 -
Put in a part where if there is another Survivor within x meters of the Hook the progress would continue. That would of stopped the abuse part of it.
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Silver lining: killer queues become instant again
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Defining both x and y (survivor and killer distance from the hook) seems key. I don't know if there are value that are working and can't be exploited one way or another.
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Let's say the Killer Radius to stop hook progress 15 m. Same would be given to the survivor as well so if a survivor is within that 15m hook progress will continue. That would keep survivors from looping around a hooked survivor to abuse the system
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But then if a survivor is close enough, the killer knows and will not leave.
And all the art will be to wait at slightly above 15m to "camp" or wait for the killer to leave (and that's just from the top of my head, I'm pretty sure there are many twists)
Post edited by drsoontm on0 -
Haven't gotten a chance to play Nurse in awhile because I always feel bad after the game.
At least I don't have to feel bad anymore and can enjoy playing a killer I like to play.
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Last time I've checked, they went from instant to about a minute, which is fine.
(But I've not played for several weeks.)
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Honestly, restricting the free self-pickup to that phase would solve almost all of the balance problems this patch introduces. Not many people are complaining about an inability to slug everyone to death - some would, and having three players on the floor and going for the last is certainly a strong position to be in as killer. But I could lose that route to victory without much fuss. Losing slugging completely is a different issue, especially where aggressive survivor play is concerned. Slugging is the only counter there is to hook denial and team play.
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