Bhvr Hacker Statement feels like a empty Politicain speak
"We banned already so many players and we are constantly working on new ways. We will bring you all these things in the next months"
Ah yeah everyone is seeing how much you are fighting against Hackers and how fast they get banned. (It's not like there are per day multiple Videos of New Hackers and hacker bots who stream the whole day and not get banned and even if they are getting banned they can just make a new account)
Oh and yeah nice we are getting things that every other game company could program in a few weeks at the end of the year only for the Hackers to Bypass it because you already told them now what you are working on.
Comments
-
Literally every game company says it in this manner. They can’t mention specifics or the cheat creators know that specific feature was flagged. Do you think giant games are cheat free too?
36 -
The only way that statement could read as an "empty politician statement" is if you view it with inherent, pre-decided distrust and condemnation.
People were getting frustrated with a lack of communication, too. That's why the statement exists at all.
29 -
They can ban the hackers. The issue is, Hackers have multiple tools and multiple accounts. If they do a hardware ban, they use a HWID spoofer to change their HWID to get around it. They ban an account, they 100s of back up accounts they acquired when the game is on sale or when it was free on epic.
Im sure the anti-cheat team is doing everything they can to ensure the game is safe from hackers and cheaters.
5 -
Gotta find something to complain about right?
10 -
Hard disagree. They gave a roadmap for their plans on anti-cheat features. That's the opposite of empty politician speak.
16 -
What, you expected them to say precisely what they are doing, allowing hackers to pinpoint what they need to do to circumvent it before it even hits live?
Although it’ll be a while yet, this is objectively great.
Post edited by GentlemanFridge on8 -
I think we're pretty clear in the post, that we don't want to give too much information away on things that can assist people to cheat. Giving an anticipatory timeline on what we're working on and what we wish to implement is probably as much information as we're able to give.
Keeping things vague, is something that we sadly have to do - we feel the frustration with regards to cheating the same way you do, we play the game, we see these matches happening. It's a never ending circle, and one that we're doing our best to counter and improving a lot of our own procedures to deal with things in the process.
36 -
BHvR has to keep it vague as Anti-Cheat software can be exploited by cheaters as well, so keeping it private or vague is a must (example being Warzone’s anti-cheat being destroyed cause a part of it got leaked)
3 -
BHVR are pretty good at sticking to their roadmaps, so it's not just empty statements if they have a reliable history to back it up
2 -
Nah. I'm happy with the post. They've addressed the issue, said what they've done and what they're going to be doing going forward. Not sure what more you expected. They obviously cannot get too detailed.
2 -
I wonder would we have gotten this statement at all if Otz and Spookyloopz had not spoken up about it.
3 -
Most definitely not. Both BHVR and the hackers need big streamers to promote their wares.
I've noticed Otz is streaming less DbD recently since he dropped that vid. This has to make BHVR go to DEFCON 1.
I am sure Otz would survive without DbD, but could DbD survive without Otz?
1 -
I honestly kind of doubt it. It seems like it is too much of a coincidence that those videos came out and right away BHVR responds.
1 -
I'm sure it had something to do with it, but as ImmersedNurse already said I'm guessing this has been in the works for some time already.
1 -
This thread turned into an upvote party 🎉
2 -
What more do you want? Pictures of banned cheaters crying?
1 -
I would say you guys gave good information, if not, more than I expected. I think most of us just wanted clarification alone that it was being worked on. Simple as that. We're glad to know that this is an ongoing process and we hope to have a lot of these wild and crazy cheats out of the game. Like spamming multiple survivors and killers in a match like I saw the other day. Regardless, what was provided was more than enough. Thank you!
1 -
I know how cheats work. anticheats will never stop 100% of cheats.
BVHR will never stop cheaters because it is impossible. All they can do is make it harder for them. Players are mad because they don't ban reported cheaters quick enough, because the game never ends, and they can't quit the game. all this is BHVR's fault because that's how the game is designed. they need to improve the game design to avoid things like: keeping a player hostage, joining any player's match whenever they want . they need to move as much as possible to the server side without hurting the player experience. I'm guessing most of the cheats work on the client side.
0 -
The one thing that concerns me the most is that the IP leak/acquisition thing was not addressed. Now maybe they just didn't want to reveal their hands too soon. But I would love it so much if I could start playing without a stupid VPN.
0 -
lets see, i look forward to the serverside change.
But i will keep my gameplay to a minimal until its better.
2 days in a row i had cheaters on my very first games, and im defo not high or top mmr
2 -
Lets be real. This statement exists because big time streamers have threatened to pull out over an issue BHVR has been very lax about. Cheating has always been a thing in the game, but exploded with dedicated servers. That was, what, three years ago? While BHVR may have been taking steps behind the scenes, it just keeps getting worse.
Remember the whole color blind fiasco, where they only made it known they were working on something only AFTER the explosion? This is the same deal. Whether something comes out of it or not, we'll see. It circles back to my biggest issue with BHVR, and that's taking literal years to make substantial changes.
I hope things change for the better, I really do. However, this dev team HAS made me a distrustful, or at the very least, pessimistic on things they say they're doing.
0 -
My point exactly.
0 -
There is a saying: I read the words, alone, I lack faith. BHVR has gambled away a lot of trust.
0 -
I think the post was great, albeit far overdue. My only complaint is that they're doubling down on the arms race comment, its one that gives off a lot more excuse than reasoning. I understand why they say it, but that fact that it was previously followed with extreme silence and zero progress reports gives it an extremely bad aftertaste.
This type of progress report and roadmap planning is exactly what they needed to do, though.
0 -
It's business speak. They are a business.
0 -
Ehhhh. I WOULD agree on the point of them mishandling cheating in general but I can't criticize them for publicly commenting on the subject after we literally just spent weeks criticizing their lack of a public comment on the subject
3 -
You should of big brain it and gave false info that only hackers could of understood to catch them
like a mouse trap with peanut butter too good for them to not at least get a taste
0 -
I agree that it's pretty empty talk given that they had been silent on this topic for years. Would have hoped for more than "we'll do things". The 200k number is also not really worth all that much. The game's more than 6 years old, save file modifying had been rampant in past times and probably makes for a good chunk of the bans, and another chunk are bound to be rage-cheaters using free accounts they gave out at multiple points, most of all of course the Epic Store cheater feast - a disaster really, I don't want to know how many thousands of accounts there still are from that in backup, waiting to be used for cheating.
It's disappointing as I have been facing more and more cheaters, subtle and otherwise. MMR and the Epic Store thing have really made this a fairly substantial issue. I would not be surprised if 5% of players in high MMR brackets are cheaters, meaning you will have one in every 4th or 5th game on average. What I have been noticing increasingly more often are subtle wallhacks, which are however still fairly blatant for experienced players. I think these cheats are some of the most popular because you cannot be manually banned with video evidence for this, as no video evidence will ever guarantee someone is wallhacking, even if it is very blatant. They either get caught by EAC or nothing happens. And EAC is infamously terrible at detecting non-public cheats. I personally know about a few players that even admitted to cheating years ago and are not banned to this day. And I've seen others that I suspected of cheating and who turned out to have multiple cheater accusations on their profiles for the same stuff, and they too are still not banned. I have little confidence in EAC.
Here is a suggestion for something that could actually help the game a ton: Implement a function that allows players to save replays of matches to their device, from which they can watch the match from all perspectives and enable/disable auras of every player in them. Not only would this solve the issue of only being able to report a cheater if you happened to have a recording running at the time of the incident, but it would also make it much easier to identify cheating to begin with. You could watch the entire match from the perspective of the suspected player and check for any possible incident, as well as enable player auras to make potential wallhacks obvious.
Not only that, the replay function would also be a tool of gameplay analysis enabling players to get a lot better at the game, understanding the flow of matches, what everyone did in them, how matches were won or lost, mistakes they or anyone made.
You could anonymize all the player names in these replays such that they won't as readily be able to be used to "shame" players or whatever, only of course you'd still have to retain the option to report players from these replays such that the player ID can be identified.
0 -
It's empty talk to me.
I've heard it all before. Communication is a good start but it means little if the problem isn't lessened.
0 -
Looks like their rolling out the old "secretly working on it behind the scenes" like they have used for MMR in the past, i really wish they would been seen to be tackling hackers head on, it really sucks having to make the choice of having to DC and be punished or play out some non game
0 -
Also note, BHVR finally decided to "pull back the curtain" only after NUMEORUS content creators and Fog Whisperers not only called them out but began threatening to leave en masse because BHVR hasn't done jack all to stop this nonesense. Just like BHVR didn't care to fix colorblind settings until they got called out in articles. Nor did they fix Blackface Bubba til a well known black streamer called them out. And just like they didn't make a character gay (which huh, all it took was a tweet, can see why it was so difficult) until they'd had some bad PR.
Remember, BHVR only cares about issues when the spotlight is thrown on so everyone can see how little this company actually cares.
0 -
Devs have already stated that in order for the game to have a replay function, the game needs to be built from the ground up to support it. So it's unlikely and possibly quite difficult (not to mention expensive in terms of time and money) to implement a replay system. At this point, the devs have to go ahead with the product they have and include features that can be implemented in a reasonable amount of time like server-side validation etc. (which the devs have already confirmed in their roadmap). I am quite satisfied by the roadmap that they have proposed, now the only question is if they can implement the features they mentioned within the timeline that they have given us.
0 -
The idea that the entire game would have to be rebuilt to support a replay function is pretty wild to me. Granted, I don't know of any game myself that got retrofitted with such functionality, but it's still quite ridiculous that even games from the turn of the century or even earlier than that had fully functional replay systems, even with advanced operations (such as free-roaming cam), yet DbD apparently cannot have it. (And even its spectator mode is pretty rudimentary and awfully limited in features.) I'm not a programmer, but in my mind it would be as simple as having the game server log the game events that it already processes anyway, and provide client functionality to re-create the match from that log.
The roadmap is more of a "meh" to me. Anti-sniping measures mostly only benefit big streamers that are being targeted; the failsaves (match is forced to end 5 minutes after EGC concludes, and after 1 hour at the latest) are something that seems like it could be shipped tomorrow rather than in weeks or months, and really could have been shipped ages ago already if they had actually taken these things seriously, and I also wonder whether more advanced "failsaves" or analytics aren't possible (identifying things such as players moving at speeds that are literally impossible, or engaging in otherwise impossible actions (e. g. being hooked 10 times within a second)), and if so, why they aren't being implemented to if not outright ban, at least kick these players from matches; "improved support tools" and "continued support" are pretty vague, the best improvement for the anti-cheat support tools would of course be a replay function, anything short of that will always come down to "did you happen to record the player in the precise moment where the alleged cheating is also undeniably evident?"; "player report feedback" is nice for non-Steam players. And as you said, now we'll have to wait and see what actually comes of these things, and how effective they will be if they come. Server validation specifically is something I do not have a lot of confidence in, since even the crucial hit validation ended up being "if the killer has an abysmally bad connection - and no earlier than that - the server will sort of sometimes overrule their hits, but most of the time they'll still hit you from 10m"...
That all said, if nothing else, I am glad that the devs publically addressed the cheating issue here, and that some work is being done on that front. And while the 200k is not saying much, it's at least saying something. While I would be curious how many of those bans were manual, and whether they aren't also including temporary bans in that number (which would be pretty disingenuous), I'm still glad to know that on average, a 100 accounts have been getting banned per day throughout the game's existence.
1
