SURVIVORS ARE STRONG

its not even only camping or that fancy fantasy word "tunneling" and the just as fancy made up word "slugging". Those are just easy targets to blame someone for playing to their advantage. You could aswell argue it doesnt require skill to do gens or throw pallets. You dont hear killers say "stop throwing pallets" all though they give the survivors also a huge advantage.

What they really think is unfun is loosing. Which is true, who loves to loose? but i can decide to blame it on various things that people have written in their rulebook or i can take the L and try next, OR, if its too annoying then i can like... Play something else and try the next day.

People should play how they want, as long as they are not cheating they are fine.

How do you punish tunneling and camping?

If you scour the forums people will say they camp and tunnel because it's effective and then they will say it's needed in high level play. So who do I believe, you a survivor main? Or a killer main who claims tunneling and camping is necessary to win? If it is used in high MMR wouldn't that imply it's a highly effective strategy and not something easily punishable?

Does the killer compliment you when you run them for 2-3 gens because as a survivor main I've never gotten a killer be like "you actually were too good in the chase". The only communication I've gotten is being hit on hook or camped. Should I feel flattered then?

What are the perks that counter tunneling and camping?

The ones I can think of for camping are Reassurance which isn't free and you'd need to always be the one going for the save just to check if the killer is around and maybe Kinship, which requires teamplay.

For tunneling I can think of maybe BT and Off the Record and in the past DS when it was stronger, but it is also behind a paywall.

Or should you instead run a gen-rushing build like Hyperfocus/Stake out with Toolbox?

Wouldn't that only re-inforce the idea that killers have to run 4 gen-slowdown perks? And then survivors have to use builds for gen-rushing. Is that really the fun part of the game?

Just stop claiming tunneling and camping can be punished easily. There's a reason high level players also use them, because they are highly effective and they are very accessible for every killer. They don't depend on perks or killer power because every killer can do that (some better than others of course) and sometimes maps make camping even easier when they have narrow hallways and you can pretty much body block entrances. (what do you do against insta down killers camping?)

If you play like 5 games a week maybe I can understand your attitude but if you play 5-7 games daily as soloq survivor and still stay as positive and want to spread a positive message then can't we say the same about killers complaining about going against gen-rushing builds and bully squads and SWFs.

Also, if you ran the killer for 2 gens and did a gen or two and rescued two people but you lost (die) trying to body block for your teammate who's on death hook can you say this person did bad and they deserve to lose? What mistake did he personally make when he contributed so much?

Camping and tunelling is more accessible as it is the first instinct any newbie killer has.

Looping is not an instinct for survivors or understanding which pallets are safe and which not and gens do require some timing at first. Newbie survivors' instinct at first is too hide and run in a straight line, but the game doesn't work like that because they don't know how to hide effectively or when they are supposed to run in a straight line.

Killers do complain about looping and gen-rushing though, and doing gens is survivors' main objective.

Now ask the rest of the hardcore killer mains here if they like survivors looping them for 2-3 gens. Because most of what I see is people complaining about main buildings and safe pallets. And the killer that is coming has an anti-loop power. Even BHVR doesn't like looping anymore and probably want to move the game into a more gen-oriented meta (new survivor has 3 perks focused on gens with one also being an aura revealing perk under conditions and killer has 1 perk about gens but also gives aura revealing, 1 for aura reveal and one for getting stunned, basically punishing survivors for getting pallet stuns).

I'm sure playing with a team of people you know the game is completely different and very fun, but playing alone in a game that wants to go even more into the teamplay route while being hostile to soloq having anyway to communicate with each other besides aura perks for team is painful.

And I play LoL, which is known as being highly toxic and also requires team-co-ordination and I don't think I've ever felt this helpless as in DBD soloq.

there is a diffrent between being annoyed by things or trying to tell you to follow my rulebook. I hate loops as a killer, its not fun. Ive never heard a killer say "dont loop its lame".

just tired of the "dont do that, dont do this." how about "dont try to make others play how YOU want them to." for a change?

I don't. To me it makes perfect sense that killers will tunnel and camp because that is what the game supports and it is the most effective way to win by design.

What I dislike is that this specific strategy has no barrier to entry because it is not gated by perks OR killer powers (obviously some killers excel at camping because of their power) and not even skill (like I said even a newbie player has the ability to do this and the instinct), but to counter it you have to have co-ordination. It frankly asks a lot more on the survivor side than the killer side. If it was more skillful to do perhaps I wouldn't be as bothered since that would mean people who are good at killer can do this and people who are new or bad cannot (like dead hard and flashlights for survivors).

Now keep in mind that this is from a soloq player and not a person playing with SWF and it seems to me from the new chapter that will come out, that BHVR cares more about the game going towards a more team-oriented direction with the new survivor's perk which revolve all around gens and seems to me they are pushing the focus to gens. Now this would be well and good if soloq players had any means to communicate and co-ordinate with each other but currently they don't.

So understand why I am being rather unpleasant. You could say I've been spoiled by League of Legend's available communication even if you don't have voice-chat and seeing DBD being allergic to implementing the bare minimum (like in game chat) strikes me as weird and strange.

It feels like playing soloq you have less agency but more responsibility. Unlike equal responsibility. It's high risk low reward. Your mistakes count a lot more as a soloq survivor and on top of that you can also influence negatively your team by your mistake.

But good decisions don't always guarantee a win even if you have 8 good decision and do 2 mistakes those mistakes can cost you a lot more. So it feels even if individually you do well, you don't have carry potential unless killer is so bad.

And this is also the same way League has evolved over the years. Like back in the earlier seasons some champions could steamroll the other team by themselves, but as years have passed that power has been negated from those champions and it is easier to shut them down now.

As a survivor you can't have such a huge role because there isn't a group of perks that allows you to do so much and your resources are finite. So the more the game lasts the weaker survivors become.

Personally when I play killer and it is rare mind you, I just go for the 3k and don't sweat it and give hatch. For me 3k is a win, perhaps I'd go for 4k if I felt the last survivor didn't deserve it or to challenge myself, so I guess by that I follow the survivor's rulebook since that's probably how survivors would prefer you win as opposed to slugging for the 4k. At the same time I'm not above tunneling or proxy camping (I play Artist so you can't really use her power near a hook anyway). I don't tunnel intentionally yet but if someone unhooks and I'm close and I feel the guy who got unhooked is easier to catch than the unhooker I'll go after them. As for proxy camping I do it near end-game since usually survivors will try to go for the save and you can get a few kills that way. Like I said, I play it rarely so perhaps if I played it as often as survivor I would change my mind who knows.

Camping and tunneling feel hopeless because soloq does not have adequate tools to deal with them. Like you can't even see your team's perks. If I knew someone had certain perks, maybe I'd know or at least try how to play around it (say Deliverance). I like to run Distortion as survivor if I'm trying hard so as not to give away info to the killer, but distortion can be so much more if you can just communicate but in soloq you can't. For example if killer is running Lethal Persuer I try to tbag my teammates to communicate it to them, maybe they'll understand but it never works.

The game is supposed to be played as a team but here I can't play as a teammate because the game's design itself won't let me lol. Those are the frustrating parts, because you can do so much more for you team but the game limits you while if you played in a SWF you wouldn't have that problem.

We could start with icons or a ping system and even written chat, that would be a huge improvement already.

I don't disagree with you, I was only saying that tunneling and camping are hard to punish and not easy as the OP claimed, otherwise you wouldn't see those strategies be effective in high MMR as well.

And I've made it clear I come from a soloq perspective, where camping and tunneling are easily more successful because of the lack of communication and co-ordination of the team. Killers thrive a lot more in un-coordinated environments, don't you think so?

stop pretending people should cheer you when you are camping and tunneling all game.