Survivors, why don’t you bring OTR, DS or Dead Hard anymore?
Lately people never bring anti-tunnel perks or exhaustion perks anymore and it’s getting annoying cuz they are the mostly getting tunneled out of the game immediately. I always have DS and Dead Hard in my build, and let me tell you that DS is still really good. Nobody expects DS anymore and that 3 sec is not that bad actually. I’m sorry if you are getting tunneled, but if you don’t bring anti-tunnel perks in your games, you deserve to get tunneled out cuz you should know by now that most Killers these days camp and tunnel, and it’s to buy your team some time to do the gens while the Killer is trying to tunnel you out of the game.
Comments
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DS - is situational perk. It is only really effective if the killer doesn't have catch up power or the Survivor is downed next to a safe place or a good pallet, etc. Againts the strongest killers, where you need this perk the most, is it the least impactfull.
OTR - I think this one isn't a rare perk, it is still good, but it can be easily countered by Killer if they just hit you right after you are being unhooked.
DH - It is still a good perk but limited. I would say it is pretty good because most killers will not play around this perk which gives DH a good value before the nerf. I think people just droped it because it is nerfed so they think its bad.
Overall the only not so great perk is DS. The rest is still powerfull.
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Because......
Tunneler hit you immediately after you got unhooked .... So.....
Off the record ..... Immediately.... gone...
Better.... Reassurance
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The thing is, neither of those Perks actually help against tunneling. OTR and DH can be negated by the Killer via just swinging after the Unhook. It takes away OTR, the basekit Endurance, potential BT-Endurance and the ability to use DH. This is because all of them resolve around Endurance.
And when it comes to DS, it was laughable against the strongest Killers at 5 seconds. With 3 seconds, it is around 7 meters of distance for the Survivor (since 1,3 seconds are used for the animation). And at this point, it is only a mild inconvenience for the Killer. If you are in a deadzone or dont have a pallet or window VERY close to you, DS does nothing.
I can understand Survivors not using those Perks anymore. (even tho, I see quite a bunch of OTRs)
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I never brought the perks before the nerf, and i wont bring them now. Tunneling either is an issue, or its not. If it is an issue, its not fixed by perks, we have seen that in the past. Then devs have to do something about it, or people will stop playing. If it is not an issue, you dont need them in the first place.
But the truth is, i just play killer instead of survivor, because i dont want those tunneling matches, regardless of outcome.
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Because they don't even work lmao.
DS has a 3 second stun. That's enough for all of half a second of distance, considering the falling off the shoulder animation is more than half of that time. Against stronger killers like Nurse or Blight it's literally a wasted perk slot.
OTR relies on Endurance. Hard tunneling by hitting directly off the hook literally hard counters the anti-tunnel perk. Yes, you read that right, the counter to the anti-tunnel perk is to tunnel harder.
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DS new synergy with DH makes it a very good option to make tunnelers life harder.
Hope people will catch on eventually
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DH gets hard countered by just tunneling harder
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Not with DS, that's the cool part.
Killer hits you off hook to counter DH, you get a speedboost
Killer downs you and picks you up, you DS them.
Deepwound is now gone and you can DH them for another speedboost
Works reasonably well tbh
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OTR and DH are related to endurance, so it doesn't protect you against hard tunneling, the situation you need them the most, because the killer will just swing at you during the BT timer.
DS is way to situational for an 1 time use perk, the 3 s nerf makes it only effective against certain killers and on certain tiles.
Since anti tunnel perks are so weak, you are better just stickig to gens and rush the objective and try and delay the first downs of a killer.
Killer tunels a survivor out but the rest can escape.
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DS Was rendered useless by the stun duration being shortened, every time I see it used the surv just gets downed within the next 10 seconds...
Like deactivating in end game and if you touch a gen ok whatever that's fair as a surv main I agree BUT shortening the stun was just the nail in the coffin and ruined one of the only perks that punished tunnelling because dev's are killer mains basically. OTR Is ok tho but the killer just camps and uses it up in the first 2s anyway so it's pointless in most cases and DH is just dead and buried now...
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Or you just use Sprint Burst, a better exhaustion perk, that nets you so much distance combined with the 10s post-unhook Haste + the on-hit boost, all for fewer perk slots. And it works on both hook states, too.
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So we just need to use 2 bad perks for counter tunnelling. That's very unhealthy design.
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those are two good perks
Just because a perk doesn't give you an automatic win doesn't mean it's bad.
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And where i said those perks are bad because they are not giving you an automatic win? Stop assuming about me.
They are bad because they are useless. Even using both of them together is not effective like the old DS.
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bruh bro, 2 of these perks win your team at least 25 seconds, and if you can loop, then much more, so stop calling good perks bad just because you're bad
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Not correct.
DS = 3 seconds stun. Half of it is animation. So it gives you 1,5 seconds free time to run. And if you have not any good loop near to you, most likely you will down again. And they can just slug you as well. Very situational.
DH = This perk is very situational too. Killer can wait out. You can fail the timing. Server or killer's ping can get you failed etc. People ignored those issues because it was any-time use perk. But now this is not the case. After last nerf, it limited so much which turned it to bad perk.
Let's talk for the best scenario. You stunned killer with DS. Then you got hit with DH. But for your next hook, you will not use DS anymore. And they will expect DH. So both of perks will work for only your first hook. And using those perks after your first hook will make you very easy target for your last hook.
And i am warning you again. Stop assuming about me. Having different opinions doesn't make me a bad player. Those perks are feeling good because you are low mmr player which playing against baby killers, so ofcourse you will say they are good perks. See? I can do the same.
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This is all sorts of wrong.
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Because none of these perks actually help against tunneling.
Off The Record - A very good perk, but usually countered by hard tunneling killers and becomes useless against them.
DS - The 3 second stun is an absolute joke. Killers (especially high mobility ones) can just immediately catch up to you again. Also it's very situational as it deactivates in end game.
Dead Hard - Very limited and restricted, and very situational. Even if you don't get hit while Dead Harding, you still lose the perk. Waste of a perk slot and completely useless
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The problem with anti-tunnel perks is that they sit in your load-out, doing nothing if you run across a killer that doesn't tunnel, or you're not the tunnel target. And even if they do trigger, they've been nerfed down to make sure the killer can overcome the value they provide, despite these perks being the most counterplayable perks in the game.
How many killers bring Lightborn against teams that don't bring flashlights in?
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Im fine if I use anti tunneling/camping perks and Killers not tunnel/camp. Its more fun than using those perks and get tunneled really. And its painful to not use the perks and get tunneled.
And even that, those perks are not enough to anti tunnel/camp.
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I’ve never understood the point of these so-called ‘anti-tunnel’ perks. They don’t help with that at all. Idk why they’re so weak b/c BHVR swears they don’t want players quickly tunneled out of matches
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If I don't bring anti-tunnel I deserve to be tunneled.
But if I bring anti-tunnel but not anti-camping, then I deserve to be camped.
But if I bring anti-camp, not only do I deserve to be tunneled, but I also deserve to be slugged.
But if I bring anti-slug, now I deserve to be tunneled, camped and also 3-genned.
Guess what fixes all these awful situations? Exactly, more gen speed. The less time the killers have to ruin a survivor's game, the more likely you'll make it to the end, and the less effective camping, tunneling, slugging and 3-gens become.
Which brings us to current day DBD meta.
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As someone who plays survivor this is a trick question for me :P dh not as much tho feels clunky only having 2 uses per game but it's still so good w ds
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Because they are weak and usually leaves you with a dead perk unless you hit that perfect situation where you can activate all.
Ds is weak, the 3sec stun is far too little value for the wall of restrictions it has.
For OTR you need to have that perfect scenario where you are being tunneled but not hard enough to be hit inmediately off hook and cancelled, so it is situational.
Dh 2-uses restriction with all the previous ones it had makes it a chore to use, and makes you consider using another exhaustion perk like sprint or Lithe which dont have like 5 restrictions to use
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3 sec of a stun doesn't stop a killer from tunneling. Dead hard work on second hook.
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Ds and dead hard won't stop me from tunneling you fyi. You're better off running sprint and hoping your team finish gens.
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Same here. Like DS and DH are laughable now. They’re definitely not stopping a tunnel.
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If the killer is tunneling and proxy camping then OTR and DH don't actually help you. The killer will hit you right after the unhook so you're in deep wound and now those perks aren't gonna do anything.
DS is certainly better but you HAVE to go down like AT a safe loop because otherwise the killer will just down you again right after.
Also I do still see people using exhaustion perks about as often as before, it's just now there's more Lithe and SB and much less DH.
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DS (and Head On) should both have five second stun times.
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DS and OTR are still pretty good, i'd argue OTR is better. And survivors who complain about getting tunneled but not running one of these is mind boggling. If you don't like it, just run a single perk, and you'll be fine. If you have time to do something else, and you lose DS/OTR, then you aren't getting tunneled.
DH is not an anti-tunnel perk, it actually encourages tunneling and has even before its nerf. If i saw someone use dead hard, the best strategy was actually to tunnel them directly off the hook, hit them so they get deep wounds, and then continue chasing, now you only have an injured survivor with no dead hard, because the dead hard does nothing in deep wound. So i wouldn't lump this one with the other 2.
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OTR by definition is to give you a long timer of deep wound. The basekit BT also gives you endurance and 110% movement speed, and you get a speed boost when getting hit. If you can't get to another loop with 10 seconds of moving at 150% movement speed for 3 seconds and then 110 for 7 more, you are doing something wrong. During that time you should be able to move a full 50 meters of distance. Based on that you should be able to move to any place you want on the map if you are in the middle of it before the killer can reach you.
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I was using OTR, but I just kept getting hit directly off of hook, so it wasn't doing anything.
DS isn't worth the slot and DH isn't either for me.
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DS used to be mandatory, but it got nerfed out of existence during the big perk overhaul. I did run into it the other day, though, and was momentarily really surprised and then remembered that it was a thing I used to see multiple times every match.
And DH is also a lot less common since it was nerfed, but I still see it fairly often.
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Because BHVR doesn't understand its own game. Those perks aren't anti-tunnel perks, they are bully perks for SWFs who play against nice killers.
A tunneling killer will hit you right off the hook which renders OTR and DH completely useless. The stun duration nerf of DS also barely gets you a few seconds at most.
There are currently NO anti-tunneling perks in the game, functionally speaking.
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One of the problems with an anti-tunnel build is there are a lot of times where it doesn't really even matter. If you aren't tunneled, either because the killer doesn't tunnel or tunnels someone else, wasted slots. On the other hand if you are hard tunneled with the killer proxy camping, the perks are only going to add a little bit of life.
In the right situation they get a lot of value, but lots of games they'll have zero return. Lots of players likely prefer perks with a higher chance of being useful, even if the theoretical value you get of them isn't as high.
I do tend to run OTR.
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Reassurance, Camaraderie, Kindred, and Adrenaline are currently the only worthwhile anti-tunneling perks in the game. Hope and Prove Thyself get honorable mentions.
As everyone else said, the perks designed to combat camping/tunneling are too easily countered, and buy far less time for your team than the perks mentioned above.
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Correct but if you aren't a good looper it doesn't really matter. Most survivors aren't good loopers and so hate getting tunneled and want something to stop it completely.
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Nah, just make it disable Killer powers for a few seconds instead. Fixes the issue nicely because the Killers that people cite are ones that use their powers to redown quickly AKA Nurse, Blight, etc.
And with this programmed into the game, it can be applied to other perks and game mechanics. It's perfect.
Do you and the others think that removing the "Endurance not stacking with deep wound" condition might be a valid thing now that DH is nerfed?
If not, we can just have OTR give... a bigger speedboost, perhaps.
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Right, but if you aren't a good looper, what is left. I guess they could try stealthing? They could also run the "i suck at looping build" Lucky Break + Overcome + Inner Healing + Small Game/flex (i like small game to find totems easier). Find a totem quick, do it, killer finds you, and hits you, you overcome away and you make no marks, you break line of sight and just beeline to a locker. I find it works pretty well for making the killer stop chasing you.
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I've never seen DH as anti tunnel. Idk where people get that idea.
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It’s that simple: devs nerfs strong and useful anti-tunnelperks into the ground and want shake up the meta, and now they must fix the tunnling problem with their gameplay and not with perks 🤷🏼♂️
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From the distributor of bad ideas
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The thought actually just hit me. The Entity's realm is clearly supernatural and outworldly things are happening during the trials. So here I am wondering, what if the Entity just teleports away unhooked survivors to a safe space?
When the survivor is freed up, they get brought back to a spawn point which is the furthest away from the killer. If that doesn't stop tunneling I don't know what will.
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All useless and gutted but the devs think it’s ok and fun to get tunnelled out of a game with perks that are just Abysmal when you know how good they could actually be
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If you have competent team mates then DS/DH/Adrenaline are SOLID perks. Countless times DS (jumping in locker right at the end) has come in clutch with Adrenaline at end game, such a good feeling lol.
It's a sweaty way to play but when killers tunnel in solo q, it's the only way to play.
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