Why are people so obsessed with patching out 3 gens
It's not that powerful, gens complete so fast it's impossible to defend them infinitely. You go check on the other two and the one you left can easily have had half of its progress finished with prove thyself and 2 other survivors
You can't commit to chases during 3 gens either, so it's basically just a garenteed survivor win, albeit a long one
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people find long stalemate matches like that absolutely boring
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Against most killers its not -that- powerful but against some it's lot more annoying. Skull Merchant is obviously the main culprit but there are a couple others who make 3-gens too strong.
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As someone who generally plays killer, thinks this game is imbalanced and only 2-3 killers are actually viable at high level play and that gens go too fast...
I think that the game would be a much healthier state, if tunneling, camping, and 3-genning were not in the game at all, and that the game was spread out a bit, so killers didn't lose 3 gens in the first chase, and that the power curve for killers was evened out a bit so that they stay roughly the same power throughout the match.
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so it's basically just a guaranteed survivor win, albeit a long one
- False, its a war of attrition, and it can definitely be the survivors who lose that war.
- The vast majority of solo survivors cannot coordinate well enough to break a 3 gen.
- Either way, nobody wants a long game like this.
I had this on RPD with a Nemesis yesterday, it wasn't even a close 3 gen, but it was possible for the Nemesis to get between the furthest gens faster than we could repair them, and with the occasional injury slowing things down, there was no chance of the three of us who remained getting that last gen done.
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The only one I really find it degenerate on is SM, otherwise 3 genning is totally fine to me.
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it's bhvr's own doing, first they created the worst meta of all time where killers just refused to chase in order to kick gens for the millionth time especially 3 gens and they created two killers that made this play style much much worse.
and then they nerfed the gen kick meta and one of those killers who was too good at it and it still did nothing and that killer remained exceptionally good at protecting 3 gens so now people are so fed up with the whole thing when it only used to be an occasional problem which is mostly caused by Survivors.
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killer get 2.5% gen-kick regression. if you kick 10 gens in 3 gen. you get like 25% regression across gen-kicks. It shouldn't outpace your gen progress if you do not get hit and run away from generators. just let killer walk away and as he walks away, you progress gen. by the time killer returns, you should have more progress then 2.5% kick. you only need two people doing this. Of course it is way faster if you have 4 survivors doing this.
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And if you score hits along the way and force survivors to either spend time healing or running early...
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getting hit is mistake. it is not game losing if 4 survivor are alive because 1 survivor can heal another survivor but doing gens part is slower.
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I was on the gen in the library. When the killer came up to me, I didnt see him until he was already less than 10m away. The gen is right by the door, his TR was always present.
From that point he would push me out of the library and down to the next level, at which point he was closer to the other gen, or I would get injured, or both. If I didn't get injured anyway because 10m minus tentacle range doesn't leave much wiggle room. Either way, by the time I made the journey back to the gen, along his patrol route so avoiding getting injured there too, I got about 5 seconds of repair time before he was back on me again.
5% repair - 2.5% kick - 30+ seconds of regression = negative progress.
How do you deal with that?
Edit: for visualisation, red = Nemesis, blue = my long route back to the gen, green = being chased and very likely to get injured.
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I understand that it's not fun to play against a 3 genning killer but the more this gets reduced the more brain dead and safe gen rushing becomes. I remember back when everyone was saying stuff like: "Yeah, but survivors gen rush themselves into 3 gens. So it's not that big of a deal because you can punish them for doing that." And now we're literally talking about getting rid of this.
Also, weakening 3 gens basically means nerfing the killer's late game. At some point I have to ask, when is the killer actually supposed to get stuff done? We're ok with the fact the the killer will easily lose 2-3 gens for their first hook. Because after that the game turns more in their favor. But when the killer can only defend the 4th gen because the 5th is gonna get done anyway I struggle to understand how the killer is expected to actually achieve something. And keep in mind, games get shorter the more you nerf gen regression and territorial play styles like camping and 3 genning. Which also results in killers having less time to reduce the survivor's ressources and in turn to more ressources available during the end game. Which screws the killer again because then they can't even hope to defend the exit gates (as unlikely as that already is with multiple survivors still alive).
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See I don't really understand why people demand it patched. It's so easy to counter 3 gens. Let me tell you how it's simple. You just loop the killer while your teammates complete the gens. See that simple. Now if you can't loop the killer than that's a skill issue,and you shouldn't demand a patch just because you lack the skill to effectively stale the killer.
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RPD has strong 3 gen spawn. its pretty killer sided post-rework. I assume 3 gens are gen at bottom in main lobby, the gen on top of the left staircase and gen on library. RPD east wing is like dead dog saloon 3 gen. its impractical 3 gen to defeat. you work on the middle hallway generator and then you pre-shift w middle hallway generator by going on one the east wing exits. the library generator is generator that you just progress to threaten killer to walk to library and while killer walks to the library, your team should progress the middle hallway generator. RPD east wing is probably up there with most killer sided maps in the game. I'd probably class it as maybe 2nd killer-sided map in the game. you have to face weak killer to defeat that 3 gen. Just looking at that layout, I bet a nurse could 3 gen that map as infinity by just blinking to library back and forth.
it just showcases why having small maps is not good design. it promotes unhealthy gameplay with gen spread.
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Edit: This is what your survivor team should be doing vs nemesis. Survivor 1 in green should be doing gen. when he hears TR marked by thick red dot, he should run outside waiting for killer to kick gen and leave.
survivor #2 which is you. you should be doing gen and when you hear nemesis heartbeat intensify as he comes close to library door. you should run to next room then fall as he kicks gen. Location is marked by Thick red Dot for when you should be running away.
survivor #3 should be on middle hallway generator. he should let go of the generator as soon as he hears nemesis fall. he should move away to outside exit gate hallway. For yellow survivor, Thick red dot is marked on green line.
Post edited by Devil_hit11 on1 -
just loop the killer lol. u never been in a 3 gen hu
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You can't hide there, your purple dot, there's no cover and he walks right through it. And his heartbeat is the same from the moment he enters the main lobby, so you can't predict when he's going to turn that corner, particular when his loop is broken up by microchases.
I'm not entirely sure what the other survivors were doing, but they were intermittently getting injured and then hiding/healing.
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you do not hide. you run forward as he falls down. if he chases you, he loses because survivor 4 can help survivor 1(green) to finish the gen. in practice, yellow will not be able finish his gen because he will constantly be interrupted but he can make killer stop to kick the gen which give you more time to work on your gen. Green should finish the gen faster then anyone because he has best positioning in relationship to the map. It takes most time for the killer to interrupt him in comparison to interrupting purple or yellow.
If you were getting hit then someone should heal you. In practice, you should try to be 15 meters ahead of the killer. 15 meters ahead of the killer is roughly where yellow or green is when away from generator. this makes killer not want to chase you because it takes too long for him to catch-up. if they do chase you, they will lose their 3 gen. In other words, you defeat 3 gen.
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Devs said they never intended for the game to be played that way (no one likes long games) hence why they're finding a solution.
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killers not allowed to use strategy
must chase random survivors without thought or devs will take action
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Because Skull Merchant holding games hostage for an hour isn't fun.
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It is necessary unfortunately. With the current state of the game, survivors are able to do gens so quickly and gen regression perks aren't enough to slow the game down to the point where the killer can catch up on their own. Locking down 3 gen can slow the game down considerably buying the killer some time to make some hooks and catch up, but, it can not be maintained forever. As long as survivors are able to hyper tunnel the gens and they can be done so quickly that the killer cant keep up then tactics like this have to exist. Breaking up 3 gens as survivor is an important counter to this tactic.
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1: Like camping, 3 genning is fine when it's only a small part of the game. However, it can get abused, again like camping, where the killer just devotes from the very beginning of the game to defending the 3 gen (like a killer who face camps)
2: Yes, it's counterable, but its not fun.
3: It's much harder to counter in soloq. It's great to point out the obvious tactics, but even if the team in soloq is decent, there's no way to coordinate who should be on what end of the 3 gen.
4: If the killer refuses to leave a 3 gen when you are at 3 survivors it can easily stalemate the game.
5: It's much improved after recent patches, but it could still be better.
6: It ruins whatever theme the game has left. The killer playing defense while the survivors attack/retreat just doesn't really work.
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3 gen existed way before 6.7
If anything, it’s one of the few macro strategies left for Killer
I don’t see how 3 gen can be fixed without making maps bigger, but we know what happens when maps are bigger.
If survivors didnt try to do gens on opposite sides of the map at the start, it’s a gameplay issue and they should have a harder time later on because of it.
Given how most gen regression perks have been nerfed, I wouldn’t be surprised if 3 gen is on its way to becoming as uncommon as a sweaty 4 man swf.
Post edited by appleas on2 -
It certainly does seem like BHVR is pushing for survivors to win nearly every match.
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Your fun is not my responsibility.
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"Which how most gen regression perks have been nerfed, I wouldn’t be surprised if 3 gen is on its way to becoming as uncommon as a sweaty 4 man swf."
yeah 3 genning isn't even powerful anymore but skull merchant alone is keeping the hate alive.
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In addition to the comments about it being boring and matches up to an hour, it's also one of the very very few times the devs have actually said this is not intended gameplay:
I believe they also said they're working on a long term fix to patch out the strategy of killers planning to camp a 3gen from the lobby, though we don't have details yet. I can't find a link, this might've been in a recent dev stream?
For a game that's largely a sandbox from the dev's perspective (anything goes, play how you want, if anything is problematic we'll adjust the perk, etc), having them actually say 'you're playing our game wrong' is massive.
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The three gen itself isn't a guaranteed survivor victory by any means. It is, however, nothing like the big deal some players make it out to be.
For the most part things were fine until the "Forged in Fog" chapter, amd the problem was dramatically worsened with "Tools of Torment". What really made 3 gens a problem was vastly down to the killer design. Up until then, it was mainly survivor mistakes with a bit of RNG, but those alone really were not problematic as even a squad of 4 solo players with some experience would understand where to do the gens.
I'm concerned the problem was caused by poor killer design, but the devs are looking at more convoluted ways of dealing with it, rather than just changing Skull Merchant entirely and perhaps altering the Knight a tad. It's not the nightmare those people make it out to be.
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You really can tell when people have never stepped foot into solo queue and seen the complete lack of coordination on display. It's the same reason they're removing hook grabs, facecamping etc. Killers abuse things and demolish uncoordinated solos and then act shocked when they get changed.
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There should be a surrender option or something because I don't think you can realistically stop killers from intentionally afk in 3 gen without hurting people actually progressing the game while playing around a 3 gen. Maybe individual killers need reworked if their power results in stalemates. Early endgame collapse could be a thing if survivors are just hiding from killer (last 2) or a killer isn't actively injuring/hooking survivors for a long time.
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Maps are huge part of problem, because some gens spawn so near each other, and we have "bottle neck" maps where it's just mandatory for the killer to camp one side and never go the another one. To make it worse, gen spawns never balanced for those maps, so you have like 5 gens on one side...
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"its not that powerful"
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If the game is constantly balanced with solo queue in mind swf will just become better and better
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