When is Blight and Skull Merchant killswitched?

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So there is no secret that it didn't take long for flashlights to be killswitched. Why is Blight and Skull Merchant not killswitched?

Just in case killer mains try to justify that these killers are just perfectly fine, Blight has an exploit that is not intended and can be used for an extreme unfair advantage, especially when the blight player knows how to abuse it. Skull Merchant can hold a game hostage for an hour as long as survivors are willing to stay in the match and not eat a penalty.

Skull Merchant should be kill switched.

Comments

  • Zokenay
    Zokenay Member Posts: 1,158
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    Hes referring to the curve thing which makes Blight pretty BS at loops, that needs to be patched alongside his addons.

  • Brokenbones
    Brokenbones Member Posts: 5,157
    edited September 2023
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    Ehh

    'Working as intended' isn't quite right in Blight's case. I'm not saying he should be killswitched, but the fact he's allowed to bend the rules of his power's built in limitations isn't exactly 'working as intended' imho

    It's fine overall but it's def not 'intended' if that makes sense. Permitted or accepted, sure I can accept that

  • mecca
    mecca Member Posts: 220
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    There's really no difference in Skull Merchant holding a game hostage and a flashlight causing you to be invincible. At least with a flashlight, the killer can chase the other 3 players and end the match. Skull Merchant not so much.

  • mecca
    mecca Member Posts: 220
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    You are very wrong. They are exploits.

    Definition: In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitch, or use elements of a game system in a manner not intended by the game's designers, in a way that gives a substantial unfair advantage to players using it.

    It is not hard to see that Blight's curve movement is not intended for "an unfair advantage" and Skull Merchant holding a game hostage was not intended.

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
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    Why does everyone hate Skull? She’s my new favorite killer now. I don’t even have to 3 gen lock, and I still win. She’s the only defensive killer done correctly. I liked Knight, but he doesn’t even work anymore. Made For This lets players outrun all of his summons.

    I think only survivor mains hate Skull. If you’re a killer main, or in the middle (Me), you wouldn’t hate her. Unless you’re in solo queue (Also me). Skull in solo is a nightmare. As potatoes and lemming hide all day. For those complaining about holding the game hostage. That’s part of the killer’s job. To keep you locked inside the match until they get you.

  • Nazzzak
    Nazzzak Member Posts: 4,766
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    The devs have said that locking the game down for an hour is not an intended part of gameplay and is why Skull Merchant has an upcoming rework

  • Alice_pbg
    Alice_pbg Member Posts: 6,544
    edited September 2023
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    neither curving on blight or defending a 3 gen is considered a bug or exploit. glad I could help again.

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
    edited September 2023
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    Blight's hugtech wasn't considered an exploit until recently. They knew it was in the game since his release and they were fine with it. Kinda like CJ techs and locker techs. And even then, it is not game breaking. You can still play like normal. It's just that his power does have some unforseen side effects.

    For Caitlyn 3Genner I can only say that it's not an exploit. It's just how her power works. I personally wouldn't mind to see her killswitched but I'm not even sure they are within their legal rights to do that in this case. Because they would simply killswitch her due to public demand and not game breaking bugs. And over an extended period of time, since a rework takes quite a bit.

  • Zokenay
    Zokenay Member Posts: 1,158
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    Thats what i was referring to, and it is essentially an exploit that needs to be fixed, its even more BS when hes using speed addons that make the thing essentially impossible to dodge if he pulls it off fast.

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,425
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    Because I despise the fact that walking in a triangle can net you a win after forfeiting all other parts of the game that could be advantageous to you.

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,425
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    I mean is that the case? McClean knew the hug tech was a thing before he left and didn't remove it because blights collision wasn't where he wanted it to be at all. From that standpoint you could say it was technically intended by him the creator. Unfortunately I doubt anything regarding blights collision detection will be changed now that he is gone and a LOT of collision on maps has been changed to blights detriment since Wesker.

    Like yeah you can refer to bhvrs statement they made a year and a half ago now but no one probably understands blight too thoroughly or is very good at him on the dev team.

    He should receive add-on nerfs for sure, but the hug tech shouldn't be removed even if his collision does get fixed. It has more counterplay than normal blight majority of the time and the times it's strong is at filler tiles or only relatively strong because the tiles themselves don't accommodate his power in some way.

  • Brokenbones
    Brokenbones Member Posts: 5,157
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    If BHVR comes out and says he is working as intended, then i shall accept that but they haven't and new bug reports about hug tech are being closed as 'duplicates' which carries an implication that the old bug report, the one BHVR responded to - is still valid and being looked into

    It's not a hill I'm gonna die on but I def don't think it's fair to say it's working as intended. Hug tech is one thing, but Blight's being able to moonwalk during their power? How is that remotely intended behaviour of the power? It's not, it's bending the rules imo

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
    edited September 2023
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    I am a killer main and I hate her with a passion. I have had the... Let's call it the "SM experience" 3 times so far. 2 wanted to play chess and 1 started more chase oriented (until we had finished 3 gens). Neither of them were enjoyable to play against. Playing: "Let's break a 3 gen" for 40 minutes is miserable and so is: "Run from loop to loop and go down no matter what, thanks to free haste."

    You can't break her 3 gen (in solo queue) and you can't loop either. For me it's not even fun to play as her. I feel like I'm not even playing against real players with her because you basically reduce the survivors to bots. She has no skill floor or skill ceiling and beating her takes immensely more skill than actually playing her.

    I would rather play against a gen hostage Doctor with 6.1.0's CoB, Overcharge, Eruption combo than Caitlyn 3Genner now. Hell, I'd take Forever Freddy over her. Freddy would at least chase you. She holds the game hostage by not even interacting with the survivors. This is not part of the killer's job. The killer should chase the survivors not wait until the game shuts down.

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,425
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    It doesn't take a year and a half to at the very least make blight not be able rush while looking below a certain angle. I doubt the character will stay fluid in feel by any means they use to fix it.

    The only real tech blight has is the hug tech and anything else is pretty much a derivative of it. But lets be real, a moon rush is simply not going to hit someone that is paying attention. If the blight has enough space to moonrush and the survivor is paying attention, there really shouldn't be a hit, especially when most things you can or are even a little bit worth moonrushing are at filler pallet tiles. It's one of those things that it doesn't matter if blight can moonrush as it's typically a bad idea in the first place. I could moonrush the filler car tile outside the front of badham preschool and give the survivor several opportunities to completely counter it or I could bump 4 times and at the very least get a pallet out. Who cares if it's not intended? It's fun and not strong.

  • Brokenbones
    Brokenbones Member Posts: 5,157
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    But it does bend the rules though, right?

    That's the issue here, no matter how fun or balanced you might think it is. The reason why Nurse is so strong is because her power by design bends the rules of the game. I think Blight having limitations and being able to ignore them doesn't really seem like good design imo

    I get that you find it fun/balanced and the like, and I'm not saying it isn't necessarily. I just don't agree with the concept of it

  • AbsolutGrndZer0
    AbsolutGrndZer0 Member Posts: 1,269
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    Okay, but Killswitch Doctor too. He causes sensory overload in many players and can be an actual physical pain to go against.

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,425
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    I respect that you have an issue with it but I simply don't see the reason for it. Nurse bends the rules in a way that is op, when blight bends the rules there are only certain scenarios where it's heavily advantageous and honestly the only two that are super impactful are rush use mitigation while traversing the map and tiles like cold wind long walls with no collision on at least two sides.

    If it adds a layer of skill expression to both sides and is more counterable at most tiles than bump logic, what is the harm? It only adds to the game. Most killers just put you in scenarios where you lose with little gameplay(ofc there is a time amount associated with this that can take forever), there are few that are truly interactive. Huntress, Wesker, Billy(although he is under powered) and blight without his ridiculous add-ons come to mind.

    If I was asking for a lot from survivors when vsing blight I would say learn all collision on blight so they can also recognize and abuse a lack of collision or even force a pluto outside of the shack tile. Blight has the largest variety of counterplay but that doesn't mean a single bit of it is available at a given time.

    Again though, if you don't like the fact that it wasn't necessarily intended all the power to you. I just don't see a single downside in terms of gameplay regarding it.

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
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    Survivors could do that as well. How many times have you heard Hold-W. Even as a joke? Because survivors could run in a single direction, and still win. No thinking whatsoever.

    Killers that decide to play that way is their fault. Not the killer’s. You’re just admitting to a toxic play style that she can do, which by now you should understand if you play DBD. This game is incredibly toxic. People will exploit, and abuse nonstop until they win.

  • Sava18
    Sava18 Member Posts: 2,425
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    I'm not admitting to anything. I play blight because I despised the brain dead hold w thing back in the day. But just holding w even vs m1 killers is nowhere near as good as skull merchant walking in a triangle.

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
    edited September 2023
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    After I made the Devour Hope build on her I don’t do anything else. I have to chase, and down players to get stacks. 2 drones for her totems. 1 for a gen. 1 for chases. Players still get to do gens. Players still get to engage in chase. It’s fun being able to Mori at the expense of some gen pressure sometimes. If you play her right it’s often that she gets 5 before all the gens are done.

    Complaining about her 3 gen lock is like complaining about tunneling/camp. It works. So that is what people will often do. Is it fun? Nope. I’m sorry most experiences with her is awful, but that is a player issue. It just proves how toxic the player base is. She can do all kinds of cool stuff, but people love to choose no brainer strategies in DBD.

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
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    Tunneling and camping progress the game, so that isn't really a fair comparison to playing Caitlyn 3Genner.

    And honestly, good for you if you enjoy her with the Devour build but it still isn't fun to play against. You get to do gens. But the actual chasing part? That is still the same. She finds you, sets up a drone, you leave the loop, rinse and repeat until you get hit. Occasionally you might predrop a pallet but that's about all that will happen. You can't really loop against a killer that basically has infinite blood lust. So you also can't do any of the fun stuff in chase.

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
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    You can with MFT. Everyone I faced over my vacation this week had Haste, which they get just from being hit. Minimum of 2 MFT per match. If anything she’s evening the odds, and that’s only if survivors hack her drones.

    I finally got what I call a Hex Killer. I can dedicate to using Hexes without constantly worrying about them being broken whenever I decided to chase someone for more than 10 seconds. Without needing Undying to keep a particular perk around.

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
    edited September 2023
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    If “fun stuff” for survivor you mean loop around the same spot? Then pallet toss when BL starts? That isn’t fun. It’s really boring. With Windows I do this all the time as survivor since I get an idea of tile layouts with it.

    Forcing survivors to move away from strong loops like that means survivors have to use more of their brains. To think of where you want to take the killer quicker than they normally would. Again, with MFT that is so easy to accomplish. Survivors always reach spots they wouldn’t have, or must find 2 strong loops that connect. Even when I play Skull survivors will run me for some time before they’re caught. If they know what they’re doing.

    I use MFT, Dark Theory, and Windows on survivor. I can run the killer all day before they realize I’m way too fast. Heaven forbid I get Meat Plant, or Midwich when I run the speed build. Haha

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
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    Great. You can play against her and not feel like you're screwed no matter what as long as you use a perk that is argued to be broken and will likely get a nerf pretty soon. And only, if she doesn't use specific addons or changes her play style...

    I don't like these oddds.

    What I meant was playing around pallets and structures. Mind gaming, faking and outsmarting. All of that doesn't work when one is just way faster than normal. I hate when I get equalized to a bot. And that is exactly what this killer does. You don't have any complex plays against her. You don't get to mind game and chase like you do with other killers because you can't play around her power. Instead you turn off your brain and do exactly what a bot would do without ever thinking about it.

    Play her, if you must but don't expect other people to like it. In my opinion she is the single most unfun killer to play against and playing as her (for me) isn't any better.

  • Brimp
    Brimp Member Posts: 2,788
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    My brother in christ no matter what you say about hug tech... bump logic will always be fare superior.

  • xEmoGirlxAlexisx
    xEmoGirlxAlexisx Member Posts: 593
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    Skull Merchant isnt a Bug or something its just a unfun tactic but u still can Play the Game

    Blight is bugged Yes but it isnt Gamebreaking u still can Play the Game like normal the Bug just make him a little but bit stronger

    The Flashlight Locker Bug is Game breaking because it Ruin the Game when the Last 2 Survivor abusing this bugged u cant do anything as Killer and the Survivor hold ur hostage or u need to DC the Game this is why Flashlights needed to be Killswitched very fast

    Killswitching a Killer just because he is unfun to Play against isnt the reason for the Killswitch System ... Killswitching is for Game breaking Bugs that makes the Game unplayable

  • WilliamSN
    WilliamSN Member Posts: 524
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    We've reached a point of people trying to defend the noclip exploit that you're actively trying to compare blight hugtech that just lets you slide against walls to survivors being able to noclip into a locker and be invincible+ hold game hostage.

    On the topic of SM, the game lasts long because both sides are playing extremely passive , killer wants to defend her objective and survivors are too afraid of committing to the gens... you have 4 people for 3 gens, if you start working away at all 3 eventually you will break the 3 gen in in about 5-6 minutes at maximum

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
    edited September 2023
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    That is not what survivor players do. At all. They find the best/safest loops, and they take the killer there… Wasting all the killer’s time. Then everyone escapes. Possibly tbagging or running backwards on the way out the EG.

    There’s little brain use at a safe loop/pallet. Mind games are for structures, and loops that you know are never safe. Where you take the risk of getting hit, or getting rewarded by stunning the killer there.

    One issue I learned is that survivor mains are REALLY entitled. So much so they feel that killers should waste their precious time on them. As eliminating survivors too fast, or too slowly is the problem. They want killers to eliminate survivors at a pace just right. Nurse can potentially do it too fast. Problem. Skull typically does it too slow. Problem.

    Another issue is that killer mains are as toxic as survivors are entitled. They’ll do whatever trick it takes to win. Path of least resistance. Camping, and Tunneling. The issue with Skull is her power conditions the 4k obsessed players to not chase. It is the sweaty/toxic killer meta that makes it this way. Why have fun when you can 3-gen lock all day for a win?

    I’m not like that with her. Lol

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
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    Against Dull Merchant? No doubt they play like this. That's exactly what I do against her as well. Take her to the strongest set up I can and switch loops, when she uses her drones. Otherwise the answer to her is predropping. What else can you do, when the killer permanently moves at a faster speed than normal? The game is not designed around killers suddenly raising their base movement speed. That is why Bloodlust is such a big deal and disappears when the killer breaks a pallet or gets a hit.

    Playing against SM is a slog. No matter her play style. Her power is just not fun to play against. I can play against killers with oppressive anti loop powers. Most of them offer counter play other than Shift + W and predropping every pallet. Nemesis is pretty fun to play against in my opinion. Because you can actually play around his power by using your brain and you end up screwed when the Nemesis plays better. SM cannot mess up because she doesn't do anything even remotely ambitious or skillful.

    This is not an issue of entitlement or toxicity. It's simpley a killer, that is not fun to play against. In any way. I have yet to find a single person that makes an argument on how fun it is to play against her. Legion might be annoying but SM is bot mode for the whole family. It's like watching a movie. Just one that you didn't want to see in the first place. You'd rather do something completely different.

    If I had fun playing SM in any way I probably would play her. I'm one of those people that didn't run Eruption + CoB + Overcharge and camped 3gens every game. Because I hated it! Instead I played like I always do. Chase oriented with focus on the actual fun aspects of chase. Like mind games and jukes. I can't do that with SM. Because survivors cannot play against her in that way. So they of course use a different way to counter her. Do you expect them to just die?

  • ratcoffee
    ratcoffee Member Posts: 1,092
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    Devs have stated that hug tech was not consciously created *but* is currently considered an intended mechanic because it makes gameplay more interesting. It's like CJ techs

    Nothing Skull Merchant does counts as an exploit, she just exists at the intersection of a bunch of individually fair mechanics that taken together, really suck. I think it would be very funny to killswitch her because it would upset some very silly people, but it sets a bad precedent.

    In short, git gud

  • WaveyTrey
    WaveyTrey Member Posts: 643
    edited September 2023
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    What you’re arguing is what survivors do against any competent killer. Take them to strong loops… She simply pressures you from doing that as long as you may have wanted. Which you hate her. I think.

    SM can mess up if she sucks at chases. Which is why players gen lock with her. They suck at chasing competent survivors. So they go to toxic route because they can. Playing against SM is like playing against GF. She can expose you, and make herself undetectable. Which makes you use your brain more. I’ve had players run a good lap while exposed before getting caught as they were confident in their running abilities.

    The ONLY time SM is very strong is when players claw themselves too much, and that’s their fault. YOU give her Haste. The simple trick is simply not hacking her drones, and to face her while exposed. You’re all just too chicken to deal with her when she throws her drone up. So you run away every single time because “Oh no! I’m exposed!”. Exposed/Undetectable doesn’t matter if it happens where it’s safe. I run her like crazy while exposed because I treat her as I would Myers, GF, Starstruck, or MYC.

    People also hate SM because of her tacky design. Which I agree. If it was The Predator (Intended), or more cyborg-like everyone would love this killer. It’s a very personal issue. Is what I noticed.

    I’m going to keep enjoying my Devour Hope + Thrill of the Hunt SM. I can dedicate to good chases all I want without worrying about gens/totems being lost every chase. Get 3-5 stacks, and go to work. More consistently than any killer so far.

    Nothing is more satisfying than to have the most hated killer mori everyone. Seeing them D/C when it happens. Does that make me a terrible person? Perhaps. Haha. Hopefully she does get a Predator skin. I would buy that.

    Post edited by WaveyTrey on
  • pseudechis
    pseudechis Member Posts: 3,903
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    Kill switch exists to remove game breaking bugs in the short term for a fix.

    Its not there to remove stuff people don't like.

  • dbdcolonsteamer
    dbdcolonsteamer Unconfirmed, Member Posts: 15
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    When is SWF killswitched?

  • Xernoton
    Xernoton Member Posts: 5,327
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    I hate her because she reduces both sides to bots. There is no thinking involved for either side. That's what makes her this unfun to verse in chase. And playing as her isn't any better.

    I'm fine with oppressive anti-loop powers as long as both sides have possible skill expressions. Take Blight for example. He is way stronger than SM but he allows both sides to go for skillful plays. That's what SM lacks.

    Play her. I don't care. I just won't be happy, if I have to verse you at some point.