How is the anti-camp mechanic going for everyone?
First impressions.
Comments
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Is it in game now? I played couple games today didn't notice it. 2 on survivor and 1 killer game didn't camp though just chases. If it's on game I have to test it on bubba.
4 -
lol. In all other cases its fine.
24 -
Seems pretty good tbh. Grace period lets you kick a gen and reload at a locker + bar fills slow enough where going back to secure second stage is still viable for killers who want to do that; really seems like the feature has laser focused on forcing baby killers to go out and find another survivor (thus causing them to actually learn & play the full game)
10 -
they fixed most issues, (through floor activation, any killers that require time in the area being screwed by it) so its fine now
unless SWF tries to abuse it cuz they didn’t do anything to stop that, looping on the outskirts of the hooks radius where the survivor is constantly going in and out while the killer chases them allows for their teamate to just self unhook.
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I proxy-camp a bit more respectfully now - like doing a semi-circle instead of crossing the hook directly when I expect a survivor from another direction. No issues so far. Though I'll need to get a feel for how many times I'm allowed to cross the area.
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I played some Survivor games and AFC didn't do anything since none of the Killers facecamped.
Then I played Killer games and AFC didn't do anything since I didn't facecamp.
I did have to proxy camp sometimes and chase survivors around hook but it didn't work against me and AFC didn't trigger.
Maybe it's working as intended and only against legit facecamping... We'll see...🤠
19 -
Already had survivors exploiting it, by running the chase near the hooked guy who was near shack making me think they were looping shack, but then they just run away. So i start trying to mindgame while they aren't there, meanwhile person unhooks themselves.
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Played liked 10+ killer games and it never came into play. Played a bit less as survivor and it triggered once while the other games it was barley a blip on the meter.
The one time it did trigger it was against a Knight who hooked me for the second time close to a three gen. No other survivors were nearby and they kept coming within a couple meters of me while they were patrolling, and they did this like five or so times. On top of that, they stopped to use their guard directly next to me twice. Had they not done that or simply patrolled a little wider I would have died as I had like 5-10 seconds left before death. Ended up escaping the match.
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So you mindgaming yourself is Survivors exploiting it?
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That...honestly sounds more like your fault than anything else. If they tricked you into thinking they're somewhere they're not that's just you
27 -
For the most part fine
Survivors rarely jump off but it does scare the killer enough to keep there distances most of the time. Definitely easier to save in areas with LOS blockers. The survivors can usually sneak around jungle gym type areas and get a easy unhook as the killer respect the 16 meters. For the most part I'm not seeing camping that much unless it basement.
1 -
It works.
If you stay up in their face, they can get off.
Success!
5 -
"Mindgaming myself" I mean, if someone runs to shack and i think they are staying there, is it totally unreasonable for me to attempt a mindgame, quickly realize they left, and then go after them? Has that literally never happened to you in the history of the game ever?
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Yep. But I know that it was my mistake at this point.
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So it's anti-camp and anti-killers who can be tricked? Killers should know better than to go to the place where they think survivors are?
Some would call abusing a game mechanic through trickery to be abusing a game mechanic.
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My point in the post is, this was obviously an unintended use of the mechanic. And as expected survivors are finding ways to exploit it.
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Pretty positive the concept of "Luring a non-camping killer next to the hooked survivor, then mindgame / Loop around the hooked survivor so he gets off the hook for free because the game now thinks hes being camped" falls under *exploiting an unintended flaw in the anti-facecamping mechanic*.
Dont believe it takes PHD in game design to understand that this is problematic, and needs to be ironed out just like inclusion of the grace period + dying / picked up survivors stopping the timer.
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Except the survivor wasn't looping around the hook. They specifically said the survivor left the loop and they didn't know, meaning they were just chasing their own tail around a hook
18 -
Useless. Killers tunnel slower but my teammates like to stop doing gens, stand close enough and prevent the timer, and killer tunnels, which is easy as gens aren’t getting done.
tragic but unsurprising.
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So your mistake is the survivors exploiting? What are they exploiting? Their brain?
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A festival of DCs, suicides and chat toxicity. Thanks to this patch endgame builds are fun again, everyone falling for them again.
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So survivors are abusing something because the killer ######### up?
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You replaced the words "game mechanic" with "something." Does that mean you don't understand the difference or are pretending there is none?
Tricking the killer is fine, tricking the game is an exploit.
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Except no one's tricking the game. The killer is near the hooked survivor. The other survivor is not. As such, the anti-facecamping meter goes up.
Tricking the game would be like the anti-camping mechanic on PTB, where a survivor could lead the killer to the area above the hook, where the anti-camping meter would go up, even though neither the killer or survivor is close to the hooked survivor. That is very different than the killer making a wrong read and staying near the hook even though the survivor left.
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Damn, that's genuinely smart gameplay
19 -
They need to adjust the vertical range for instances like basement camping. Currently there is not enough progress for a first hook unhook.
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This is you:
"That...honestly sounds more like your fault than anything else. If they tricked you into thinking they're somewhere they're not that's just you"
But it's not just him, you said IF THEY tricked you. If they trick the killer, that implies they did it on purpose, by choice.
And the game is being tricked, unless jump-offs when no one's camping is working as intended.
Doesn't really matter who's tricking the game, though, the problem is the game being tricked.
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Hasn't been used yet in games, but had a match in Suffocation Pit and hooked someone in the narrow middle part of map. Had to change angle of approach to reach other side of map when before less time would have been wasted.
Funny now killers have to be the ones afraid of some imaginary bubble around a hooked survivor 😂
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Sounds like you got outplayed.
16 -
It's funny how many more Hags are showing up today.
The anti anti-camp. Hag trapping the hook area to get the trade.
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Sounds like a win to me. I rarely see Hag, so I welcome variety.
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Regardless of the issue of balance, even the man who was Michael's number one for a time said, ``I feel like I'm being forced to do something'' and ``I feel empty inside.''
If that was the aim of this update, where Killers have to empty their brains to match Survivors, it would definitely be a success.
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how long were you mindgaming yourself that self-unhook activated?
you need to be kissing the survivor for 20 seconds to get it to go, and the further you are the slower the charge comes. like if you lost a survivor running around shack I'm almost tempted to assume the survivor got manually unhooked and you missed whoever unhooked them too
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Here is a scenario when the anti-camp mechanic supposed to come into play: When the killer is staying within a certain radius of the hooked survivor WITHOUT a reason
The killer being tricked (which is partially their fault because while the survivors may have been the one to trick them, the killer was the one to fall for it) and staying within this radius chasing their own shadow long enough for a survivor to jump off the hook means they are either chasing a survivor who isn't there around the hook, so they may as well be camping, or they are chasing a survivor who isn't there further out in the radius for an excessive amount of time, either of which the anti-facecamping mechanic needs to trigger because they are staying too close for too long without a reason.
They THINK they have a reason to stay in the area. The game KNOWS they don't. As such, the anti-facecamping meter fills up. The killer screwing up is not the same as the anti-facecamp being tricked, especially when you consider the killer still has to stay there for a good amount of time for the hooked survivor to get a chance to unhook themselves
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If I WAS the game itself, I would be "that was very smart of you tricking killer to mind game themselves like that, here is a free unhook for your teammate, you earned it"
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It's not fun, as if we are forced to play the killer way.
I laughed when the AFC gauge saved about 30% just passing near the hook when the killer was going in the opposite direction.
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I just played a few survivor games and didn't even notice the mechanic. Killers hooked me and left. Same as usual.
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Who says they were tricking the game?
@Reinami 's assertion is that the survivor 'exploited' the system by approaching shack and then leaving. But look at it from the survivor's perspective:
If you approach a hooked survivor, and the killer is headed your way, do you just bumrush the hook, or do you double back and try to lead the killer away from it so someone else can get a safe unhook?
Because to me, it looks like someone chose the latter. And it's Reinami who made assumptions about the survivor's actions and intentions.
And as someone else mentioned: this is not some four, five second deal either. Reinami must've stuck around for a -long- time.
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This is the kind of thing I'm talking about when I say people aren't examining their own game play and just crying for nerfs on the forums.
Voluntarily waste 20-30 seconds of game time? Must be MFT losing you games.
Also strange how the killer has one on hook, and wasn't even in chase, technically, yet didn't have 3 gens completed during that 30 second window either. Reading the forums, gens take 45 seconds, tops, every game.
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Oh, it's very simple, as a survivor all you have to is the following
Step 1: Get the killer to hook someone at shack
Step 2: Get the killers attention in a place that gives you enough distance to get back to the hook with them following you before getting hit.
Step 3: Actually get them to chase you instead of going for gens
Step 4: Hope as you lead them to the hook they don't just proxy camp and wait for you to unhook
Step 5: Once they don't proxy camp, you need to loop them well enough to not get hit but also be out of sight
Step 6: Hope they don't just facecamp the survivor, take the free unhook, but just get in a chase to tunnel that player
Step 7: Get away from the shack - this requires either slow walking or the killer to totally miss the scratch marks on the ground as you run away. Obviously, you can't have been injured at any time during the previous six steps or the killer will notice the blood trail/lack of pain moans.
Step 8: Hope they just stay there long enough confused about how you disappeared instead of thinking maybe they should go after a gen.
Step 9: Enjoy the game winning victory that is achieved by a survivor jumping off the hook and likely being targeted by the killer who is standing right there
Reminder: Do all of the above before a hook stage progresses. Strategy not valid against all killers.
On a more serious note: I suspect there will be survivors who will try this over the next few weeks to just feel out the system/challenge it, and I'm surely inevitably a few will pull it off, but it can't realistically seen to be giving survivors some type of advantage.
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Incentive has only been on Killer when I could play, so I've only been playing Killer so far with 1 Ghosty, 1 Blight, 4 Trapper, and 1 Wraith match. It didn't negatively impact any of my matches. None of the times did I feel like I needed to stay too far away in paranoia, and I won every match (minimum 3k at various gens remaining, 1 Trapper match was 0 gens 3k on Lery's, and 1 Trapper match was 0 gens 3k on Toba's, but the rest had gens remaining). Even the basement Trapper hooks didn't get facecamp unhooked even when grabbing traps around the area and kicking gens/pallets. I even had what appeared to be a SWF intentionally 'swimming' between 2 people I had on hook, but I was able to make use of the grace timers to not be hit by it. (I only call them a likely SWF because they had multiple flashies and grouped up in that way that makes you think they are intentionally trying to save for one another on comms and with locker slow exits. Also I had 2 on hook because of that locker attempt being outplayed by a hit then pickup, then an Agitation hit plus down on an injured greedy Survivor.)
My guess is anyone getting hit by this camped a lot more than they normally would admit to publicly. At this point it kind of is a self-report to crutching on camping before, and not adapting to avoid excessive (face)camping beforehand. There's probably still room for specific problems, but in general it feels like a success so far.
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So the Anti-facecamp mechanic is anti-facecamp and also "Add new mechanic in the game that survivors can use to mindgame" mechanic? I thought it was just to prevent camping, you know given the name, Anti-Facecamp Mechanic.
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I didn't realize it wasn't Anti-facecamp mechanic and it is actually "New mechanic survivors can use to gain an advantage in the match and mindgame the killer"
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I don't remember exactly, maybe 10 seconds tops. At the time i was playing trapper and when i hooked the survivor, i grabbed a couple of traps nearby that area, and kicked a gen. Then the survivor did that and the survivor was able to unhook themselves. So those 2 things combined made it enough time for them to unhook themselves.
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10 seconds is not a long time at shack, where i was playing trapper, placing a trap, and then doing a moonwalk backwards.
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Really not hard to take a Killer into the unhook area, unless Killers must drop chase whenever the magical 16 meter radius is crossed.
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First HaunterofShadows did, then I did. When the game is misunderstanding what's happening, it's being misled. The survivors weren't necessarily the ones that tricked the game, Haunter said "if they did... it's on the killer", and that's what we were arguing about. A hypothetical based on the Anti-camp being wrong, whether is was cool for survivors to cause it.
Ya gotta read the whole thing before you can get into the details, and I think me and Haunter both lost interest once we moved so far from the original point.
My only real concern is that no player should be penalized for something they're not doing. I don't care what mistakes they make, the game shouldn't be interfering unless they're camping.
Once an argument gets long, the context is lost unless you read every single bit, and it wasn't that interesting in the first place, just a couple players arguing over tiny moral issues in a hypothetical situation.
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Needs to be improved. Faster build up to camping. Terror radius needs to be the factor not a fix distance. For Blight Nurse and Wesker its negligable as is now. They swing once away and right back to hook.
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It does basically nothing unless you're one of those guys who literally facecamps. Just as everyone with any common sense predicted. It's not the insanely overpowered gamebreaking change that delusional people claimed it would be. You can still proxy camp which is even stronger. I haven't even seen a single person unhook themselves yet.
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Dude tracking survivors is easy, especially with scratch marks, sound notifications, and blood trails. If you couldn't track them, that's on you.
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