Thoughts on Otz’s Comment on Plague Now Losing Power Through More Stuns
Otz has some decent takes in my opinion but I partially disagree with it.
Even if it’s a bug, Plague losing one of the more stronger states in the game is very much needed and helps deter more problematic playstyles through camping and tunneling. Plague is much healthier with the higher risk/reward and it gives survivors more options to counter act her power.
This brings her closer to a perfect spot.
Comments
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That amount of "bugs" that get left alone for years and years is truly astonishing.
Trying to think if this or blast mine is funnier.
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It just unacceptable that a "bug" gets left in the game for years not acknowledged either and they decide to suddenly fix the bug without notice. By that point it's no longer a bug it's a feature that's within the game and accepted by the player base and when they do decide to finally fix it. It's not a big fix at that point, but it's seen has a nerf to everyone.
Anyone remember when they tried to "bug fix" killers PoV camera to tilt down after a M1 hit. Lot of back lash from that.
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I also disagree with Otz. I don't think it will be that difficult for players to learn stun = lose power, and flashlight saves / sabo wiggles don't contribute so in terms of "bullying" not much will change.
DS deactivating plague's power is good and should stay. If someone tries to use it aggressively and you have your power, they are 99% of the time misplaying and who cares if they try to take hits against red puke. Otz says it will encourage slugging but in reality plague already slugs with the power when able, this will encourage plagues that tunnel off hook to try and use the rest of their power before picking up, which gives survivors a chance to save their teammate and prevent hard tunnels, which is good.
As for head on and blast mine, these perks are bad and not run often. I don't consider it much of an issue that they counter Plague's power, the former allows for more counterplay against the killer and the latter in the current meta only impacts pop. If it encourages killers to not kick gens while they are using their power, so what, they can kick it later. If it wastes their pop, good, pop is strong enough as is and introducing scenarios where it might not be the best pick as well as encouraging survivors to run less popular perks is great.
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As for the "bug" thing, I agree that it seems very possible behavior is/has been disingenuous when labeling things as "bugs" when explaining certain changes. But I prefer to focus on the content that is changing rather than whatever BHVR is classifying it as.
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I agree with a lot of what he said here. For example, this only incentivises more slugging and Pain Res, Deadlock, Grim Embrace etc. because you don't want to risk kicking a gen with a blast mine. It won't make her much weaker but it's one of these nerfs, that are just baffling. Plague has been in this game for almost 5 years and she has received a fair amount of changes and only now have they fixed this "bug"? They never noticed, that she didn't work correctly in 5 years?
This is just like when they changed the killer's hit animation so that they would look down because "they had always intended this". I didn't believe it back then (I mean, just look at Hag's animation and tell me it makes sense for her to look down) and I don't believe it now. Instead of focusing resources on non-issues, can we maybe try to fix what's actually broken? Like the servers, visual bugs with several survivors and killers (skirtless Ada and Nemesis are a thing btw), Knight, Bubba's random tantrum, Balanced Landing, Potential Energy, rubberbanding etc.
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I mean, it's the exact same as the black bubble, and blast mine. For their entire existence, they worked one way. You could see auras through the bubble. Blast mine was refunded if not kicked.
Then, out of the blue, years after the fact, they decided it was a bug. Hell, the bubble was an acknowledged bug for 10 months before they said it wasn't a bug but a bug fix.
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"DS should disable killer's power" has been a popular suggestion to level the playingfield between killers for quite some time. I just don't think anyone considered Plague would be the first one hit, she's not exactly on the level of Blight and Nurse.
I'm not particularly concerned about DS, but I do think that could make Blast Mine a little problematic for Plague players. You now can't take 2 seconds to kick a gen while in power, and with how effective gen kicking is now to gen defence, that's going to significantly affect how people play her.
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His point tho is that this "fix" doesn't really do anything to higher skill plauge players. They already know how to avoid a lot of stuns in the game and this isn't going to affect them at all. What it does do is affect newer players as he said. They took the time to fix this minor bug that honestly didn't really need fixing instead of looking at her more problematic add-ons like her two red ones. Also, I find it more dumb that she was left in a bugged state for FIVE YEARS without anyone knowing. That to me is the big takeaway from this. Makes me wonder what other killers might be technical bug right now
Also remember the post few weeks ago about how devs couldnt make DS affect killers power meanwhile this happens…Yeah I think its silly that they said "Well we can't have DS affect Blight or Nurse's powers" while also making it affect Plauges power a patch later. XD
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I think it's a really unnecessary mechanic for Plague, to be honest. And stuns are way too ping dependent to tie a killer losing their power to them.
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I'm okay with the stun part. I'm not okay with BHVR coming out and saying it was a bug that it didn't happen. It's one of two things. Either a dev made a knee jerk decision to nerf Plague here and label it as a bug, or the devs really don't play their game enough to notice these things. I mean, FIVE YEARS?! And they just get around to patching 'a bug?'
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"It was always intended to be like this"
checks the realese date of Plague
……………………………………………………………………………………………………???
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I could be wrong but didn't Otz have a recent video too saying that DS should disable a killer's power? Or am I misunderstanding maybe?
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For a few seconds only. So I guess he would be okay with Plague not being able to red puke for like 5 seconds after getting DS'd rather than outright lose it.
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Cheers for clarifying. I feel like it'd probably be a bit difficult to code that in, switching off her purge for a few seconds at a time. But then I'm not a developer lol
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I don't know why Otz thinks this change will affect newer players so much.
And this is such a minor "nerf", I really don't think it will make much difference to her performance for most other players either. I'm not a very good Plague, so I'm probably at a much lower MMR than Otz. And from my point of view, it's her ability to keep Survivors injured that makes her strong, not her ability to get ranged downs. She's like Legion in that respect, but with a little bit extra. Her ranged instadown attack is more of a bonus to new players, since it takes a fair amount of practice to be really effective with it.
Besides, weaker teams also cleanse very often. So it won't be such a big deal if you lose your power, since you'll probably have plenty of corrupted fountains around the map to get it back pretty quickly anyway.
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I agree with the newer players part of your message, but not the rest.
Good survivors know how to stay wounded yet safe, so her being able to keep the team injured isn't that strong at higher level. Unless you rock an M1 build, maybe.
At higher level you will not rely on Corrupt Purge for the whole game, but it is part of your kit and needed for pressure/turning things around for you. If you're not able to use half of your power why play her, you know ? And when you're good at Plague, you can get insane shots, which is what makes her fun to play for so many. Like how good Huntresses will go for cross map snipes instead of just zoning.
If survivors didn't have control over her power's triggering condition (they need to cleanse for her to get it), then having DS, Head On, pallets and Blastmine get rid of her power would be okay. Gotta have to try, but a flashlight save might also get rid of it since it counts as a stun (it triggers Parental Guidance and Hubris, for example.)
But that's way too many ways to get rid of her power or deny it. No other killers has that many counters. They even removed the burning mechanic from Wraith, Nurse, Artist's crows and Hag's traps because they didn't like to give extra counters like that, so I find it pretty ridiculous that there are now so many perks that can counter Plague's power and it's "how it should have been" for them…
Plague was in a good spot too: strong but not OP, although her Iri Seal addon was too much.
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I don't really care as much about DS taking it away since it's more avoidable but losing it to Blast Mine/Head On shouldn't be a thing.
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I agree it's unacceptable, but people still play the game, so from BHVR's perspective there's no downside to handling things this way.
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I think it’s an alright change it’s just the way they did it that is strange.
I agree with him that calling this a bug despite being how it functioned for 5 years is ridiculous. If they had instead just come out and said it was on purpose then I don’t think it would be a big deal. Other killers that lose their power when pallet stunned lose it on all other stuns as well (Ghostface and Legion) so if they did this just to make it more universal then I would understand.I do however think he is overreacting to this a bit. It’s no where near as big of a deal as he is making it out to be. It’s rarely ever going to come into play and his logic of this affecting new players more is odd considering that new survivors most likely won’t even have access to DS or Blast Mine so it’s not that big of an issue for them.
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This my gut as well... DS is perhaps fair enough... but Blast Mine taking it is pure BS. Like if it was a flashlight save stun, that would at least makes sense as that takes survivor skill (BGP not withstanding)... but Blast Mine though? Of the 2 that seems a weird buff to give Blast Mine...
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What a strange thing for BHVR to say.
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Five year old "bug" btw :)
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