Will the mori update kill the game?
I have a feeling the mori update will kill the game, because the hatch is not even allow anymore due to the killer not bothering to put the third survivor on the hook and just look for the last person, tunnelling is on the rise like every game now. i don't think this is good for survivors in general. the game is way too killer sided now days please dont mention swf they are irreverent.
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I know you said don't mention swf but from my experience, lower MMR is heavily killer sided as it's got a lot more solo players. Higher MMR with swf players is balanced... Possibly survivor sided but definitely not killer sided
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The mori hasn't changed anything significant in the way killers are playing.
Tunneling, slugging, camping, slugging for the 4k: none of this is new. And if you hear the usual gas-lighters, it has always happened on almost every matches.
The mori is ofter faster than grabbing, hooking and waiting for a sacrifice.
The mori cannot happen if there is another survivor in the match. So the killer has a vested interest to hook, or wait for a minute or so that the last one dies bleeding: not something the vast majority will want to do.
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Even in higher MMR its still killer sided only slightly less then lower brackets. With the numbers BHVR put out and if you believe the numbers haven't changed in the past year comment it still is.
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Not all for me every game sense the mori update the killer dont bother hooking the third person and waste our time so they get their mori kill
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Due to the Killer not bothering to put the third Victim on the hook
The term 'slugging' is common nomenclature for putting a Victim in the "dying state" for an extended amount of time.
Slugging for 4K refers to your described scenario, with the Killer looking for the 4th Victim without hooking 3rd, slugged Victim.
It can occur, but isn't as common as many on this forum makes it sound like. It happened before 4K free mori, and it will happen again even if free mori is removed.
If you do not wish to be slugged, bring the Victim perk "Unbreakable", but don't get yourself up unless it's very end game or the Killer is actually trying to slug for 4K. 😀
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Don't forget the role of the MMR is to push for these numbers. You put a high MMR player with lower MMR ones against a high MMR player and you know how it will end.
It also depend on the killer, perks, addons, tools, playstyle …
It's difficult to say one side is favored at high MMR when you get matches were you know there is nothing you could have done, except being extremely lucky. And I say that for both sides.
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Unbreakable only works once
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The problem, though, is that slugging for the 4k has been a regular complaint from survivors since the hatch rework.
People have been asking BHVR to do something to address it since bleeding out for 4 minutes is not really engaging and barely considered gameplay in an already lost match scenario.
And after years of asking, they make the problem worse by incentivizing slugging for the 4k. "Here, killers now get a free Mori if you do this".
That's completely the wrong direction to be going with this.
And, for the record, I've been pushing for a "bleed out" option for the survivor I've they hit "find help" in this situation. Respect the players time, and doesn't change the match outcome.
But hey, let's just ignore it and make the problem worse is apparently the direction they have already chosen to go in.
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Read what I wrote again.
"but don't get yourself up unless it's very end game or the Killer is actually trying to slug for 4K"
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I remember a time when slugging for the 4k wasn't a thing.
🤔
On second thought, having a hard time remembering when that was.
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Just had a game where some wraith went looking for a dwight on the other side of the map for a mori 4k
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hatch might as well not exist anymore
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I don't think I'm had a game that got to last 2 that didn't have a slug for mori hunt this week, and 70% of those the slug died to bleed out.
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It's supposed to slightly killer sided that's what the devs aim for that's why I said balanced. The map can play a part in making it more survivor sided if it's a survivor sided map but generally it's balanced around swf. Balanced being slightly killer sided.
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No it hasn't changed anything except making sacrificing the last survivor faster and cooler.
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I often do that. I had a match where there I pretty much took out 2 survivors by the time 1 gen was done (they were both trying to go for saves near eachother). I ended up carrying the 3rd survivor around the map to find the 4th. In that situation I won the match hands down so like hell I'm going to allow someone doing nothing to get the hatch.
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The hatch does not result in lost mrr and does not result in a loss, its not fair that you do that.
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The hatch prevents a 4k. That 4k gives a lot more BP than 3k and possibly needed for adept achievements. Hatch results in neutral MMR for the survivor, maybe that's the issue. They are staying neutral in a MMR bracket they don't belong, if they went down then maybe they wouldn't go against brutal killers and they can get gens done so hatch wouldn't matter? Just a theory. But regardless, hiding for the hatch depriving killer of a 4k for the sake of maintaining MMR isn't fair.
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Might as well move hatch then sense all you killers will be doing that either way make us run around with our heads chopped off around the map till you finally catch us.
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It's entirely his decision, who are you to dictate how he wants to play or not? And if we want to get into what's fair, how is it fair that somebody doing nothing gets to escape and get a fat stack of BP for the trouble? Hardly fair.
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So you rather waste all of time where's one is slugged on the ground while the killer is finding the last guy? gotcha i'm almost done quitting the game because of this. so you wont have to worry about me dictating you guys for playing the game properly
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Pretty much what I been saying for a long time. If survivors can't do gens it's time to admit defeat and move on to the next game. Hiding out for the hatch just results in killers doing what I do or potentially dragging it out to server end time where both survivors get sacrificed automatically. No hatch means no reason to hide in 2 v 1 situations and no reason to slug the 3rd survivor to find the 4th.
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Waste time
If I want BP, it isn't a waste of my time. If you think your time is wasted, because you're in the end of a losing match, then perhaps DBD isn't the game for you.
I'm almost done quitting
Don't let the metaphorical door hit you on the way out.
Playing the game properly
Your way of playing is the only proper one, huh? Speak of selfishness.
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I don't see it. The killer did this before.
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I think its way worst sense the update.
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No. You give yourself and your teammate no hope. I've had matches where it was a 3v1 super early, or it was a 2v1 with like 2 gens left, and we got all the gens done. Might not have both escaped, or even one of us, but if the gens get done that means there's a chance. All us killers play to the bitter end as well, because of that chance of winning.
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The Mori update didn't change anything that wasn't already true.
Killers would want the 4K will slug the 3rd survivor to find the last survivor, because gambling over hatch is not worth it. The way hatch works is a problem and needs changes if you want to reduce the need of killers slugging for the 4K.
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You often slug for 4k? I don't even understand how it's fun for the killer to hunt for the fourth survivor in that scenario. And it's almost definitely not fun for the survivor. There's no realistic chance for the fourth survivor to save the game or even have fun in most slug for 4k situations. It's like hunting a completely defenseless animal in an enclosed arena; there's no sport in it. And it makes the endgame pointless and drawn out for the survivors.
Also, the game isn't just killer vs whole survivor team, it's actually killer vs team and killer vs every survivor. If the killer has sacrificed two survivors, that doesn't mean they've sacrificed every survivor in the match. It's actually pretty often the case that one or two people in a team are better loopers or have better game sense than others. The killer can choose to take out the weaker links, but that doesn't mean the remaining players have have been bested by the killer.
Hatch exists for two purposes: (i) to give the last survivor a reasonable chance to escape, both because they may not have been outplayed and because it would be pointless to play the end of the match without it in many cases, and (ii) to prevent the endgame from being a long drawn out forgone conclusion. Both those purposes of hatch are being bypassed when someone slugs for 4k.
Slugging for 4k forces the remaining survivors into a scenario where they have practically no hope of surviving and are forced to endure a hopeless situation for several minutes, even in some cases where they've clearly outplayed the killer. To stay on point with the thread, the finisher mori only encourages that behavior more by giving a reward once the 4k is obtained, regardless of the methods used to get it :(
It's definitely something that should be prevented if BHVR wants to improve the experience for most players.
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What do you mean by 'us killers'? I've heard legends of people who only play one side, but it's very rare to encounter one. Like meeting a llama or Tim Curry. Are you such a creature?
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It's not fun to spend ages hunting for the survivor but it works both ways, if the survivor doesn't find it fun and is helpless then they have the choice to not hide and get the match over with. They actively choose the unfun way of hiding it out for the hatch so I took pick the unfun way of hunting them down to get the 4k. Slugging for the 4k doesn't force them to do anything, they have the choice to come out of hiding if they want to.
Also the purpose of doing gens gets bypassed by survivors that refuse to do gens all match and just want the hatch. So to counter it yes I try avoid hatch from spawning. My point is as it stands the hatch isn't fulfilling it's purpose and encourages killers to slug, encourages survivors to neglect gens, encourages hiding in 2 v 1 situations. Even if mori was removed I think people would still slug the 3rd especially after the 2 v 1 hiding situation has got worse alongside slugging (survivors trying to avoid giving killer the mori)
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I love how we get countless threads by survivor players explaining that slugging has become even more prevalent than before, but in all of them the killer mains who can't be bothered to play survivor to save their ######### lives are like "no it hasn't". If you got a ton of folks saying that something is happening, maybe it's because IT IS happening. You are allowed to believe that slugging is fair and you can disagree with the complaints, but what you cannot do is deny the FACTS, for the love of god. I've almost stopped playing survivor altogether because I'm sick of being slugged every match.
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I'd disagree with this thinking. By slugging for 4k, the killer forces the last survivor into that situation. Without slugging for 4k, the hatch prevents that drawn out hunt since the killer or survivor will find the hatch and either end the match or trigger the endgame collapse. The only way this wouldn't happen is if two survivors are both trying to hide from the killer and not even trying to do gens, which I have seen as killer occasionally. I've never seen this in my survivor matches since I always try to do gens in that scenario.
Agreed about survivors who refuse to do gens for the whole match though. If they're not even trying to do gens and just hiding instead, they doom their team and force the game into a hatch situation. I don't see this sort of thing very often, but occasionally it happens.
Having said all that, I think I responded to a few of your comments now and while I think we have a few opposite opinions, I want to make sure you know I'm not trying to be hostile or undermine your opinions. Just wanting to discuss opposing views :D
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The Mori update literally changes nothing. If they were gonna slug for the 4k for a Mori they would’ve slugged for the 4k without the Mori.
Unbreakable can only be used once but you’ll hardly ever get to use it. 1 in 20 games on average because quite frankly killers don’t really slug that much if we are being honest.
It also makes you recover 30% faster permanently which also counters slugging for the 4k. You can use Buckle Up, WGLF, Boon: Exponential, Tenacity, Flip Flop, Power struggle, Soul Gaurd, For The People. All of which counter slugging in one way or another.
This change will not kill the game at all and seems to be a made up epidemic. I have noticed no increase in slugging at all except for the killer awkward standing on top of me for 15 seconds while they wait for the other survivor to die on hook.
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Could it be that winning is fun? 3k is a win, yes, but 4k is a better win.
That's all the reason you need.
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But even when trying to get a 'better win', it's possible to treat your opponents in a way that you would like to be treated. If you find it fun to be slugged for 4k or to have to be the last survivor standing in a slug for 4k situation, then I'd say it's a solid argument. But I think most people don't like being in that situation.
Personally, I don't mind losing a match as survivor or killer, and have fun even when a killer dominates a match or survivors are super hard to chase and manage to give me a loss. I still get to play the game in those scenarios, build my skill, etc. But slugging for 4k has never been fun for me as survivor, regardless of whether I'm the slug or the last person standing. I still remember the shock from the first time someone slugged me for 4k and to this day find it to be pretty unfair to the last survivor.
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That you'll have to blame how the game is designed. Getting Kills = Wins, you can't blame people for wanting to win more honestly.
I'm always prefer it not to be on kills but on hooks, but it is what it is now.
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Yeah, people will generally want to have what they feel is a good outcome in games.
I think some people would play differently if they saw how their opponents felt in real time. Like would so many survivors teabag or killers tunnel or slug for 4k if they saw how it felt for the other player? But that's an issue in general with online gaming. And I definitely don't think this community is ready for comms or something similar :/
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When I play killer, I always hook the 2nd survivor left. Couldn't care less if I get either a 4k or a 3k and hatch escape. It's a win whatever so let's just get on with the next match. There's absolutely no meaningful prize for getting 4k at all. Not going to hold someone on the ground and waste their time for up to 4 minutes for a few more bloodpoints when I can make those bloodpoints or more anyway in the same amount of time at the start of another game. Dragging out games like this is just so pointless.
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At this point I want them to remove the mori again just to see the meltdown when people realise that killers still slug for the 4k.
This was a thing before the finisher mori and unless they make some drastic changes it will remain a thing.
The killer has no reason to hook the 3rd survivor and risk the other getting hatch. None at all. You don't get more BP (you might actually get less, if that survivor escapes), you don't pip more and if your opponents are dicks, they'll flame you regardless.
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Are people really this disingenuous to the problem with this mechanic, or are most people just so blinded by bias they can't actually understand the nature of the complaints here?
If the devs threw in a tangible, base kit incentive to gen rush, you wouldn't say anything like this, you'd argue that incentivizing and encouraging that behavior is the exact opposite of what the player base has been asking for and not what the game needs.
No one is saying that slugging for the 4k popped up overnight because of this mechanic. I hate using this phrase because it's overdone, but that's the literal definition of a straw man argument.
People have been asking for the devs to address slugging for the 4k constantly since the hatch rework. It's not fun to sit and bleed out on the floor, and it's barely gameplay.
But they didn't rework hatch, or let the survivor bleed out faster (which doesn't change the game outcome, just respects the players time), instead they threw in a base kit mechanic that actively encourage killers to do this more.
That is the main complaint about this mechanic.
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Ok first of all, you don't just make the claim that DbD is killer sided and then say "Don't talk about SWFs" because they're "Irrelevant" and then just leave it there. Why is the game killer sided in your opinion? And then explain why you believe SWFs are irrelevant? SWFs are just good survivors which the game is full of, but they're in the same trial and well coordinated with comms, and last I checked, any good survivor can be well coordinated even in SoloQ and still manage to get a 4 man out. Even if his teammates are bad. And no the Mori update will not "kill" the game. How long have we had the Mori system? Literally since the beginning of the game. And when has BHVR decided to make it base kit for killers? Since like 2 years ago, but the idea never happened because it encouraged slugging, and now it's in the game but you can only Mori the last survivor standing which last I checked, there used to be an offering for but it doesn't exist anymore. And you've been getting Mori'd all the time so the chances of getting Mori'd as the last one standing is not gonna kill you. Like unless you're a sore loser at the game and will DC just before the Mori ends or hook death ends to tell the killer to off themselves or whatever survivors say these days, then the Mori thing will have no change on the game
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They should add a give up option when your slugged at 2 ppl. Just recover a quarter of the bar(to prevent give up spam on ) and if the killer doesn't plan on hooking you, you give up and go to lobby keep your points and move on.
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