http://dbd.game/killswitch
Please Stop Doom Posting about the QOL Changes
Title.
The front page is littered with doom posts. This is what the community asked for, and all we are seeing are a bunch of worry warts posting negative hypotheticals, expecting the worst outcome. Let’s all wait and see what happens first when the changes are made. The devs will adjust the new changes accordingly if need be. Just be patient and give it time.
Comments
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Exactly, it's like people are forgetting that this has to go through testing and THEN a PTB before having a chance of hitting Live. If things go terribly they'll not implement it and take in feedback to make a better system.
We don't even have the specifics at the moment.
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They have implemented other things which were announced and where everyone said that it was terrible.
And honestly, some things they proposed were just not really thought out. E.g. the Anti-Slugging measurements for Phase 1 dont do anything against the core issues with slugging, just make it that the last person can save a lot of time by surrendering, but it neither fixes slugging being too good, Perks still in the game which should not exist like that anymore or that it can be used for griefing.
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I just find it odd that the surrender option will be based on slugged survivors, yet the anti slug mechanic is slated for the second phase. So, in worst case it could be a year in between.
My question (more for the devs than you, tbh) is: why aren't these changes coming at the same time? Can we not give survivors hope that 4 man slugging will get better first, or at least the same time? Are we really looking at possibly a year of slug meta (with phase 1 further incentivizing the "not hooking" meta) before they fix it?
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This isn’t supposed to be the only anti-slugging change. There’s more in phase 2. This is purely just for those games where the killer decides to be an a-hole and slug everyone for 4 minutes and not hook them.
The second phase is slated in the later half of the year. So it won’t be a year in between the two.
They probably aren’t releasing the two together because the anti-slugging measures aren’t finished yet as it’s not something that can easily be fixed with a simple number change or simple tweak. They can’t just instantly make an anti-slugging mechanic to go alongside it. The only options are to release them separately or push the surrender option back. And of the two, I think we got the vastly better option.
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Well, for round one they did get out not just the stick but a barbed stick. And given the rather limited information they provided, I can see where the worry is coming from. If you're a surv who isn't a masochist and/or into being a punching bag this very much reads like "let's force you to stay in a miserable situation - surely a few bp will turn you on and go 'more, gimme more'" (yes, please do read that in that kinda voice).
Is this how it's actually gonna play out? Who knows. There's not enough info to tell; enough to raise concerns, not enough to dispel concerns.
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I'm going by the extremes of their release estimates. Phase 1 could release as early as April, and phase 2 as late as December. That's 8 months.
So, sure, "a year" is a bit hyperbolic, but if they delay phase 2 for any reason it's not that far off either. Especially if they delay "due to feedback", which has already started rolling in.
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Allot of people read the surrender option as the anti slug fix. And then completely forgot the 2nd phase saying anti slug continued. Meaning that isnt all they are doing for it.
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True a delay is possible, but highly unlikely to be 4 months.
And even then, I’d personally rather they spend as much time on it making it actually good rather than rush out a half-baked buggy mess that doesn’t solve anything just so there’s no gap between the two phases. I don’t really see how them not releasing something that isn’t ready is an issue.
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It almost seems like these people are just searching for things they can complain about..
Also.. the surrender option is still very good to have (who likes Games where 4 survs are left on ground to bleed out??) even if it doesnt fix slugging at all - the ‚problem‘ is literally only that it’s listed as part of the anti-slug solution
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They literally end their post asking for our thoughts and feedback. Not wait and see.
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Because the forums would be boring without some good old doomposting, us vs them, "Killer op" "survivor op", and "Armageddon is upon us all"
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I had a lot of misgivings about the anti 3 gen system when they first announced it, but in the end I think it's turned out fine. It's still possible to defend a 3 gen if the Survivors screw up and give you one, you just can't do so forever anymore.
So I'm cautiously optimistic that whatever changes they make they won't be too extreme. But I am curious to see what they have in mind for new anti-tunnel and anti-camping mechanics, since Survivors do already have some partial defences against these strategies but like I said, I guess we'll see.
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People forget all the hypotheticals on Endurance before Inconspicuous came to be or Anti-Face Camp being slowed down when Killer chasing Survivor around Hook. There are probably other hypotheticals that became a balance change.
Plus, welcome to the forums where people are free to discuss.
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The map offering and spawn changes are really nice, and I'm excited about that. I'm tired of being sent to Badham/Ormond/Autohaven/MacMillan/Eyrie/Garden of Joy literally every single game. I can't even remember the last game I played that didn't have a survivor map offering to one of those realms
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I am not speaking for other people, but DBD is my special interest and I care about the game a lot. I had to go to therapy to become less anxious about the things that I care deeply about. Part of me always wonders if those conditions are at play when I see other people behave how I used to before I had treatment. We never know where someone is at in their mental health journey through a computer monitor—but I do know that most people are not directly taught civility or how to trust and place confidence in other people when they show a desire to change. Even though I do agree the posts are annoying, I would rather have these players feel they can express themselves than to keep their thoughts and opinions isolated. The more feedback, the better.
With that said, I still agree with your post and believe that the player base really HAS to understand these people are on payroll. It’s not volunteer work. It’s not a side hobby they “do” for fun. These people want to keep their jobs. They do not want the game to die. If the game dies, the likelihood of their continued employment is not very high. There was a clear communication issue for many years, but after yesterday, hopefully everyone can see they are really trying to do something about it.0 -
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This is what the community asked for
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Wrong, I did not ask for a buff to slugging
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I love the fact BHVR Is focusing on QOL changes and technical debt. Despite what people may believe as stakeholders in a development company …
# TECHNICAL DEBT UPDATES DO HAVE RETURN ON INVESTMENT.
Thinking otherwise is lazy and greedy.
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It what way is this a buff? The survivors must agree to surrender. In which they wouldn't if unbreakable or other perks are still in play. This just skips the 4 minute bm power trip some killers have with it leaving people on the ground for a game that's already effectively over. Like I'd understand more if you said "it doesn't solve the problem" which is true. But it does speed up the floor time for a match already over of the survivors choice. Which killers would just leave everyone on the floor until they died to BM. So not really a buff in any regard.
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What do you mean they must agree to surrender? Like a vote? If the survivor is slugged and they have the option to "surrender", then the killer is encouraged to slug more because the survivors have a "easy way out" of the match if they want to
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And i quote:
Surrender StateThe team has been working on a Surrender feature, which should limit player frustration on both sides. To get it right, we first needed to identify the situations where its use would be most appropriate, leading us to two scenarios:
- All remaining Survivors have been slugged (Survivor)
- All remaining Survivors are bots (Killer)
Once these instances occur, players will be able to use the Surrender option, ending the Trial while retaining the Bloodpoints they’ve earned and escaping the Disconnect Penalty
So eitherway the killers probably going for a 4 slug to win anyway because like others have said and pointed out that's the easiest way to win with no unbreakable. This just means…you win the exact same as current slugging everyone? Because they wouldn't choose to surrender if one of the survivors have unbreakable. So before this. Everyone's slugged with no way to get up and killer wins via bleed out. And after this. Survivors surrender and bleed out because they have no way to get up and and killer wins...huh…what is that?
(Infact the only thing that's getting buffed is people's time so they don't have to sit on the floor for up to 4 minutes)
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They need to get it right and BHVR has shown that if they dedicate time to something, and it turns out terrible like the Twins rework, they will just dump it.
Nobody can afford that happening here, so they need to get it right and I think people here know that.
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I rather wait for 4 minutes than having an entire development team working on stuff to, at the end of day, not change anything at all and even delaying chapters.
Thats why I won't spend my money on this game anymore
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Yeah honestly, this is basically exactly what the community wanted for the longest time, a break from BHVRs cutthroat deadlines and a focus on the years spanning issues this game has had.
As someone who was starting to get really burnt out on the game again after having rejoined here when Singularity was added, while the notion of these ideas getting messed up is scary, it's at least a start that they've become the priority for the devs, and BHVR does have the passion and talent capable of pulling it off.
We'll see how it goes, but after Houndmaster, I'm glad we're putting chapters off for the sake of QoL, and the almost decade of attention I've spent following this title feels kinda validated after seeing the devs aren't just a soulless corporate machine and are willing to put the game before their profit margins.
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There was a thread recently about it - the argument is, by explicitly creating a system where the game can end immediately when all survivors are slugged, it sends the message to killers "you can get a win by slugging all 4 survivors without ever hooking. In fact we want you to do it, we're adding stuff to make that more obviously and immediately a viable win state." Some people fear the change, rather than being an "anti-slug" change, will lead to more slugging. I personally am assuming there will be more changes than just that, but I can see why people think the "anti-slug" changes will have an opposite effect
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I agree. Let's wait and see if they can ACTUALLY fix these recurring bugs/problems. Until I see fixes, I'll continue to think it's just damage control/publicity stunt. They've done it before.
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I just don’t understand how people missed it, like it’s clearly written on the roadmap.
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It won't happen because this community is full of tribalistic entitled cry babies that want to push every balance update toward their side ONLY without taking into account the other side's fun. OOGA BOOGA.
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Facts - I agree 100%
Give BHVR a chance to make things right. <3
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They had too many chances which they failed too hard.
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Sometimes you have to fail 100 times before you get it right. That's part of the learning process.
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Exactly, one thing I learned in school was “the road to success is paved with failure” which is this current situation.
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Although they did not state so explicitly, I imagine the scoring for bleed outs and their effects on MMR etc. will also need to be adjusted.
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Because it makes no sense to buff slugging only to nerf a few months later
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You just hope to see a wonder. Thats called insanity.
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The announced updates are literally so crappy, its actually insane that any "competent" dev team would even suggest them lol It's really like they want this game to die through no player retention and to make the most unfun on rails game they can possibly ever create.
How about they throw up some SWF nerfs into the PTB and actually do something about the balance of this game and where that imbalance stems from. Then they can directly address slugging/camping through real mechanic changes and then I guarantee that SoloQ Survs will stop Dcing every other game or "going next". This wasn't even a real issue until late, but SoloQ Survs have had enough of this ######### and won't tolerate crap matches; when the matches get even worse, people will stop playing and new player retention will continue to drop, all that will be left are sweat Killers and SWF.
All these proposed changes are nerfs to Survs as a whole and increase the difficulty in making the game balanced since there are three sides to this game yet they keep trying to hamfist changes that affect two of those sides completely differently, making a circular balance issue.
Oh well, the quality of the game will continue to drop and the same people will keep defending it lol
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Anything "SWF nerf" is gonna kill the game
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Aren't SWF a minority in comparison to SoloQ players? And why would balance changes targeted at SWF kill the game?
Seems like what's killing the game is pandering to SWF and pretending that everything else is an issue, so much so that BHVR needs to do emergency QoL changes that are just going to make everything worse.
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Something I wonder about the surrender option is if it's going to be a team vote or individual vote and I'd bet an entire dollar it's going to be individual based.
With how they have the killer surrender option as 4 bots, I bet when one person surrenders they will turn into a bot and then if all 4 surrender, the killer has a means to leave the match as well if they so choose.
They'll also want to keep it individual in order to keep one person from holding everyone else up.
This will let people that don't want to stay leave while someone else who has unbreakable or just wants to bleedout, can stay in with the bots.
If this is how it'll work then I'm fine with it since it does require all survivors to be slugged in the first place. Personally, I'd rather have it be individual then team based anyway.
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I haven't seen this kind of outrage at a planned update since 6.1.0, the best patch ever at the time. I think a lot of people need to admit they don't like change, because a lot of these changes are super beneficial and super asked for. I guess because it's too much in too little time? But that's the exact opposite complaint the devs need to be hearing. Before this, we complained that they weren't doing enough, or that they took forever to do it! Some people just don't know what they want.
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I think the majority of the changes will be pretty healthy, there’s always going to be an addendum. Almost of the anti this stuff is going to attempt to bridge solo and swf. Im sure naturally an on slaught of survivor nerfs will follow probably healing, sabo, general hook denial that’s abused. At least I hope that’s the plan looking at the roadmap or my god are we running in circles. They could probably throw some in off the bat in phase 2. I think it’s fair, if you’re trying to deter the worst aspects and encourage spreading hooks(which I as solo would appreciate). I’m a reasonable person. That’s just my hot take I guess?
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I dont see much doom postings, cause this only relates thigns like "patch will kill the game.". Most people explain why those things the devs mentioned wont work they way they think it would. And just be honest to yourself. The devs history of changes that should fix somehting for game health turned out be make things worse or just went the wrong way. Thats a sad fact.
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